A burn time / ember question

[AngusMac]

We are looking at a new stove and have narrowed it down to a Jotul or Morso.
I know most of you on here are from North America and you have a differant stove market from Europe.

One factor that is important to us is not so much the burn time but are there enough embers in the stove for it to re-light the next morning without re-kindling?

We are looking at the Jotul 274 or the Morso 8140.

Does anyone have any experiance with or heard anything about these stoves, if so can you let me know!

Thanks,
Angus

 

[Todd]

Those two stoves look pretty small and would be pretty hard press to get an overnight burn. Most people on this site have found non cat stoves in the 2 cu ft fire box or larger size will give you those overnighters of 8+ hours.

 

[AngusMac]

Hello Todd.
We currently have a Jotul 602 with a much smaller firebox than these 2 and every morning there are always enough embers to start the fire without rekindling.

 

[Todd]

Well that Jotul 602 is tiny and Jotul's web site states only a 5 hour burn time. You must be doing everything right to get an overnight burn out of her, good for you. If the other stoves are larger chances are you should get a little longer burn than your current stove. I don't think they sell that Jotul 274 over here or even that Morso. A member here, "Wendell"Has a Morso 3450, maybe you can PM him and pick his brain some?

 

[wendell]

I thought you decided on the Jotul after your tour.

I have enough coals left in the morning to get a fire going and that is with a 1 cu ft firebox.

 

[oldspark]

I thought you decided on the Jotul after your tour.

I have enough coals left in the morning to get a fire going and that is with a 1 cu ft firebox.

You must have some pretty good wood for that, what are you using?

 

[begreen]

Hello Todd.
We currently have a Jotul 602 with a much smaller firebox than these 2 and every morning there are always enough embers to start the fire without rekindling.

You're a better man with the 602 than I Angus. We never had that magic, though we're burning softwood. 5 hrs was often the max. for us. And that is just a few coals left over.

 

[wendell]

You must have some pretty good wood for that, what are you using?

Mostly elm. For the overnight I always try to use unsplit, "petrified", bark off rounds that have been standing dead for many years, about 6"+ diameter. In my view, the most under rated firewood there is.

 

[AngusMac]

BeGreen, Wendell, thanks for pointing this out.
We have Elm which is a hardwood and as Oldspark has said, it is the most underated firewood, I think it is ideal for stoves.

Our 602 never fails to relight in the morning, most mornings there is just a few coals, that looking barely alive, but I just rake it and stick a stick of elm on and it goes everytime!

Your right that I had decided on the Jotul, but I just want to make sure that I get the right tool. I appreciated the time Jotul took to show me their factory and showroom.
I m 90% sure it will be the Jotul, but I will look at both very closely when I go to the show room, which is 2 hours drive away, so its a family day out !

 

[oldspark]

Wendell made the comment about the elm being under rated, but I agree with him, back when I first started burning I could stuff large rounds that just barely fit into my wood burner on a few coals and it would start and burn all day when I was at work.

 

[roddy]

i have a 602 as well,it heats my 1000 sft main floor like a dream....very often i have coals after seven hours at night...i,m surprised other people have ,nt had the same experiences....

rod

 

[AngusMac]

i have a 602 as well,it heats my 1000 sft main floor like a dream....very often i have coals after seven hours at night...i,m surprised other people have ,nt had the same experiences....

rod

Yeah Roddy, I have the same experiance as you with the 602.
Only problem we have is that we have cool summers where we still need a stove at night, and in the winter the 602 is not enough to heat our 950 sq ft room, so we swap out out for a black bear 118, which is usually to hot for the room, except for late December to February.
So now I look for a meduim sized stove that will not need swapped.
The 602 is going to a cabin I am building in the garden and we are selling the black bear.That still leaves us with one black bear in a downstairs room which amazingly heats the whole of the rest of the house with ease, except in the coldest of winter days.

