3 Questions from a Newbie - Radiant heat, Venting, Efficiency

[ricksterpickster]

Hi, I am planning to buy a pellet stove for this season and have talked to a reputable dealer in my area. He gave me some advice that I would like to confirm is good advice.....I appreciate your comments!

1. Radiant heat - The suggestion was that if I like the radiant warmth that you would get from a fireplace or wood stove (which I do) to consider a heavier cast iron type pellet stove instead of a lighter steel stove. He said that in the lighter stove you would get warm air from the output, but not much radiant heat. Is this a valid consideration (and true)?

2. Venting - He suggested that an outside air kit was not that important, and (if I understood him correctly) that the stove would actually burn better when using inside air for combustion. This does not seem to make sense to me, I always understood that burning house air could create drafts (I understand that a pellet stove does not burn as big of a fire as say a fireplace, but wouldn't that theory still hold??) . Also as I continue to make other energy improvements by insulating (making the house tighter) wouldn't an outside air kit make sense?

3. Efficiency - My own question here (nothing to report from my dealer).....is there a standards on measuring efficiency of stoves and is there a source of this information? As I peruse the literature from different manufacturers, this info seems to be inconsistent or absent. Again, is this a major consideration whan making a purchase?

Thanks for any advice, I hope to make my decision within a week or so. Rick

 

[chris288]

I had a 200lb stamped steel stove for 14 years, and now a 375lb cast iron stove for almost 3 weeks. IMO there really isn't much difference in the way the heat is transfered throughout the house, they both operate on sort of heat transfer tubes or accordian style system with a convection blower. The cast iron stove is slightly warmer to the touch than my steel stove was, but because of that has to stick further out into the room, my steel stove had 1" clearences to the corners, this stove requries over 6". I actually think the steel stove did a better job getting the heat to the other side of the house.

some people will swear by outsside air kits and some will say they aren't required, I ran my stove for 14 years without one, running the new stove without one also. We have been tightening up the house with new windows and insulation, so i'm considering one to see if it will cut down on drafts.

Cant really comment on the efficiency question.

 

[Trickyrick]

Hi, I am planning to buy a pellet stove for this season and have talked to a reputable dealer in my area. He gave me some advice that I would like to confirm is good advice.....I appreciate your comments!

1. Radiant heat - The suggestion was that if I like the radiant warmth that you would get from a fireplace or wood stove (which I do) to consider a heavier cast iron type pellet stove instead of a lighter steel stove. He said that in the lighter stove you would get warm air from the output, but not much radiant heat. Is this a valid consideration (and true)?

2. Venting - He suggested that an outside air kit was not that important, and (if I understood him correctly) that the stove would actually burn better when using inside air for combustion. This does not seem to make sense to me, I always understood that burning house air could create drafts (I understand that a pellet stove does not burn as big of a fire as say a fireplace, but wouldn't that theory still hold??) . Also as I continue to make other energy improvements by insulating (making the house tighter) wouldn't an outside air kit make sense?

3. Efficiency - My own question here (nothing to report from my dealer).....is there a standards on measuring efficiency of stoves and is there a source of this information? As I peruse the literature from different manufacturers, this info seems to be inconsistent or absent. Again, is this a major consideration whan making a purchase?

Thanks for any advice, I hope to make my decision within a week or so. Rick

From one Rick to another:

1 These are NOT radiant heat sources and should not be expected to act like one. If your stove is heating up the steel to a temp that is can be a significant radiant heat source then you are loosing efficiency. Convection if always the most efficient method of heating.

2 I respectfully disagree on the OAK. If you are using inside air to feed the fire then you are also sending that air out through the vent. Now either new air comes back in the house or you have a vacuum in your home and will die from decompression. Since there are people still alive without using an OAK then the new air is comming in from outside. Now outside air is cold or you woudln't have your stove on. So you must spend BTUs to heat that air to a comfortable temp. If your stove is pushing out 10 cf/m then your house is leaking in 10 cubic feet per minute. Even is I do not get perfect combustion out of using the OAK it is still more efficient than me re-heating 100% of my house air every 26 hours.

3 Eff is related to stove cleanliness and layout of your home. Every home is different but modern stove are 65 to 75% efficient perhaps a little more but do not expect 90%

 

[ricksterpickster]

Chris and Rick, Thanks for the comments so quickly! I will take that into consideration. Although you both commented about the same on the steel vs cast iron (radiant heat), it looks like you both went to cast iron stoves, if not for the heat transfer, what is the main reason to consider steel vs cast iron? Is this personal preference or something else? Thanks, Rick

 

[richkorn]

I can only give my opinion on #1. I have a 390 pound cast iron Lopi Leyden and when it's cranking constantly during the cold winter you better not touch the front or side cast panels or you are going to get burnt. It radiates heat.

