Figured I'd start a new thread rather than continue the craiglist one. Begreen and elk, you have both suggested the intrepid II. I got another quote today from a city 90 miles away, $1399 for black. much better than the $1734 I was quoted from the dealer in Eugene which is 45 miles away. I'm curious about the BTU rating between the intrepid and the F3CB, 27000 and 42000 respectively. I think the cat stove would be better for my situation, just wondering if 27000 BTUs is enough? These two stoves seem to be about the same size. Is it the cat that lowers the BTU rating? roben.
BTU ratings between VC entrepid II and Jotul F3CB
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titan
Minister of Fire
Elk and Begreen may know better than I,but it seems to me that V.C. posts more genuine btu outputs for their stoves while some manufacturers post overly-optimistic #'s.
Agreed, ratings are somewhat inflated at times. The 3CB is rated at 42,000 max btus and will get hotter. It has a larger firebox. But the point of the Intrepid is longer burn times. If you weren't heating with wood exclusively, then the Jotul would be a nice alternative. It does take longer wood which is a plus. But the firebox is still relatively small, so it will only take a couple splits at a time. So between the two the Intrepid is probably the better choice.
In truth though, I thought you were better off when you were looking at a small or mid-sized PE stove. They have great burn times, take a larger log and have the reserve BTUs you're looking for. The $200 off sale is still going last I looked.
In truth though, I thought you were better off when you were looking at a small or mid-sized PE stove. They have great burn times, take a larger log and have the reserve BTUs you're looking for. The $200 off sale is still going last I looked.
Thanks guys, I buy my wood, don't own a truck. I comes cut and split. lenghts are 15". I still might consider the PE alderlea T4 but at 52000 BTUs I'm afraid it would overwhelm me in my lazyboy which is only about 5' from the front of the stove. roben.
That is max rating, not normal running. Aren't you used to an old Schrader? FWIW, the F3CB can get pretty hot too.
Seriously, you won't be burning the stove full out in your climate more than a few days a year. Most of the time you will have it throttled down. I think you need to get to a store that is burning one to see what your comfort level will be, but I don't think this is an issue.
Seriously, you won't be burning the stove full out in your climate more than a few days a year. Most of the time you will have it throttled down. I think you need to get to a store that is burning one to see what your comfort level will be, but I don't think this is an issue.
webbie
Seasoned Moderator
Are either of those ratings actual EPA burn test ratings? Or just manufacturers published?
A couple things - if you are going to compare those stoves apple to apples, do a test and see which one you can fit more wood in - you may be surprised...
No doubt the Jotul is more of a "hot and fast" burner while the Intrepid is more even keeled...at least the older models I've seen were this way.
Anyway - Wood in=BTU out, most other things being somewhat equal...and they are.
You'd be amazed how much heat even 20K BTU is on a constant basis - still, I have never sold an intrepid to folks who wanted to heat their house with it - it is considered a 1-2 room heater. The Jotul may heat more, but it will not do it for a long burn time.....neither will easily burn overnight....they can burn 6-8 hours, but it takes some practice.
Not having read the other threads, etc. I don't know exactly what you are trying to do. But if I had to heat my house 24/7 with a stove, I'd probably pick neither of those models......but stoves are bought for a lot of other reasons (both of those are "fine furniture"), and some people have limited wood. If you are only going to burn 1 cord a year, it is better to burn it in a small stove than a large one.
A couple things - if you are going to compare those stoves apple to apples, do a test and see which one you can fit more wood in - you may be surprised...
No doubt the Jotul is more of a "hot and fast" burner while the Intrepid is more even keeled...at least the older models I've seen were this way.
Anyway - Wood in=BTU out, most other things being somewhat equal...and they are.
You'd be amazed how much heat even 20K BTU is on a constant basis - still, I have never sold an intrepid to folks who wanted to heat their house with it - it is considered a 1-2 room heater. The Jotul may heat more, but it will not do it for a long burn time.....neither will easily burn overnight....they can burn 6-8 hours, but it takes some practice.
