After many discussions here on this forum regarding outside air kits I am finally sold. Last night was a our really first cold night here in CT and I am extremely satisfied on the heat output and the comfort of the room temp. The OAK has eliminated all the cool air pockets. So, for all the OAK doubters out there....it does work!!
I'm an OAK believer now!!
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dsnedegar3
Member
I'm planning to have one installed after Jan 1st for the same reason. Is your Oak through the wall? I need to go up through my chimney since I have an insert.
76brian
Feeling the Heat
I think I'll be popping a hole through the wall for the OAK this weekend. I have some drafts in my old house with the stove running that I don't like so much.
whit
Member
I put a 3" diameter outside air duct to my wood stove in the middle of the basement, so as not to cross-draw from the oil furnace, and it pulls in a lot of air sitting by the intake on the back of the old Defiant, despite being about 15 feet of tube. So I see that the concept works.
But when the Santa Fe pellet stove was installed the shop that sold and installed it said they'd seen lots of problems resulting from condensation in conjunction with OAKs, and didn't recommend them. Obviously most folks here find them beneficial on the whole. But I'm wondering if condensation problems from them can also be a serious problem with a pellet stove? Has anyone seen condensation lead to serious trouble?
But when the Santa Fe pellet stove was installed the shop that sold and installed it said they'd seen lots of problems resulting from condensation in conjunction with OAKs, and didn't recommend them. Obviously most folks here find them beneficial on the whole. But I'm wondering if condensation problems from them can also be a serious problem with a pellet stove? Has anyone seen condensation lead to serious trouble?
Lake Girl
Moderator
New to pellet burning but your forum has been a world of education so Thanks!
When the stove was purchased, asked about an OAK and were told we didn't need one... It's going in this weekend!
When the stove was purchased, asked about an OAK and were told we didn't need one... It's going in this weekend!
whit said:
I have a Santa fe and just installed my OAK 2 weeks ago so I can't yet answer your question regarding condensation problems. If you could elaborate about the specifics of the condensation problem....are you talking about condensation forming on the flex duct or condensation affecting the burn pot/combustion process.
I love my OAK and made a huge difference. Just plug it or take it out over the summer. Condensation will build up and cause some surface oxidation. Its just easy to unplug and save the stove just in case.
oldmountvernon said:Quadrafire price 120 for a collar. vent termination cap and 2 zip ties flex pipe not included lol for that price couldnt they give an extra zip tie just in case?
Found mine online. Same kit from dealer. Made by H & H and it was $100 (maybe a little over) it includes everything, including the flex pipe. Does a lot of the Quad stoves (Santa Fe, Castile, Inserts, Etc) not sure if its the same kit. But one would think they would include the flex pipe. Mine came with hose clamps instead of zip ties.
If your pretty handy, you could buy a standard $30 kit and fab your own collar? Knowing what it is now, I could have done it quite easily.
exoilburner
Feeling the Heat
Ditto for my pellet furnace too. Old drafty house. OAK eliminated the cool spots. Don't understand why all the dealers don't recommend them when the manufacturers do.
slls
Minister of Fire
SmokeyTheBear
Minister of Fire
DBCOOPER said:
Yes, any way for moist air to get into the plumbing will allow rust to take place during the off season.
Trickyrick
Feeling the Heat
When I'm done for the year I take a couple or 3 desicant packs that come when things are shipped or I unpack products, and toss them into the ash pan and burn pot. Issue solved.
m159267
Burning Hunk
The OAK on my Harman P38 is only 2' long and does have condensation (and frost) when temps are really cold. I have no problems with the stove. In fact I once wrapped the OAK with insulation and in sub zero temps the stove stopped running (something froze). After removing the insulation and thawing the OAK with an electric heater it fired back up. I simply place a folded washcloth underneath the OAK pipe to catch any drips - not much at all. In summer (after a thorough cleaning) I disconnect the OAK & vent from the stove and slide it slightly forward. I cap the 2 pipes with baggies and rubber bands. I then fill the hopper & stove with desiccant & newspaper.
