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Barn stove install

Post in 'DIY and General non-hearth advice' started by Danno77, Dec 29, 2011.

  1. Danno77

    Danno77 Minister of Fire

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    I just acquired all of the chimney pieces I need to get my Woodstove going out in the barn, but I wanted to finish off the wall where it sits. The construction of this barn has that end wall built with 2x4s flat wise and spaced 24" on center. I wasn't impressed, so I mated another 2x4 flat wise and and am happier with it, but wasn't thinking about insulation at the time. Now that I'm looking to insulate it I'm finding out that 23" wide insulation only seems to come in 6.5 inch thicknesses. I don't want to make the wall any thicker than it is, because 1. It's a small room (8x12) and 2. I don't need a high r-value because it's just a mancave in a shed.

    I hate buying the thick stuff and smashing it down, because of price and waste, do I have a better option?

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  2. 'bert

    'bert Minister of Fire

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    how about having it spray foamed? Here in Alberta its very expensive, but may be different where you are. Otherwise you have to cut each piece.
  3. Hogwildz

    Hogwildz Minister of Fire

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    Foam board or blown in are the only two other options I can think of at this point.
  4. Danno77

    Danno77 Minister of Fire

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    Yeah, sprayed in is not an option given cost and small size of job, but I did consider cutting some foam board in there and then getting a couple of cans of spray foam to seal the edges. I don't have a hot knife for cutting it, but I think I can use a handheld reciprocating jig-saw just as easily (but messier).
  5. woodgeek

    woodgeek Minister of Fire

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    Assuming there is no interior wall finish?

    No code concerns as it is not a 'house'?

    Then I would use poly-iso, 2" would be great....probably get R-10 for the whole assembly.

    Don't need a hot knife--just a sharp utility knife and a metal yardstick. The foil face is more fire resistant than XPS in an exposed situation.
  6. Danno77

    Danno77 Minister of Fire

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    I am going to finish the interior wall, but it's open framing until I do. Going to google poly-iso, don't recognize it by name, maybe a picture will help me. BRB.

    Edit: got it. Not sure I need the foil face, but I see exactly what you are talking about now...
  7. stefan66

    stefan66 Member

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    can't you get r12 fiberglass---made for 3.5 inch cavity?
    or how about tearing the 6.5?inch in half?
  8. raygard

    raygard Member

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    I was always a non believer in the spray foam. Yet took the plunge and went with closed cell in the basement (not open cell). Oo la la, what a difference. Worth every penny (don't think it would be good around a chimney though)
  9. daveswoodhauler

    daveswoodhauler Minister of Fire

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    Cutting the rigid foam isn't that bad to do. I just did my basement over and used R5 rigid, and would cut easily with just a utility knife. (I was thinking I would need a circular saw too, but it cut real easy with just a sharp blade and I sometimes used a drywall hand saw to cut out some funky corners) If you are going to use R10 or the 2 inch rigid, you can probably just get by with a utility knife to make the score of 1" or so, then use just use a sharp putty knife to finish it off. The stuff I got was 24" wide by 8' tall, so if your spread is 23 inches you shouldn't have much waste at all.
    Good luck

    Edit, just realized you have only 2 X 4 studs....so the R10 would be out as it would be a bit too wide.
  10. backpack09

    backpack09 Minister of Fire

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    roxul probably would not be horrible to cut and make work.

    Or use 3.5" unfaced fibreglass cut and place (16" at a time up the wall), then put up poly as a vapor barrier.
  11. Jags

    Jags Moderate Moderator Staff Member

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    For the foam board you can just score it with a utility knife and then snap it like drywall. It leaves a bit of a rough edge, but if you are going to "can foam" it in afterwards, it won't matter.
  12. Danno77

    Danno77 Minister of Fire

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    I thought about that. Would take forever, though! I think I'm pretty set on rigid then spray foam to seal it in nicely. I'll let you all know how it goes. Hoping to make a trip to town tonight and then work on it over the next couple of days. I'll also be picking up hearth materials while I'm there.

    Speaking of hearth... I think the flooring in this thing is going to be a roll of vinyl remnant. Should I lay the hearth and cut around it for the vinyl, or build the hearth right on it?

    Hearth is going to be several inches thick of durock with a tile top. It'll be a 4'x4' square right up against a wall in the middle of the room (not a corner)
  13. Highbeam

    Highbeam Minister of Fire

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    I've installed tons of 2" foam. Mostly under slabs. I cut it with a circular saw and it works great. Even the 45 degree angle on the sides of slabs. You can either saw it or a nice sawzall makes good cuts too.

    I've used both XPS and the much cheaper insulfoam EPS with equal results.
  14. jharkin

    jharkin Minister of Fire

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    Danno... Going off on a tangent... you live in an old Victorian right?, so Im guessing that barn is of similar vintage and thus is post and beam framed? If yes those studs are there only to provide a base to attach the sheathing to, and the extra reinforcement is probably overkill.

    But i digress..


    Another vote for the rigid foam board. The mass save guys did my knewalls in the attic with that stuff. You can cut the 2in with a utility knife, press it in place and then just use foam in a can to seal the edges. A lot more economical for DIY than full blown spray foam.
  15. EatenByLimestone

    EatenByLimestone Minister of Fire

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    A local building supply has 24", 3.5" thick faced and unfaced insulation available. I picked up a bunch of unfaced a few year ago for the family cabin.

    It exists, you might have to ask for it though.

    Matt
  16. Danno77

    Danno77 Minister of Fire

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    I built the "barn" myself a couple of years ago. It's a 20x12 and gets most of it's structural rigidity from the heavy plywood siding.

