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advice on a fisher installation

Post in 'The Hearth Room - Wood Stoves and Fireplaces' started by kjsnooks, Sep 20, 2007.

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  1. stoveguy2esw

    stoveguy2esw Minister of Fire

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    oops , yep your right rod , my boo boo. that was impressive on my part , ask if its a mobile home then forget that it is , duuuuhhhhhh i must have killed the wrong brain cells that night.

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  2. stoveguy2esw

    stoveguy2esw Minister of Fire

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    jason,
    we build a mobile home approved unit that runs about 600.00 (approx)new in the box at home depot. not all new stoves are over a grand new. also , if you look on craigslist or e bay or any other classifieds and see a stove that is within your price range, post the ad or at least what model it is and i (as im sure others as well) will tell you if its an approved unit , as for the chimney post you were asking about how to go through the ceiliing , you absolutely CANNOT just cut a hole and stick the pipe through!!! listen to me on this even if you do not on anything else! if you put this stove in (i hope you dont) and you cut a hole and poke the pipe through without the proper ceiling support box and proper clearance YOU VERY LIKELY WILL BURN YOUR HOUSE DOWN!please slow down and allow us to help you. get rid of the fisher! its going to get you in trouble. im not saying this to be mean , and im not trying to demean you in any way , i do this to help people. in my work i build stoves but in here i dont care if i sell you a stove i built, but i DO care about making sure as best i can that people who come here for help do not make the mistake i feel you are about to make. i understand what you are going through with the gas prices being so high, hell ive been there too in the past. ok look, pm me if you want and we can discuss this privately if you wish , give me some particulars let me know what we have in front of us and let me see what i can do. ok, but let me have a shot at this before you try to install that thing.
  3. nshif

    nshif New Member

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    Jacob
    Do you even have wood for this year? If you try cutting wood now it will not be burnable and even if you could youd just be asking for a chiminey fire. If you have to buy wood your no better off then if you used the propane. Wood burning is not a 1 year payback, it takes a few winters to see some payback.
    Listen to Stoveguy, sell the stove and your 25% of the way to a legit stove. youll still need some pipe and fittings down the road but NO you cant just cut a hole and stick the pipe out. Like Stove said you will surely burn your house down
  4. kjsnooks

    kjsnooks New Member

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    I dont have wood this year yes i have to go cut it. No biggie me and my family have been doing that for years and recently ive started helping a friend named Brian to cut his wood he intends to burn the same year and his father did the same for a long time and his brothers do to. We generally make it a two family affair to go up for two days help everyone get all the wood they need for the year around the end of sep. or oct. Brians stove rarley smokes if he gets the air flow right. And i am pming stoveguy to talk to him about it. Thanks again for all the info.

    Jacob

    p.s I know there is more to the chimney than putting a hole in the roof. Of course i would have chimney support and flashing and support on the roof according to the height of the chimney. I am trying to figure out how i put a stove in regardless. I have some more to check on before i just bag this one but again no matter what one is going in this year no matter what as i will burn the wood i cut this year. my propane is over 2$ a gallon right now and i need 500-800 gallons depending on how cold it is. As for money if you knew where i was at with it right now you would cringe, hence the desperation to get a stove in. If i find one i can afford that is certified for mobile home thats my route if not then financially im going to have to put this one in. I called the fire dept. about it they told me if i hang cement board and leave a 1" gap between that and my sheet rock and put brick on the cement board it would give adequet protection from starting a fire. thats my situation Im sorry for being so stubbor/ignorant about wood stove. My dad had one for 16 yrs before he moved but i was to young to remember much about it.
  5. stoveguy2esw

    stoveguy2esw Minister of Fire

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    jacob , i forgot to check in PM how big an area (sq ft) do you need to heat?
  6. thechimneysweep

    thechimneysweep Minister of Fire

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    Hi Jacob,

    I hope you'll forgive me if I'm wrong, but reading your posts, it almost seems like you're deliberately baiting the forum members, who are here voluntarily to help you out. To sum up what everyone has been trying to tell you, installing your Fisher in a mobile home is not on any reasonable person's menu. All mobile home- approved wood stoves must bear a permanent label stating that they're HUD approved for installation in a mobile home, and your stove doesn't have that approval or label. All mobile home- approved wood stoves must get their combustion air from outside the home, and your stove doesn't have that provision. And the wood you say you "cut this year" isn't going to be ready to burn safely until next year. If you're seriously considering installing a wood stove in your mobile home, you can view the basic rules on one page at http://www.chimneysweeponline.com/homhreq.htm.
  7. kjsnooks

    kjsnooks New Member

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    Im not trying to bait anyone just trying to learn. I have talked with mike and in the end it sounds like im not using the fisher this year. to clarify on the wood i am allowed to cut only dead standing trees. Us folks here in idaho have been doing that for as long i can remember as i come from a family who burned wood untill i was 16 and as i have stated my friend brian and his whole family go cut wood every year this time of year and the wood burns fine. only one chimney fire due to not cleaning it for 2 years. Usually they clean the pipe once a year for whatever reason he didnt. after that day though now hes is religious about it. I apologize for seeming to bait anyone.