 

[Todd]

The 118 is too much? Seems like it would be about right for those cool summer nights if you just filled it up with half loads? What about a good soapstone stove? The Palladian may be the ticket, low slow catalytic burn.

http://www.altechfireplaces.com/

 

[AngusMac]

The 118 is too much? Seems like it would be about right for those cool summer nights if you just filled it up with half loads? What about a good soapstone stove? The Palladian may be the ticket, low slow catalytic burn.

http://www.altechfireplaces.com/

Hi Todd,
I dont think the Palladian is available on the European market, but I want to stick with Jotul (or maybe Morso).
Its sometimes difficult to get what is just right and I think Jotul has a great range of larger and smaller stoves, but not so much choice in the meduim size.

 

[begreen]

I'm suspecting the new stove is not going to be any more wide range in temperature. You need to get the stove up to a reasonable heat for clean burning. Have you tried burning smaller, not overnight, fires in the 118 during those cool nights? Would burning briquettes for a slower released heat be an option in the summer?

 

[AngusMac]

I'm suspecting the new stove is not going to be any more wide range in temperature. You need to get the stove up to a reasonable heat for clean burning. Have you tried burning smaller, not overnight, fires in the 118 during those cool nights? Would burning briquettes for a slower released heat be an option in the summer?

Hello BeGreen
You are correct, and I always try to have the stove at maximum efficiency, ie clenburning and I am successful at it (my wife isnt, if she looks after the stove for anytime the glass gets dirty !!)
The 602 used like this is excellant in spring summer and autumn, but just no where able to heat us in the winter.
The 118 we use for the rest of the house is ideal and does a great job of heating the whole place.
It cannot reach our living room (which is a recent extention) so we have the other 118 in winter, from October to March, but this one is far too hot if used efficiently, so I would like to get something inbetween these 2.
We only use dead Elm which I cut from our wood, I replant with Birches and Beeches.
Need the 118 on mostly overnight when the temperature is down lower.

I wish Jotul would make a mini bear, or bear cub or a bigger 602 !!

 

[Todd]

I'm suspecting the new stove is not going to be any more wide range in temperature. You need to get the stove up to a reasonable heat for clean burning. Have you tried burning smaller, not overnight, fires in the 118 during those cool nights? Would burning briquettes for a slower released heat be an option in the summer?

Hello BeGreen
You are correct, and I always try to have the stove at maximum efficiency, ie clenburning and I am successful at it (my wife isnt, if she looks after the stove for anytime the glass gets dirty !!)
The 602 used like this is excellant in spring summer and autumn, but just no where able to heat us in the winter.
The 118 we use for the rest of the house is ideal and does a great job of heating the whole place.
It cannot reach our living room (which is a recent extention) so we have the other 118 in winter, from October to March, but this one is far too hot if used efficiently, so I would like to get something inbetween these 2.
We only use dead Elm which I cut from our wood, I replant with Birches and Beeches.
Need the 118 on mostly overnight when the temperature is down lower.

I wish Jotul would make a mini bear, or bear cub or a bigger 602 !!

That's where a cat stove rocks. They can be turned down more than a non cat for an efficient clean low BTU burn. Too bad Jotul did away with the cats.

 

[begreen]

I'm suspecting the new stove is not going to be any more wide range in temperature. You need to get the stove up to a reasonable heat for clean burning. Have you tried burning smaller, not overnight, fires in the 118 during those cool nights? Would burning briquettes for a slower released heat be an option in the summer?

Hello BeGreen
You are correct, and I always try to have the stove at maximum efficiency, ie clenburning and I am successful at it (my wife isnt, if she looks after the stove for anytime the glass gets dirty !!)
The 602 used like this is excellant in spring summer and autumn, but just no where able to heat us in the winter.
The 118 we use for the rest of the house is ideal and does a great job of heating the whole place.
It cannot reach our living room (which is a recent extention) so we have the other 118 in winter, from October to March, but this one is far too hot if used efficiently, so I would like to get something inbetween these 2.
We only use dead Elm which I cut from our wood, I replant with Birches and Beeches.
Need the 118 on mostly overnight when the temperature is down lower.

I wish Jotul would make a mini bear, or bear cub or a bigger 602 !!

Maybe an F3CB?

 

[AngusMac]

Maybe an F3CB?

