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Added a baffle to Grandma Bear Fisher Stove (updated with 2ndary burn idea)

Post in 'Classic Wood Stove Forums (prior to approx. 1993)' started by pen, Dec 19, 2008.

  1. ScottF

    ScottF New Member

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    Great thread, I have read it with great interest. I have an antique stove similar to Peter Bs that we use to heat the entire house and we only heat with wood. I would like to add to Peter B,s request for a section of the forum set aside for antique stove modifications. I would love to see a proven plan for modifying an old cylindrical parlor stove. thanks for all the good information.

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  2. Redox

    Redox Minister of Fire

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    Know what you mean! I gave away my old Fisher and now I'm wondering if I can get it back.

    I THOUGHT I heard some secondary air tubes rattling around out there in this thread!

    Chris
  3. WES999

    WES999 Minister of Fire

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    It is hard to see in the drawings. Check out this thread, near the bottom, there is a pic and a description of the secondary air intake.
    http://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/17993/
  4. Peter B.

    Peter B. Feeling the Heat

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    ScottF wrote:

    >I would like to add to Peter B,s request for a section of the forum set
    >aside for antique stove modifications.

    --

    I've now posted a suggestion for similar to (where else) 'The Suggestion Box' titled "Pre-EPA 'Room' ?"

    http://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewforum/8/

    Pile on if any of you would like to see a separate forum section for this kind of topic.

    Peter B.

    -----
  5. ScottF

    ScottF New Member

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    Thanks Peter. I piled on.
  6. brooktrout

    brooktrout New Member

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    I voiced my support as well. Let's hope Craig follows through. There are thousands of "classics" still burning out there. We deserve a voice!
  7. crazy_dan

    crazy_dan New Member

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    Is your stove cast or plate steel?
    If it is plate I would just cut a hole in the bottom in the rear of the fire box and notch out the fire brick and run my pipe/ secondary air supply up from the bottom of the stove and it would get heated in the fire box as a bonus. that is how PE does it anyway and it works great on my summit. if it is cast it can still be done done but needs a much higher level of welding experience than most novices have. I don't know that I would go adding anything to the flew as it would decrease the area of the flue and could affect the drafting of your stove IE like putting it to a 6" flue instead of a 8".

    looks like you did a great job. congrats
  8. mellow

    mellow Resident Stove Connoisseur

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    How much $$ do you have into converting your lopi to secondary?

    Also, you kept the steel for the sides where the tubes mount into instead of going to stainless for them as well?

    I was trying to figure out how hard it would be to weld stainless to the steel.
  9. hydrology_joe

    hydrology_joe New Member

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    I am planning to attempt this modification on my Fisher next summer and am looking to begin collecting parts now. Any ideas where to obtain some of those 5pt star dampers? (other than hacking them off another stove)
  10. pen

    pen There are some who call me...mod. Staff Member

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    For those of you interested........

    Been 4 weeks burning the stove with the baffle installed.

    The results as far as additional heat output, extended burn time, and overall being more controllable, and using less wood have been outstanding. I have seen improvement in every way possible.

    So far that baffle seems to be holding up to the stresses of living inside the firebox. No wear is visible.

    The last item to determine would be the cleanliness of my chimney.

    Being that I have a short to medium height and exterior brick / terracotta lined chimney, I decide that it is best that I clean it every 4 weeks (the old standard for my smoke dragon era stove and chimney). I burn appropriately seasoned beech, hard maple, cherry and ash.

    Stove burns nearly 24/7. Some days it is a near cold start when getting home from work.

    After burning this month I have essentially the same build up as I always do. About 1 quart of the medium flaky, dusty, med - dark colored, typical creosote for my style of chimney.

    With that said, the baffle is staying in the stove. Using the stove the past month has been more enjoyable than ever due to the increased predictability of the stove. I no longer am using my chimney damper and find very little difference in the quality of the burn because of varied weather and/or temperature. This was not the case before. Previously, the stove could be a little bit surprising at times in its reactions to adjustments and loading. That is not the case now.

    Life is about as good as it gets for one of these old girls (shy of adding secondaries that is).

    Because of the chimney being about as clean as normal, I am not going to mess around with adding secondaries at this time. Perhaps this summer when the stove isn't in daily use I'll get the itch to mess with it.

    I wouldn't want to put the old girl up against many of your new stoves in terms of efficiency, but I can guarantee that this baffle has greatly increased the amount of usable heat that the stove produces per load.

    Thanks again to everyone for their support and suggestions.

    Happy burning,

    pen
  11. jacksnipe

    jacksnipe Member

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    This is great news to hear that the baffle is working better than anticipated, I have been waiting for a report on your burning with the new modifications in place. Since you report that the stoves runs hotter & longer with less wood, are you finding that you can decrease the amount of primary air also & still maintain decent stove top temps especially during these extreme temps we are facing now. I'm curious at what your primary setting is during the day while your away..
    I can't wait for spring to arrive, so I can get started on our unit, I'm thinking along the lines of using the high temp ceramic fiber board instead of a firebrick baffle. It would seem easier to remove before the chimney needed to be cleaned,
  12. pen

    pen There are some who call me...mod. Staff Member

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    Surprisingly, the settings of my dampers are the same as they were before. What I am finding is that the only difference is that it stays hotter, longer.

    Here is my strategy.