    Jacob
  8. MrGriz

    MrGriz New Member

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    If you go back and read all your posts, it sure does sound like you might have been baiting; I'm glad you're not. I also thought for a while that you still had your mind made up to install the Fisher, regardless of the answers to your questions; now I'm thinking you've changed your mind.

    Please take the advice of the members here who are trying to help you. Sell the Fisher (even for a loss if you have to), get it out of your house; that way you won't be tempted to put it in at all (regardless of the cost of LP or availability of wood). Forget whether it's approved or not, it's just not safe at all.

    Do some research into what stoves are HUD approved to be installed in your mobile home and what the proper installation procedure is. Once you know what will work for your situation, start hunting. Check your local Craig's list and newspapers regularly for a good used stove that will fit the bill. I'm sure that given enough time and diligence, you will find a good used stove that will work for you and be safe.

    Start cutting wood for next season now. I know you think that standing dead wood is ready to burn almost immediately; it's not. You would be amazed at the difference you will see in properly seasoned wood burned in a modern EPA stove. You have to remember that the stoves you grew up with were not nearly as air tight and efficient as today's modern stoves. You could just about throw logs from the river into an old pre EPA stove and with all the air leaks it would dry up and burn. New stoves are just not designed to burn that way. They use much less wood and burn it much more completely and efficiently. If nothing else, you'll have one less thing to worry about next year.

    You have to understand and remember that none of us have any vested interest in whether or not you install a new, used, certified or un-certified stove in your home. None of us are trying to sell you anything or charge you for an installation or consultation. We are just here to share our knowledge and experience and most importantly to keep you safe. Please take this advice to heart and don't put yourself into an unsafe or deadly situation.
  9. Jags

    Jags Moderate Moderator Staff Member

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    Jacob - I understand your frustration of home heating and no cash to do it with. Been there - done that (got the t-shirt). But I think that what you are talking about doing is a very risky, almost "no win situation". Its not that there is one thing that is questionable, the whole install is. I know I'm just another voice in the air, but here is my take on it:

    1.) Using a pre-epa stove - Not the end of the world but not good either.

    2.) Using a stove that is not designed for HUD requirements - very bad - Gonna suck the oxygen right out of the double wide.

    3.) Chopping a round hole that the pipe will just slip through - very bad - pipe clearances are way too close.

    4.) Using green firewood in a smoke dragon - very bad -creasote buildup, stack fires.

    5.) Listening to a fire dept. that says "hell, just hang a piece of durock behind it with an air gap" - very bad

    6.) Not heeding any and all SAFETY points brought up by the forum - very bad

    7.) Installing a stove that is probably WAY oversized for the area - very bad -combine small, smoldering fires with green wood being burned in a smoke dragon - ain't gonna be good.

    The folks on this forum are here for the love of wood burning for various reasons. They will help make installs correct, and safe, but I don't think ANYONE here is gonna help with an unsafe install. As a matter of fact I swear I just heard a blood vessel on Elks head pop. This is a free country, and nobody here can stop you from installing this stove, but please, hear 'em out first. It may just be the best decision of your life (and for your life).

    ***EDIT***
    Since I type so slow, 2 posts were entered. Jacob, you have made a great decision to not use that stove.
  10. hearthtools

    hearthtools Moderator Emeritus

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    WELL SAID!

    what she said.

    Check with the local building department
    The fire department only knows how to cut up homes when they are on fire.
    I know my wife was a Full time firefighter for years and I was a paid call firefigher for 10
    maybe they want some action.
    I reported a home that had single wall pipe going out the wall and up to the Capt at of of the Stations here.
    He said OH well Urban renewal.

    remember you are putting fire in your home.
    the stove is the thing that Contains that fire.

    To me a fisher stove is just a burn barrell with a door.
    I would not burn one on my patio due to the amount of pollution it put out and it might scorch my vinyl fencing.
  11. ChrisN

    ChrisN Feeling the Heat

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    This has all been pretty much put to bed, except in my mind I'm not convinced Jacob is in a mobile home. Sounds like he could just as easily be in a modular house. although we genereally have cellars in the northeast, from what I understand, building on a slab is fairly common in other parrts of the country. He mentioned a steel beam running underneath, but I have all sorts of steel I-beams holding up my first floor and even one holding up the floor over my garage. If he could confirm that his house isn't classified as a MH, it would open his options of stove choice up quite a bit.
  12. nshif

    nshif New Member

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    Any home built off site be it modular or mobile is under HUD jurisdiction. because the home is built off site local authorities have no way to inspect it as it is built and therefor accecpt HUD approval. If a stove is to be installed it needs to meet HUD approval and be tested to that spec.
  13. ChrisN

    ChrisN Feeling the Heat

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    Thanks for that clarification nshif.

