blaze king princess vs englander 30nc

[rdust]

So far this sounds like my best option.
alot of people run the king in6 inch?
does it cause any draft problems?

If the 30 has smoke coming out the door on a reload a Princess will be worse(lower flue temps with a cat stove). A King on a 6" flue that spills smoke with a non cat stove is going to be a disaster. I've only seen a few people here try running a King on a 6" flue and most of them didn't work good when it came to reloads.

For you to enjoy the long steady heat output of a cat stove like a BK the stove needs to be on the main level or a well insulated basement. A Princess or King dialed down low isn't going to cut it if you're torching 5 loads a day in the 30 to stay comfortable. The Princess probably puts you in the same spot your are now, the King(with a chimney upgrade) will be better due to the fact it holds more wood.

 

[amh]

If the 30 has smoke coming out the door on a reload a Princess will be worse(lower flue temps with a cat stove). A King on a 6" flue that spills smoke with a non cat stove is going to be a disaster. I've only seen a few people here try running a King on a 6" flue and most of them didn't work good when it came to reloads.

For you to enjoy the long steady heat output of a cat stove like a BK the stove needs to be on the main level or a well insulated basement. A Princess or King dialed down low isn't going to cut it if you're torching 5 loads a day in the 30 to stay comfortable. The Princess probably puts you in the same spot your are now, the King(with a chimney upgrade) will be better due to the fact it holds more wood.

good point about the it smoking more cause of lower flue temps.
whats the difference between a wood stove and wood furnace?

 

[Ashful]

lol... started typing a reply this afternoon, when there was not yet a reply, and look now! In any case, here were some random thoughts on the OP:

Some background info, i built a chalet about 8 yrs ago, r 22 in walls and 41 in ceiling. Its probably around 2800 sqft with the full basement included. My basement is set inside a hill and i have 2 garage doors that i wheel 2 huge garbage cans on wheel set them right next to my stove.

Very good insulation, smaller house, should do well with a stove. Of course, heating from a basement is always tough, unless the basement is superbly insulated from the earth surrounding it.

The stove does great till low teens then the electric heat pump will have to kick on to suppliment the rest... What i dont like about it is loading it 5 times a day with the fifth being at around 3 or 4 in the morning.

These two statements seem contradictory. Loading 5 times per day is not "doing great," by most estimations. Trouble is, the 30 has a reasonably large box already. If you're already running hard enough that you're ripping thru 3.0 cu.ft. of wood in 5 hours, then a Princess is not buying you anything. The advantage of the Princess is that it can be dialed down to a very low burn rate, but you're not even running the Englander at the low end of it's much more limited range. If you want longer stretches between reloads, at the same BTU output, you need a bigger box: BK King, Equinox 8000, etc.

Ash removal is very messy, usually do that every day or 2.

First, you do want to keep a decent ash bed in the floor of most stoves. Just 1" - 2", for most. Second, if you're removing ash that often, it's likely you're shoveling out more than just ash, and actually removing some material which has not yet been fully reduced / BTU-extracted.

And finally i thi k the catalyst would help keep more heat from going out of the chimney.

True-dat. However, the difference in efficiency between a cat stove and your Englander is not so dramatic as to take you down from 5 loads per day to 12 hour burn times. The Princes is posted at 81% HHV efficiency, probably where you'd be running it. What's the Englander's HHV?

With that being said, how do u guys and gals think the princess would do compared to the englander?
would the things i dont like about the englander be lessened by the desighn of the princess?

The BK is a whole other stove, with an enormous performance advantage for burning very low and slow, but I suspect you will not be making use of that advantage in your current configuration.

Tell us more about your basement insulation.

 

[Hogwildz]

i do get alot of ash from my hardwood.
the basement is insulated with r12.5.
my biggest problem is the 2 garage doors i have down there. They are insulated but u can seal around the outside.

So new idea, keep the 30nc, and get a small pellet stove for the great room when twmps get in the 20s.
im assuming pellet stove are alot less dusty, smokey and messy, am i correct?

