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2-Cycle Oil

Post in 'The Gear' started by Jacktheknife, Dec 17, 2012.

  1. jharkin

    jharkin Minister of Fire

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    I use Penzoil air cooled oil at 32:1 in everything. Its a conservative mix that I know won't damage anything and should keep my engines running a long long time

    Note this is what a lot of ultralight aircraft pilots run.. If they trust their life to it I trust my saw.


    An interesting read on 2 cycle oils... Tested in a different application (r/c engines) Note the particularly poor results of 100:1 amsoil ...
    http://www.geistware.com/rcmodeling/articles/oil_test/index.htm

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  2. Boog

    Boog Minister of Fire

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    MasterMech, that original 031AV mix was stated as "Regular graded gasoline and branded two-stroke engine oil. 1:40 with STIHL two-stroke engine oil; or 1:25 with other branded two-stroke engine oil", direct from my original 35 year old manual ;) Us "old" timers are good for something, I've got 4 of those puppies now!
    MasterMech likes this.
  3. fabsroman

    fabsroman Minister of Fire

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    Yeah, I am too anal. I would be having different mix cans around if equipment called for different ratios. Simple solution, everything right now is Stihl. Stihl saws and trimmer. Going to get a Stihl blower/vac come spring. Between the saws and the trimmer, the mix does not stay around long anymore. Going to get crazy once I get a diesel tractor. Going to have gasoline for the mower, mix for the small equipment, and diesel for the tractor. Hope I pick the right can. lol
  4. TreePointer

    TreePointer Minister of Fire

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    Welcome to my multi-can world. Actually it's not too bad if you follow standard colors:

    red = gasoline
    yellow = diesel
    blue = kerosene
    red w/white stripe (No-Spill brand) = 2-cycle mix 50:1
    white = water or aqueous chemical (labeled and dated)
    MasterMech likes this.
  5. MasterMech

    MasterMech Guest

    Ouch! That's not a cheap jug either. I'd tear it down and see if you can get away with just tossing a new piston in there.
  6. fabsroman

    fabsroman Minister of Fire

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    Yep, that is exactly as it should be. I have the red and blue cans and a couple No-Spill 1 gallon containers. One has 50:1 mix in it and the other has bar oil. Both have been labeled in large letters with a Sharpy.
    TreePointer likes this.
  7. Bigg_Redd

    Bigg_Redd Minister of Fire

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    Yes, and yes. Air cooled two stroke engines are not picky about premix oil.
  8. XJma

    XJma Member

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    I mostly use Stihl 2stroke mix because my FIL has like cases of it that he will never even use. He gets like a 6 or 8 pack every time he goes to the dealer which is like 1/4 mile down the road from his building!!

    I run that and some husky and echo oil at 50/1 with 93 gas and startron stabilizer in my stihl and husky saws as well as echo 2stroke lawn equipment and jiffy ice auger. It all loves it.

    I do, however, also have 2stroke outboards that I run at 50/1, and it is recommended NOT to use outboard (liquid cooled engines, TCW3 spec) 2stroke oil with any air cooled equipment, and vice versa. I don't know what happens if you do, but I'd rather not find out!!

    One caution, if you have your saw/equipment tuned well to run on say 50:1 mix, and decide to throw some 40:1 in there, unless you adjust the jets in the carb, you're going to be running the equipment lean!!! Lean in terms of air/fuel mix, because the oil comes out of the mix in the crankcase after going through the carb and before going up the transfer ports into the cyilnder. If you're running rich as is, it may be fine, but if it's cold out and you're already a little lean, be careful!!! Likewise, if you run 40/1 and go to 50/1, then you will be richening the air/fuel mix, but if your equipment wants more oil in the crankcase, not the greatest idea unless you're using really high quality oils that are designed to run in equipment with less oil, like amsoil.
  9. f3cbboy

    f3cbboy Feeling the Heat

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    Yea it sucked. needed a new short block..i think it was about $250 for parts. hardest part on rebuild was getting bolt that holds fan to the crank.
  10. Bigg_Redd

    Bigg_Redd Minister of Fire

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    I do: nothing. I've only been doing it for 20 years or so, but so far so good.
  11. XJma

    XJma Member

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    Really? Why do many saws warn not to, and all outboards say not to use regular 2stroke, only liquid cooled rated 2stroke?? Everyone you talk to about outboards says not to run regular, will be bad, so I never have.

    Could have used that info last week, dumped remaining 50/1 into the generator, which isn't a 2stroke but it doesn't mind the extra lube.
  12. Bigg_Redd

    Bigg_Redd Minister of Fire

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    90% of all the warnings on premix oil are emissions related, not protection or performance related. I wouldn't use standard premix in an injector, however. Standard premix oil (whether TCW3 or JASO-MA) is too viscus for injector pumps.
  13. kopeck

    kopeck Minister of Fire

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    I think what was said above about the oil being there is key.