    Anyway, I was at Menards today and just got back. Was able to find faced R-13 that says right on the package that it's for 2x4 studs (3 1/2" thick).... So most of this thread is moot.

    Going off from the original topic, though (maybe I'll change the title to barn stove install), I did have quite a time sourcing 4x4 sheets of Durock backer. Everyone who carries it only has 3x5 sheets and treated me like I was crazy for wanting anything else.

    So, I bought 5 3x5 sheets of the stuff. I think I might break code on this. On a scale of 1-10 (10 being the worst) how bad would I be to have too little hearth on the stove sides? I can spend a good amount of time cutting these things and puzzle piecing them together, or I can use them as is.

    Also, I bought myself a bag of Roxul for miscellaneous use after tossing some in above the 30 for a blockoff. Should have lots left over, not sure where it will end up, but it looks to be a good product!

    Edit: BTW, the manual says 4x4 minimum hearth and shows a picture of the stove with 8" on either side of it. When I measure the stove the body is about 23.5 and the stove top is about 25.5, so I'm not sure how they get 4ft needed for the hearth width. By my calculations I'm either 2 or 3 inches off on each side of the stove if I do it with the 3x5s cut back to 3x4...
  17. woodgeek

    woodgeek Minister of Fire

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    While we're moot, I want to change my answer....check the pricing on the FG batts closely. When I was doing my attic, I found R-30 and R-19 unfaced were the same price per square foot! The R-30 compressed to the thickness of R-19 drops to ~R-21 nominal, but should have much better performance at very low temps, resist compression, etc. So, if the price is right, go with the thicker batts.
  18. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hey Danno77

    We have to compare notes! I am doing the same thing in my shed! The room is 10' x 10' so I do not have much room either. So I am going with a pellet stove which uses smaller pipe and I do not have to go through the roof. See pics below. Wall Thru with 908 casing!!

    When I dug the 27' long ditch 3 feet deep for the electrical, I threw in the RG6 Quad Shield so a Color TV I got at a Yard Sale with Built in VCR for $10 works great on the shelf right over where the stove will be!! See pic

    Can u post some pics too?

    P.S. I still have to get more pipes while I finish installing the rest of the electrical outlets. Got 5 in now and only 5 more to go!

    Click to Enlarge

    Attached Files:

  19. Danno77

    Danno77 Minister of Fire

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    Here's where I am right now. I need to get a few more inches of length, so it looks like I'll be cutting two 24" pieces down to about 13-14" each.
    [​IMG]

    Here's a shot of the cool fake wood floor. That's a Vinyl Remnant that is glueless, just cut it and lay it down. Has a cool texture to it. I like it. You can also see the hearth pad in this picture. I'll be shortening it up a little at some point. Then it will get tiles.
    [​IMG]

    Here's a cruddy picture I just took of the outside chimney. Total height of this chimney is a little over ten feet. I'm going to try it, but I think I may need to add a little more height to it for a good burn.
    [​IMG]
  20. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hi Danno

    Very nice!! That is a tall barn!! How high? You need alot of pipe??

    P.S. What other goodies are you putting in the man cave room??

    I also like the floor, very inexpensive but looks Great!
  21. Danno77

    Danno77 Minister of Fire

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    Thanks for the comments!

    Let's see...
    The barn is 12' at the peak, it was a pain to build on my own, in fact you can tell that i'm still working on it. The white trim isn't up yet, for one! Previous owners made a basketball court, so i have something of a poured concrete slab that it sits on. Actually, it was pretty busted up, so i made sure to build the barn with treated subfloor framing and an OSB floor. I went one step further and bought the heaviest plastic i could find in a sheet that was something like 30'x16' or so and laid it our on the slab, and warapped it up around the frame, so the underneath should be fairly sealed. That's the reason you see plastic behind the stove. I have been planning this mancave since i built the barn, so i threw some inslation under the flooring in that room to help keep the floor warm. I'm actually less worried about keeping the place warm, the stove is overkill. I'm more worried about the AC! There is already a window unit built in on the wall, and I tried running it this summer for the whole structure and it was useless. Should be fine for this little room.

    The manual for this stove says I'm supposed to have 15' minimum chimney.

    Other additions to the room are a fridge that already sits in the corner awaiting it's Kegerator conversion. Will have a TV out there, too, but as of now electricity is through an extension from the house. I'd like to get electricity, cable, and Internet out there, too, so I'm interested in hearing more about what you ran and how.
  22. pen

    pen There are some who call me...mod. Staff Member

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  23. f3cbboy

    f3cbboy Feeling the Heat

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    home depot carried r-15 that was meant for 24" ctrs. that was some time ago, i haven't even noticed if they still do cause i haven't needed it lately.
  24. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Wow, I insulated the shed floor too. I used 1-3/8" rigid foam board with foil on both sides that sits on runners between the floor joists! We think alike! See pic below.

    The electricians in this forum really helped me do the electrical the right way. Turns out this only one right way and plenty of wrong ways to wire a shed or barn. Bring out 240 to a sub panel on heavy wire like #10-3 UF-B so there is little voltage drop and all tools and lights will work without dimming!
    See pics and detail right here! Great info!
    http://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/84387/

    When the electrical is done I will have 10 - 20 amp AC outlets.
    Also since it took me a week to dig the 27 Ft trench 3 feet deep, I threw in cable tv wire, phone wire and alarm wire plus another electrical wire for a light switch in the house! Why not I only dug the trench once!!

    I have internet through our Wireless router in the house so did not need a cable. A friend bought an internet hookup that work through the electric line from his house to his garage from Best Buy so that is really easy.

    Good luck

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  25. fishingpol

    fishingpol Minister of Fire

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    Nice work guys, you take sheds to the next level. I wish mine wasn't so full of stuff.

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