Good idea. I have never owned a pellet stove, best to visit the pellet stove room and ask there.
I would think pellets would be less mess, but best to ask actual pellet burners.
Those garage doors are killing you with air leaks I bet. R12.5 ain't much either. Better than nothing though.
Another thing to concentrate on, is sealing air leaks in the basement. Sill the sill plate sealed well?

 

[BrotherBart]

Sounds like the opposite set up from mine. I have the 30 hauling the freight for the first and second floor and a pellet puppy for when I need to work in the basement. If you want "low and slow" a pellet stove will kick the crap out of a cat stove.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

if your running the englander wide open your losing all your heat up chimney. cl it

I agree you should be using the stovetop temps as a guide. if your already getting 600-700 stovetop temps opening the air will only push THAT HEAT UP THE FLUE
My 30 provides maximum heat with the air all the way closed. If you need more air your draft may be too weak.

 

[bholler]

I am sorry but if you have smoke coming out the door you have a draft problem.

 

[amh]

I am sorry but if you have smoke coming out the door you have a draft problem.

Only sometimes on a reload, this isnt normal?
if not, how do i test draft?

 

[bholler]

Only sometimes on a reload, this isnt normal?
if not, how do i test draft?

Get a manometer and drill a 1/4" hole in the pipe for the probe

 

[amh]

I agree you should be using the stovetop temps as a guide. if your already getting 600-700 stovetop temps opening the air will only push THAT HEAT UP THE FLUE
My 30 provides maximum heat with the air all the way closed. If you need more air your draft may be too weak.

Good point, ill have to get another one of those magnets.

 

[amh]

I agree you should be using the stovetop temps as a guide. if your already getting 600-700 stovetop temps opening the air will only push THAT HEAT UP THE FLUE
My 30 provides maximum heat with the air all the way closed. If you need more air your draft may be to

So im guessing i should get a good ash pile, fill the stove, let it catch good then damp it all the way off?
do u carve a channel with the ash then lay your wood from left to right like the manual says?

 

[BrotherBart]

Only sometimes on a reload, this isnt normal?
if not, how do i test draft?

You are going to get some smoke out of it while you are reloading if the new load starts smoking while you are still putting in wood. My chimney drafts like a Hoover but it still happens while I am fitting N/S splits the way I want them.

But this five loads thing has me wondering. I heat 2,500 sq. ft. not insulated near what your place is with a 30 on three loads a day when the nights were at -5. And I don't get up at night to reload lately. Some work needs to be done on how you are loading and running that puppy.

 

[amh]

You are going to get some smoke out of it while you are reloading if the new load starts smoking while you are still putting in wood. My chimney drafts like a Hoover but it still happens while I am fitting N/S splits the way I want them.

But this five loads thing has me wondering. I heat 2,500 sq. ft. not insulated near what your place is with a 30 on three loads a day when the nights were at -5. And I don't get up at night to reload lately. Some work needs to be done on how you are loading and running that puppy.

I was pulling the damper all the way out, maybe thats my problem, do u damper yours all the way down after the full load catches?

 

[amh]

You are going to get some smoke out of it while you are reloading if the new load starts smoking while you are still putting in wood. My chimney drafts like a Hoover but it still happens while I am fitting N/S splits the way I want them.

But this five loads thing has me wondering. I heat 2,500 sq. ft. not insulated near what your place is with a 30 on three loads a day when the nights were at -5. And I don't get up at night to reload lately. Some work needs to be done on how you are loading and running that puppy.

And are u loading yours like the manual says with a channel then left to right with the wood?

 

[BrotherBart]

I load the stove, let it char the load until the stove top is around 400 degrees and then start closing down the air 1/4 at a time letting the burn stabilize after each step. According to how the temp is it usually ends up cruising with the rod just a little past the edge of the ash lip on the stove and stove top around 650 and eases down to 550 to six hundred.

