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AV fuel source locator

Post in 'The Gear' started by JoeyD, May 27, 2012.

  1. JoeyD

    JoeyD Minister of Fire

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    After reading the threads for and against AV fuel I decided to give it a try after my hedge trimmer which only gets used one or two days a year crapped out. I have to say everything has been good so far. All my 2-stroke equipment seems to start easier and run good using it. I should mention I am in NJ where you can't seem to buy ethanol free fuel which is why I tried the AV fuel.


    Anyhow, I found this AV gas price locator on a tractor forum and thought it might be helpful to anyone thinking of giving it a try.


    http://www.airnav.com/fuel/local.html
    Bigg_Redd likes this.

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  2. Bigg_Redd

    Bigg_Redd Minister of Fire

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    Don't say that too loud - a lot of the "experts" on this board will be in here any minute telling you that your equipment isn't starting easier and isn't running better.
  3. JoeyD

    JoeyD Minister of Fire

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    LOL, lord knows I am no expert. I just wanted to pass along my personal experience. I am sure the higher octane rating has a lot to do with all of this, the main plus is no ethanol.
  4. fossil

    fossil Accidental Moderator Staff Member

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    That's pretty interesting. The info at this link is accurate for finding ethanol free gas where I live. I noted with interest that yup by golly, there's no "NJ" in the state/province index.

    http://pure-gas.org/
  5. MasterMech

    MasterMech Guest

    I don't doubt that the equipment runs just dandy on it. I just don't encourage running fuel that contains up to TWICE the TEL (Lead) that 60's automotive fuel had. Especially in machinery that dumps it's exhaust within 3 feet of my nose. Not every area has an airport willing to dispense AVGas without a tail #.

    AVGas Octane ratings are derived differently than automotive fuel. Using the R+M/2 method that pump gas is rated with, 100LL comes in at 96 Octane. Using more octane than the engine requires (89 for Stihl's dunno if Husky ever published a minimum spec?) has ZERO benfit and just makes the engine run hotter. Many pump gas blenders were adding in extra detergents and other additives to premium fuel to encourage sales.

    Joey for a small machine that only gets used occasionally, why not try one of the "canned" mix fuels like Stihl MotoMix or 50:1? Way to expensive to run in something you use often but if you run a few tanks a year then the cost difference is irrelevant. Cheaper than carburetors...

    http://www.baileysonline.com/itemdetail.asp?item=B 0125638
    http://www.stihlusa.com/lubricants/premixed-fuels.html

    Nothing in this area of NY either.
  6. Bigg_Redd

    Bigg_Redd Minister of Fire

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    That didn't take long. . . .
  7. weatherguy

    weatherguy Minister of Fire

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    Thats what I run in my weed wacker and blower, I use it for my saw too once in a while, if Im doing a lot of cutting I wont but if Im just cutting a few rounds down to size I do.
  8. Bigg_Redd

    Bigg_Redd Minister of Fire

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    Bought 5 gallons yesterday. $5.50 per gallon which is about a buck more than pump premium around here). Mixed it 40:1 with QuickSilver TC-W3 pure synthetic.
  9. pybyr

    pybyr Minister of Fire

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    I follow the part that as long as you're using a fuel with a high enough octane to avoid pinging/ detonation under load and dieseling at shut-down, then higher octane, as a quest unto itself, achieves nothing.

    I am not understanding at all how higher octane fuel would cause an engine to run hotter. To run hotter, the fuel would have to have higher energy content or a vastly different burning rate once it has ignited. As I understand it, octane measures the resistance to unintended occurrence of ignition, and, once ignited, unintended/ irregular patterns of burn. Higher octane fuels can, as I understand it, allow engines that are designed to take advantage of them to run at higher compression, and/ or with more aggressively advanced ignition timing, both of which increase power (to a point) by extracting more of the energy released by combustion of the fuel. Engines without high compression or that can't run more aggressive spark timing cannot take advantage of higher octane. But it's not that the high octane fuel necessarily has more net energy per unit volume, so how would you end up with excess heat?

    I'm not saying I "know better" on this; if I have it wrong I would like to understand better.

    Avgas does seem to start much more readily, over a wider range of temperatures, and yield a noticeably more responsive engine, in my chainsaw.

    When a tiny bit spills (which I try to avoid and minimize for all kinds of reasons) the avgas seems to volatilize much more rapidly and disappear much more completely than modern "road gas" -which seems to have an initial quick partial evaporation, followed by some other stuff left behind that remains liquid longer and dissipates more gradually.
  10. TradEddie

    TradEddie Minister of Fire

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    I love it when people equate Octane with power, the reality can be the opposite. Pure ethanol is 113 Octane, but has 33% less energy per gallon than pure gas. Higher Octane does allow higher compression and better performance in some engines, but paradoxically by being harder to burn.

    I've never put anything but road gas in my engines, Octane depends on which car I'm driving that day. I do use high quality 2-stroke oil, and measure the gas carefully. Never seen anything bad in a carb, never had a problem starting anything. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. As a teenager I remember huge problems starting my dad's chainsaw, or dirt bikes when they sat idle for a few months, and that was in the days of ethanol-free leaded gas, so don't go waxing lyrical about the good old days.

    TE
  11. MasterMech

    MasterMech Guest

    Slower burn from the higher octane fuel is what allows the engine to use more ignition advance and the resistance to detonation allows for increased compression. Slower burn rate keeps the combustion temps higher for longer. The difference in most engines is minor. Worst side effect from using to high an octane rating is the money that gets exhausted out the tailpipe.
  12. jeff_t

    jeff_t Minister of Fire

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    I was talking to a friend who has a pilot's license, and asked about getting some gas. We live about fifteen minutes from Avfuel's headquarters, and he said to head on over with a can.

    What started the conversation was that he works for a big, but family owned, fuel/oil/lp company, and I saw one of their transports southbound, quite a ways from home. He said they supply the automakers' testing facilities and proving grounds here with pure gas, and they were heading to get a load. Hmmm.

    They also supply a vendor that designs and builds fuel pumps with drums of Brazilian gas. Apparently, Brazil has the crappiest gas in the world, and they use that fuel as a baseline for performance. If it works with Brazillian gas, it will work with anything, I guess.

    He said he can get me a five gallon can of just about anything. I need to see what they have to offer when I get to serious cutting again.
  13. wkpoor

    wkpoor Minister of Fire

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    I've used AvGas for many yrs. The thing that most people miss that it keeps your fuel system spotless clean and leaves no trace when it evaps. Basically your OPE will run for yrs and you may never have a fuel related problem again by using it. As for all the other hokus pokus about burning up your engine all I can say is I have used it in almost everthing not EFI and have yet to see a single problem, other than things runs very nice on it. As for the health concerns I cannot comment on that.
  14. cwill

    cwill Member

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    Been using 100LL in the saws and weed whip for about a year now with no problems. Had to adjust the idle on one saw. Everything starts easier. The weed whip starts on half a pull now. Not too concerned with any possible health effects. Dont really run it enough, besides I spent way too much time around running race cars to worry about some saw exhaust :)

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