whit
Member
Since I took the dealer's advice and didn't get the OAK, and since he was doing more of a shaking his head and mumbling "We've had a lot of problems with that ... condensation" than giving specifics, I don't know. What I'd be concerned about isn't the duct itself, but whether it would lead to rust in the back of the stove in the area where it would connect in.gerryger said:
It could be that the dealer just didn't figure they could charge much more for the installation by including an OAK, and only muttered about problems because it wasn't a money-maker to sell me one. But he more gave the impression it led to more warranty service calls, and that that's what he was trying to avoid. I was surprised, since I've always believed in outside air for a fire. He was strongly against it. I assumed he knew something, and it was more problematic for pellet stoves. Maybe not. So I ask if anyone's seen such problems.
Ah, I see Smokey says "Yes, any way for moist air to get into the plumbing will allow rust to take place during the off season." Is it only an off-season concern then? What about when the stove's on a set back thermostat and is mostly off overnight?
gerryger said:
OAKing up my pellet stove was not enough in our house. We really noticed a big increase in comfort after I OAKed up our oil bolier too!! The OAK kit for the Carlin Air Boot is a big 5" diameter honker!!
1st pic is 2" diameter wood pellet stove OAK
2nd pic is 5" Carlin Air Boot pipe!!
My Boiler Analyst recommends 10 feet or so to temper the air into the Carlin Burner to prevent vibration in sub zero weather!
Does'nt everyone have a boiler analyst?? LOL
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SmokeyTheBear
Minister of Fire
whit said:
Moisture is a problem in high humidity situations and in the heating season the air is relatively dry.
whit
Member
Ya know, in my house that's not the case. Not sure what the source is, normal household stuff I guess plus mostly good windows to hold it in, but it runs about 35% continuously through the winter. That's on the high side, considering it can go -15* here some winter nights. That's definitely enough humidity to condense heavily on the few original windows I've got left, which is exactly the kind of warm moist air meets outside cold that an OAK can present.SmokeyTheBear said:
SmokeyTheBear
Minister of Fire
whit said:
The moisture problem has to be inside the stove before you'll see corrosion of the stove. The stuff that will be frozen on the OAK tubing only need a means of collection when it melts or insulation to stop it from forming at all.
I'm more than aware of -15°F night time temperatures. We see them also.
35% isn't really that moist, the recommended indoor relative humidity is in the 50% range.
I find it amazing how many dealers don't recommend an OAK. I think condensation concerns are for the off season. The good thing about the Santa Fe is that on the newer models the OAK gets connected directly to the combustion chamber. Older models had the OAK connected to the rear panel which would allow for moisture exposure on all internal components. Not good. I'll take everyone's advice and just disconnect it during the off season. I didn't have an OAK installed last year and I still got oxidation. I need to close off the exhaust vent too. There is definitely a learning curve to owning a pellet stove. My whole setup is different this year than last year for the better. Even my tstat is improved with swing temperature functionality.
whit
Member
Ya didn't follow the link I gave. This one, which agrees with advice I've found elsewhere. The important measure isn't the relative humidity inside the house, but what the relative humidity would be of the same air if chilled down towards the current outside temperature. They give a nice chart:SmokeyTheBear said:
Code:
Outside Temperature Inside Humidity
20º to 40ºF Not over 40%
10º to 20ºF Not over 35%
0º to 10ºF Not over 30%
-10º to 0ºF Not over 25%
-20º to –10ºF Not over 20%
-20ºF or below Not over 15%In other words, when the inside relative humidity is 35% (as mine is) and the outside temperature is under 10º, a typical house can start to see problems from the dampness in the areas exposed to the inside air that are chilled significantly by the outside temperature, which is what causes the condensation, followed by mold, rot, rust. That said, I think I'm getting away with the 35% relative humidity in the house in winter, since the days at least are usually over 10º. But 35% is on the high side, especially in an older house such as mine.
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