Everything depend on the dryness of your wood and your chimney draft. You have to work on the "sweet spot". Took a while to find it. And some nights a load just does not cooperate and either needs coaxing or tries to take off. The nature of wood burning.

 

[BrotherBart]

And are u loading yours like the manual says with a channel then left to right with the wood?

I burn it that way and also with the splits North/South which is with the splits in the firebox ends to the back and front. I prefer North/South but burn it side to side with the trough, E/W sometimes just to work with what members here are doing for advising them.

Either way works fine and most of this season I have burned E/W. You really only need the trough under the front two splits with them on a coal bed that you have dragged to the front instead of spreading it across the floor of the firebox.

 

[BrotherBart]

Gotta go to bed soon but lots of folks here can help ya get a better burn out of that sucker.

Jump in folks.

 

[mellow]

You asked about wood furnaces, do you have insulated ductwork you could tie it into?

 

[amh]

You asked about wood furnaces, do you have insulated ductwork you could tie it into?

Yes, i have a heatpump duct to tie to.
know of some good ones?

 

[mellow]

Check out the Tundra: https://www.menards.com/main/p-2431486.htm?cm_vc=HOMEZ1

or the Max Caddy: http://www.psg-distribution.com/product.aspx?Id=563&CategoId=16

 

[Seasoned Oak]

I was pulling the damper all the way out, maybe thats my problem, do u damper yours all the way down after the full load catches?

No wonder you are chewing up the wood,ALL THE WAY OUT YIKES Only when starting the stove is the damper all the way out. My damper never comes out past the edge of the ash plate on the front of the stove once its up to normal burning temps. WHen its warmer outside and the draft gets weak perhaps a little more air. Stovetop shoud be between 550 and 650. IT tends to get hotter with less air pushing thru the stove,as long as your wood is dry.

 

[amh]

No wonder you are chewing up the wood,ALL THE WAY OUT YIKES Only when starting the stove is the damper all the way out. My damper never comes out past the edge of the ash plate on the front of the stove once its up to normal burning temps. WHen its warmer outside and the draft gets weak perhaps a little more air. Stovetop shoud be between 550 and 650. IT tends to get hotter with less air pushing thru the stove,as long as your wood is dry.

Stove top vetween 550 and 650, not the pipe right? My magnet wore out and wouldnt stick to the pipe so i tossed it. Ill have to get another one and do like u said, never past the ash lip.

Thx!

 

[bholler]

Stove top vetween 550 and 650, not the pipe right? My magnet wore out and wouldnt stick to the pipe so i tossed it. Ill have to get another one and do like u said, never past the ash lip.
Thx!

Usually when they wont stick any more it is because they have been over heated what temps was it running at?

 

[daleeper]

Keep working with that Englander, it is known to be able to crank out lots of heat. Learn to use it properly, with good firewood. I think you are being guided on using it properly, follow these folks advice. If you are unable to get enough heat/reduce the need to reload, you need to consider something with a bigger firebox. I doubt there are stoves with significantly bigger fireboxes than the nc-30 that do not require an 8" chimney. There are furnaces that will hold more wood that use a 6" chimney. Installing a furnace should at least keep that heat pump from kicking on, and distribute that heat throughout the house.

You are fighting a tough battle with those garage doors in your stove room/workspace. Is the stove in the garage, and are you using it as a garage? If not, then think about closing up those garage doors, insulate the basement walls, install more efficient double doors if you need the larger door openings. If you are still using the space as a garage, can you partition it off with an insulated wall, with the stove and stairway on the insulated side? This is a war you are going to fight with any stove/furnace, you need to be planning your attack.

 

[begreen]

Stove top vetween 550 and 650, not the pipe right? My magnet wore out and wouldnt stick to the pipe so i tossed it. Ill have to get another one and do like u said, never past the ash lip.

Thx!

Running wide open puts a lot more heat up the flue. It's a wasteful way to heat and hard on the flue piping. The magnet most likely lost its stick due to very high heat exposure. I would have the flue system checked out. It's lifespan may be compromised by running continually at too high temps.