I have a friend with one and I m not too keen on the looks of this stove, are they good performing stoves ?

 

[begreen]

It's a decent performer. Burn times are about the same, but cleaner than the old stoves. But if you prefer the contemporary look, it's probably not for you. A slightly large stove is the Morso 2110. I put one in for a friend a couple years ago. It has performed very well for them. I am not fond of the removable door handle, but they don't mind it. The stove works very well other than that minor detail.

 

[AngusMac]

It's a decent performer. Burn times are about the same, but cleaner than the old stoves. But if you prefer the contemporary look, it's probably not for you. A slightly large stove is the Morso 2110. I put one in for a friend a couple years ago. It has performed very well for them. I am not fond of the removable door handle, but they don't mind it. The stove works very well other than that minor detail.

Hi BeGreen, I dont like the Morso 2110 style either, it just a bit too middle ages, I dont mind the removablke handle tho.

Have you ever seen a Jotul f250 ? We are also thinking about one of them, I dont know if you get them in the States?
So we have shortlisted it to 3 stoves
Jotul f250
Jotul f274
Morso 8142

 

[begreen]

Unfortunately the only F250 we see on this side of the pond is a Ford truck. But I did look at it on the Jotul UK website when you started this thread and like it. Does it have a deeper firebox than the F274?

 

[AngusMac]

Unfortunately the only F250 we see on this side of the pond is a Ford truck. But I did look at it on the Jotul UK website when you started this thread and like it. Does it have a deeper firebox than the F274?

I think it has a simmilar sized firebox, tho maybe not so high.
My brothers wife says it looks like a SpaceHelmet, but my wife likes it.
I think it weighs in at about 104 kg, pretty modest by Jotuls standards, I have read some reviews about it and it comes out very well, and read that it always has enough embers in the morning to re-light.

This is a cleanburn, but dates from the earlier cleanburn period which means they class it as an intermittant burner and it will therefore keep burning a bit longer, the latest cleanburns which mostly seem to draw air from tubes all the way up the back of the stove (to pre heat it) seem to have quicker burn times, I suppose this is to keep the stove burning hotter and cleaner?
So, I m working at sea just now, half way between Scotland and Norway, but plan to take a trip to our nearest supplier of Jotuls and Morsos when I get home.

 

[AngusMac]

Well thats my f118 sold on ebay, I got a good price for it.
We still have our other f118 heating the rest of the house.

Now we are thinking about what we should buy before October, when the temperature merits the new stove.

I was looking at the Jotul 250 aswell as the 274 and Morso 8142.

I contacted both Jotul and Morso to aks the question, about the models I m interested in, and whether they usualy have enough coals the next day to re-light.
Jotul seemed more positive than Morso.
Here are their replies;
Jotul;
Good afternoon.

I am afraid that I cannot guarantee that the Jotul 270 stove will stay in overnight, due to the clean-burn combustion technology within the firebox.
This technology allows a permanently open supply of air to be drawn in above the fire, which mixes with the gases the fuel gives off to combust these gases, leading to increased efficiency and cleaner chimneys.

I do have anecdotal references from customers that tell me about their clean-burn stoves (various models) staying in for 24 hours without the need for refuelling, but as the performance is very much dependant on flue condition and position, along with fuel quality, this cannot be guaranteed.

I believe that the Morso also has a similar system in place, but please confirm this with them?


Morso:
Dear Angus

You email has been forwarded to me for reply

It is unlikely there would be sufficient ember in the 8140 stove in the morning to establish a fire without paper and kinderling.
We do not actually recommend any Morsø stove is used for overnight burning. When a solid fuel stove is left idling in this way with minimal air supply secondary combustion of smoke and gases are reduced resulting in discolouration of the glass and cooler flue gas temperature. The reduction of the flue gas temperature will tend to produce condensation in the flue system, this moisture sometime referred to as tarring or creosote can potently create a flue fire. This is really is the case for all modern high efficiency clean burning stoves.


Kindest regards

 

[roddy]

so,morso is only good till bed time...shucks,i really like the look of their modern stoves, rounded doors and all...