    Edit: But that brings another thought to mind: so you're saying that even those fancy multi-story, multi roof line modular homes that are out there now are subject to HUD requirements? what is the gist of the HUD requirments? for instance is it just the mandatory OAK fitting, or is there more to it? Also it seems that if a modular home owner decided to retrofit a wood buring stove sometime after the home was built they could very well be ignorant of the HUD rules and they would have to rely on the local building inspector warning them before hand. I strongly suspect that in my Connecticut town, the building inspector is relatively clueless. When I had my installation inspection it was a cursory look at the hearth, stove pipe and chimney. I guess I'm thinking that with the popularity of modular built homes nowadays many homeowners and local building inspectors may be ignorant of the more restrictive rules.
  14. BrotherBart

    BrotherBart Hearth.com LLC Mid-Atlantic Division Staff Member

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    Technically there hasn't been a "mobile home" built since 1976. In '76 HUD took over regulation with enactment of the Manufactured Home Construction and Safety Standards sometimes called the HUD Code. If it is built off-site in a factory it is a "manufactured home" and subject to the HUD code which is the only federally regulated nationwide building code. Any additions or changes made locally are subject to state and local building codes. The HUD codes covers electrical and HVAC systems for the homes also.
  15. Jags

    Jags Moderate Moderator Staff Member

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    I swear - I learn something new from this site every gosh darn day.
  16. BrotherBart

    BrotherBart Hearth.com LLC Mid-Atlantic Division Staff Member

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    I got curious about it a few years ago when I bought a trailer that had "mobile home" axles that needed new tires. Turns out mobile home tires are only made for a one-way trip from the factory to the site because of the huge amount of weight. Because of that I did some looking. I also ended up having to buy a set of darned expensive low-boy tires instead.
  17. nshif

    nshif New Member

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    BB has it right, manufactured homes are not built to UBC or IBC but to HUD codes. Any mods to them have to be made to that code
    BB used to be the tires were also 14.5 " so they wouldnt fit any other rims
  18. BrotherBart

    BrotherBart Hearth.com LLC Mid-Atlantic Division Staff Member

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    Still are. The only other ones I could find were 12 ply low-boy tires to the tune of two hundred bucks apiece at the cheapest place I could find. First one hundred PSI tires I have ever seen. The twenty foot trailer rides more like a twenty foot brick.
  19. nshif

    nshif New Member

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    BB
    you might try looking ,there uses to be a co making knock rims that were 15". We used to call those centerless flange mount rims Calif style why I dont know but you might still be able to find some substitute rims that are 15" Not that youll probably ever wear out those low boy tires.
  20. 68 Couper

    68 Couper New Member

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    This is the best comedy I have ever read on the net! :lol:

    You guys are awesome,
    Couper
  21. North of 60

    North of 60 Minister of Fire

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    Couper they've gotta million of em here. CHA CHA CHA CHAAAAAAA %-P 99.6% in good will. :coolsmile:
    Back in the early days BroBart and Fossil were actually the original Marx Brothers. They still are pretty funny
    now, but have tamed down a bit since they carry the RED stamp. BeGreen and Goose has had to clean them up a little. :lol:
    CHEERS
    N of 60
  22. kjsnooks

    kjsnooks New Member

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    Well not to stir the pot, but in the end i put it in anyway. No one understood the situation or urgency in needing this stove, and as such were pretty much bent on me getting a new one wich was not an option. I had a little girl dying in the hospital that sucked all my money away, no way to get another stove, or pay for propane heat. I did some research and a few ppl on this forum gave me some advice behind the scenes(not wanting to be criticized by anyone on here) and its in. has been for two winters now. As for being safe...well its called common sense. We operate it safely installed properly ect ect. The wall behind the duroc never gets above warm. As in i can touch it w/o pain. On that note, to those who truly helped me get this in thank you! It was a blessing and has benefited us greatly now for two winters, and as i learn how to operate it more efficiently im using less and less wood.
  23. Jimbob

    Jimbob New Member

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    Sorry to hear about that, man.....Must have been hell for you. I've had loved ones die in hospital so I know it's rough. :(

    Try not to be upset with the people advising against the install on the forum. We've all read many stories about the tragedies of improperly installed wood stoves.
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