    My "max" heat setting for a high burn is when I set my drafts at 1 1/4 turn open each.

    For a normal "I am home and it's chilly out" burn, I open the drafts 1 turn each. This usually results in about a 6 hour burn using hardwoods.

    For overnight I close it no more than 3/4 of a turn open on each. This will let me go up to about 9 hours while leaving me ample coals to restart from using standard sized splits.

    These obviously are dependent upon the force of my chimney draft, how tight my basement is, the type of wood I am burning, the size of my splits, etc, etc. Most anyone else in the universe's results will vary ;)

    It was extremely cold the other night (I wish I had borrowed my buddies infrared temp gun) and i wanted to get a maximum setting idea to give to the Mrs. (I have a thermometer on the slanted step between the lower and upper shelf's of the stove and another on the single wall stove pipe). The lady likes numbers to work with (and I am a bit of a geek as well).

    I found that at 1 and 1/2 turns open on each draft I could reach about 650 degrees on the thermometer as measured right of center on this slanted step portion. (not the hottest part of the stove but is the most convenient location. I am going for consistency here, not a max stove-top temp) At this temp, I began to get a very dull "red glow" in an area about the size of 2 packs of cigarettes on the back of the stove. This could only be seen with all the lights turned off and eyes given a minute or two to adjust. When looking at the stove with nearly 30 years of burning on her, this is apparently the traditional hot spot as is evidenced by an ever so slight "bow" outward and a lighter color than the rest of the stove.

    Also, with the thermometer here, I can reload perfectly every time when the temp gets down to about 175. At that temp, I have just enough coals to relight things without using kindling.

    Nothing like being an analytical dweeb :) I like measurements. Does that make me a bad person?

    pen
  13. jacksnipe

    jacksnipe Member

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    Your draft setting are idenical to mine, both 3/4 open for cool ( 20 - 30 degree ) weather for overnight burning & 1 - 1 1/2 Open for daytime running at 650 stove top temp. I have never witnessed a dull glow on any part of the stove however, but I'm thinking now that installing a new baffle may change some temps inside the firebox. I have found that running the drafts at 3/4 open that I can achieve 8 - 9 hours but the stove has cooled off way to much for my liking. If I run it at 1 1/4 open it will run 6 - 7 hours & be at 350 stove temp at the end of this time. If I could manage to get this unit to run 400 stove top for 7 hours that would be like a winnning lottery ticket
  14. pen

    pen There are some who call me...mod. Staff Member

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    I would still like to know why some of these stoves and inserts came with a smoke shelf and others did not.


    pen
  15. jacksnipe

    jacksnipe Member

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    Good question, I've seen the stoves both ways , with & without the steel plate smoke shelf baffle. But I have yet to see the insert model with any type of baffle shelf, probably because they incorporated the damper plate at the flue opening ? Now the Honey Bear model with the beautiful glass doors may have something installed that I haven't been notified about..
  16. pen

    pen There are some who call me...mod. Staff Member

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    yamaha_gurl has the honey bear and says she has a smoke shelf.

    When seeing them in the past, I really hadn't paid too close attention. If i remember correctly, they were pretty much entirely contained in the upper shelf of the stove correct?

    I asked yamaha_gurl for a pic of hers but she might not have seen the request or might not be able to.

    I am curious to get the standard dimensions from the manufacturer for what they used and what was UL approved (for some of the later models).

    Mine unfortunately is not UL approved. This actually works out to my advantage however for modification. I had to search for a homeowners insurance company that would allow me having a non-UL stove.

    pen
  17. Yamaha_gurl

    Yamaha_gurl New Member

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    You can just see it, hope I didn't burn my camera lens!

    [​IMG]
  18. pen

    pen There are some who call me...mod. Staff Member

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    :) Outstanding!
  19. Yamaha_gurl

    Yamaha_gurl New Member

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    And one more:

    [​IMG]

    It to me doesn't seem like someone did this, rather right out of the factory.
  20. pen

    pen There are some who call me...mod. Staff Member

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    I agree, looks factory too me.

    Those are perfect pics! (Healthy sized log you have there BTW)

    Thanks for sharing that and sacrificing your camera for the purpose of good BS!

    pen
  21. Yamaha_gurl

    Yamaha_gurl New Member

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    Yes, I agree good sized log. I actually was curious as to what size my box was, so I measured (length x width x height...right? ) today. 2.3 cubic feet. I guess that's average right? I can't believe that no one has heard of the honey bear stove. I hear about baby bears, but never honey :-S

    That was pure luck on your part Pen that I just stumbled on this post again...lol. :D
  22. jacksnipe

    jacksnipe Member

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    Wow, what am I seeing here another set of angles above the brick retainers front to back. To much smoke & fire to decipher this design, Is the baffle a sheet of steel plate? Stove or Insert ? I have several questions regarding dimensions of this design
  23. Yamaha_gurl

    Yamaha_gurl New Member

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    It is a steel plate, and it's a Fisher, honey bear wood stove :p What questions do you have?
  24. pen

    pen There are some who call me...mod. Staff Member

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    looks to me like a piece of boiler plate with a lip on the front facing down.

    Also looks like the 2in area that I left above my baffle they left in-front of theirs.

    pen
  25. Yamaha_gurl

    Yamaha_gurl New Member

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    That is true, there is about2-3 inches in the front. I couldn't really tell you what type of steel it is...I am only just a little woman :p

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