 

[Trickyrick]

Chris and Rick, Thanks for the comments so quickly! I will take that into consideration. Although you both commented about the same on the steel vs cast iron (radiant heat), it looks like you both went to cast iron stoves, if not for the heat transfer, what is the main reason to consider steel vs cast iron? Is this personal preference or something else? Thanks, Rick

My reasoning for my choice was very very simple. My wife is an architect and as such everything needs to be pretty along with functional and asthetically we like the cast iron look. I'm an engineer and and for me it needs to work.... This gives both and and just cost more up front.

So She decides I do.

 

[chris288]

Chris and Rick, Thanks for the comments so quickly! I will take that into consideration. Although you both commented about the same on the steel vs cast iron (radiant heat), it looks like you both went to cast iron stoves, if not for the heat transfer, what is the main reason to consider steel vs cast iron? Is this personal preference or something else? Thanks, Rick

My reasoning for my choice was very very simple. My wife is an architect and as such everything needs to be pretty along with functional and asthetically we like the cast iron look. I'm an engineer and and for me it needs to work.... This gives both and and just cost more up front.

So She decides I do.

OH MY GOD ! My wife is a wanna be interior designer and i'm a mechanical engineer, I wanted the Harman Accentra for its functionality, cheaper price, and .7 LB / hr burn rate, I knew it was FUGLY, but she wanted the XXV because it was " PRETTY " and went with the " DECOR " I gotta admit, glad we didn't get the, as my wife called it a " childs coffin " Accentra and went with the XXV in Majolica Brown Enamel, awesome stove.. we love it..

P.S. I also liked the stamped steel Harman Advance and would have had no problem with either, but we have a salt water fish tank and the evaporation rusted our 14 year old stamped steel stove, hoping the cast iron one holds up a bit better.

 

[Trickyrick]

Chris and Rick, Thanks for the comments so quickly! I will take that into consideration. Although you both commented about the same on the steel vs cast iron (radiant heat), it looks like you both went to cast iron stoves, if not for the heat transfer, what is the main reason to consider steel vs cast iron? Is this personal preference or something else? Thanks, Rick

My reasoning for my choice was very very simple. My wife is an architect and as such everything needs to be pretty along with functional and asthetically we like the cast iron look. I'm an engineer and and for me it needs to work.... This gives both and and just cost more up front.

So She decides I do.

OH MY GOD ! My wife is a wanna be interior designer and i'm a mechanical engineer, I wanted the Harman Accentra for its functionality, cheaper price, and .7 LB / hr burn rate, I knew it was FUGLY, but she wanted the XXV because it was " PRETTY " and went with the " DECOR " I gotta admit, glad we didn't get the, as my wife called it a " childs coffin " Accentra and went with the XXV in Majolica Brown Enamel, awesome stove.. we love it..

P.S. I also liked the stamped steel Harman Advance and would have had no problem with either, but we have a salt water fish tank and the evaporation rusted our 14 year old stamped steel stove, hoping the cast iron one holds up a bit better.

See this is how things happen. One thing I can say, the XXV is a nicer looking stove than the accentra FS but I had to do the insert for space and I wouldn't have it any other way. I was looking at 3 inserts and she picked this one... She is HAPPY and she is VERY WARM and I'm saving between 600 and 1200 a year in heating.

 

[chris288]

Harman Accentra Free standing and Harman Accentra insert are totally different animals. Don't want you to think I was bashing your stove. My first choice was the Accentra.

 

[Trickyrick]

Harman Accentra Free standing and Harman Accentra insert are totally different animals. Don't want you to think I was bashing your stove. My first choice was the Accentra.

I understand.

 

[captkirk5858]

also understand that the Cast Iron Models are WAY Heavier than their steel brothers. I didn't think we were going to get our new stove in the house.

 

[ricksterpickster]

Ha, My wife likes a more modern look, so the Harman she picked was the Advance. Now having said that, we also like the look of the Quadra Fire Classic Bay 1200 which is less expensive but steel vs cast or stamped. It seems that the Harman may be easier to clean and it's a bottom feed and the Classic Bay is top, what I read has favored bottom feed....but I have a friend with an Enviro that he says is a top feed and he said he doesn't have trouble with clinkers............man there's so many things to consider!

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Ha, My wife likes a more modern look, so the Harman she picked was the Advance. Now having said that, we also like the look of the Quadra Fire Classic Bay 1200 which is less expensive but steel vs cast or stamped. It seems that the Harman may be easier to clean and it's a bottom feed and the Classic Bay is top, what I read has favored bottom feed....but I have a friend with an Enviro that he says is a top feed and he said he doesn't have trouble with clinkers............man there's so many things to consider!

Most issues with pellet stoves comes down to, once properly set up, they need to be kept clean.

 

[ricksterpickster]

Thanks all for the advice! Rick