    For a very long time my father and I ran Wal-Mart SuperTech 2-stoke oil, 50:1 in premix in EVERYTHING Snowmobiles, boats, chainsaws weed wackers you name, it had it in there.

    We have yet (knock on wood) to burn down anything due to oil. I think a lot of "oil problems" are really just other issues that get blamed on oil. Dirty carbs, bad gas, air leak etc.

    The snowmobiles all had plenty of miles on them (we're a 4-Stroke gang now), the boats still go and the saws still cut. We have moved up to a synthetic since then but still 50:1. Oils today, even the cheap ones are so much better then back in the day. Synthetics are just a step up from that.

    I also think a lot of the ethanol gas issues people have been complaining about have been misplaced too. Not to say I like ethanol, I really don't, but we really haven't changed how we do things and have yet to have any trouble.

    K
    Bigg_Redd and firefighterjake like this.
  14. MasterMech

    MasterMech Guest

    Bingo!


    The problems with modern fuel start when you treat it like wine. Hoarding it and stashing it in the cellar for 20 years ain't going to make it any better. ;)


    Oils rated for water-cooled engines (TCW3 = Two-cycle Water Cooled version 3 of the spec.) are designed for engines that run at cooler temps than air cooled two-cycles. There is a difference in the oils but many apparently handle conditions outside of their specifications. ;)

    TWC3 is not better than an oil rated for air-cooled engines or vice-versa. Ratings on the oil has a little to due with emissions but a lot more to do with the temperatures and loads the engines it was designed to protect will see.
  15. kopeck

    kopeck Minister of Fire

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    Yeah, you're 100% right there. My rule of thumb is the gas is going to sit for more then a few weeks I treat it, other wise I just use it as purchased.

    IMHO this has been the case for a long time, well before ethanol blends started to show up in my part of the world. Gas just doesn't hold up well anymore. My grandfather used to get bulk drops (farm with gas powered tractors), I don't dare keep 10 gallons around for to long these days never mind hundreds of gallons.

    K
  16. XJma

    XJma Member

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    Yeah, that's what I thought. I have had good results with using specified oils in specified equipment. I'll keep it that way!
  17. TMonter

    TMonter Minister of Fire

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    I'd recommend Mobil Racing 2T which I used the last of my stock this year but unfortunately it's no longer available. Really any high quality brand synthetic should be fine at 50:1. I'd even consider Echo or Tanaka's brand oil as both are synthetic blends and good quality.

    Really the big difference in oils generally is best seen when you break an engine down for maintenance or rebuild. BSnelling who does a lot of chainsaws on Arborist site swore by the Racing 2T in the past but I'm not sure what he's been using in the last couple years since it went off the market.

    I'm not sure what I'll use this next season but I'm sure it'll be a name-brand full synthetic.
    Bigg_Redd and TreePointer like this.
  18. nate379

    nate379 Guest

    I'd need to get some diesel cans. I had diesel in a gas can, ended up filling my pressure washer and yard tractor from it. Yeah, gas engines WILL run on diesel, just a real groan to start!
  19. Pallet Pete

    Pallet Pete Guest

    I have 40-1 and 50-1 cans all amzoil I have tried most synthetic and to be honest all others suck in comparison. My saws and other equipment run much cleaner with way less carbon buildup now..

    Pete
    MasterMech likes this.
  20. Jacktheknife

    Jacktheknife Minister of Fire

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    Ok, problem solved-- I hope. I will be getting since use can from my Stihl dealer for a pretty fair price. I am watching for a white and red can to use as chainsaw only until the weedwhacker uses up all the poulan stuff, I which case I will just be able to bring more fuel with me for a big job-- or for when I am partially through a gallon and know it won't be enough.
  21. TMonter

    TMonter Minister of Fire

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    You can do some searching online and buy a decent stock of oil for a good price depending on how fast you go through it.
  22. Jacktheknife

    Jacktheknife Minister of Fire

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    The dealer is selling it for $1.75 a bottle, enough to mix a gallon of 50:1. I haven't been able to match that online.
  23. jharkin

    jharkin Minister of Fire

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    Not true. There is no magic in the crankcase that separates the oil from the fuel, it gets drawn through the cylinder and burns up with the gas - Pull the backplate of an enginre thats run a long time and you will find only a fine mist coating of oil on the crank and bearings. No need to worry about running lean, the 0.5% difference in oil percentage going form 40/1 to50/1 is not something you would ever notice in mixture settings. Now it you make a big change like 32/1 to 60/1 or such, and were already at the limit of lean running, then yeah you might need to re-tune.

    Look at the oil test link I posted above for more info.
  24. Bigg_Redd

    Bigg_Redd Minister of Fire

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    Klotz R50
  25. Como

    Como Minister of Fire

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    I picked up some Stihl synthetic after reading this.

    I also found a seller of straight gas, but closed at the weekend. I think ethanol may have caused my Subaru Robin to run badly, added Seafoam. Now much better.

    I noticed on the UK board that they have access to a product called Aspen, I have a a feeling that a lot of issues can be put down to stale fuel.

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