Not having read the other threads, etc. I don't know exactly what you are trying to do. But if I had to heat my house 24/7 with a stove, I'd probably pick neither of those models......but stoves are bought for a lot of other reasons (both of those are "fine furniture"), and some people have limited wood. If you are only going to burn 1 cord a year, it is better to burn it in a small stove than a large one.
In modern stoves isn't it better to run them hot enough so that either the secondary burn or cat is running efficiently ? If I'm running a larger stove throttled back can I get a clean burn? With my big schrader I'm constantly tending it to keep the stack temp in the orange and stovetop temp about 400 degrees. I can't load it up and damp down, it doesn't seal well enough to get a slow controlled burn. At 1000 sf I'm really only trying to heat 2 of the rooms, living room 325 sf and dining room/kitchen 230 sf. the two bedrooms get enough heat and the bath room if it gets too cold I turn on the electric oil filled radiator for taking a shower. My pellet stove in the diningroom is on a thermostat so I'm looking to run the wood stove like I do the schrader, build a fire when I get home from work during the week and all day on the week ends.
I should add that last winter I burned two tons of pellets and 1 1/2 cords of fir. This winter I have 2 1/2 cord of fir and about 1 cord of big leaf maple. I hope by burning more wood I'll only go thru 1 ton of pellets. Last winter I didn't use the woodstove every night. roben.
Ah, OK, I thought you were trying to wean off the pellet stove.
But I am confused. In one case you are concerned about the Intrepid not putting out enough heat. In the other you are concerned about too much heat from a slightly larger stove.
The heat output from any stove is in large part how you burn it. The new stove will be easier to regulate than the old Schrader. Once the wood is charred and the secondaries burning, you can turn it down for a longer burn. It's fine if it hovers around 450-500. You can also regulate the output by the size of the splits and how much wood you put in the stove or shorter fires.
Any of the 3 stoves will work. Your setup is how we had our house setup before the remodel. I had the pellet stove as the primary heater and the 3CB as a wood stove. It worked out well except in very cold weather. The Alderlea T4 is not too big either. You will start it up, get it up to temp (500-600). Once the wood is charred, turn it down for the long burn. Personally, I think the PE stove will give you better reserves for a bad cold snap and during power outages. If this is a non-issue, then go for the Intrepid for the longer burns.
But I am confused. In one case you are concerned about the Intrepid not putting out enough heat. In the other you are concerned about too much heat from a slightly larger stove.
The heat output from any stove is in large part how you burn it. The new stove will be easier to regulate than the old Schrader. Once the wood is charred and the secondaries burning, you can turn it down for a longer burn. It's fine if it hovers around 450-500. You can also regulate the output by the size of the splits and how much wood you put in the stove or shorter fires.
Any of the 3 stoves will work. Your setup is how we had our house setup before the remodel. I had the pellet stove as the primary heater and the 3CB as a wood stove. It worked out well except in very cold weather. The Alderlea T4 is not too big either. You will start it up, get it up to temp (500-600). Once the wood is charred, turn it down for the long burn. Personally, I think the PE stove will give you better reserves for a bad cold snap and during power outages. If this is a non-issue, then go for the Intrepid for the longer burns.
thanks Begreen, In the beginning I was considering fazing out the pellet stove but the more I learned on this site I realize that is not too practical . If I got a stove large enough for 24/7 I think it would be too hot in my living room. I want to use the pellet to keep the house from getting too cold when I'm away during the day. I do want a stove that will heat during power outages. last winter had one that lasted 3 days. I just thought that trying to run a medium sized stove with a small fire would be a polluter like my smoke dragon. I guess I should consider a VC encore or Jotul castine along with the PE T4. roben.
check out this link to a vermont castings plant video
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3397773981046662187
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3397773981046662187
Thanks Elk, that was a very cool video! So do you think an Intrepid II would be adequate or should I consider the Encore? roben.
webbie
Seasoned Moderator
elkimmeg said:
Oregon, we usually discourage blatant commercials here on the forum, and this sales video is a perfect example. Since you are new, I'm not certain if you know that Elk has an interest in Vermont Castings that goes above being an owner of two (or more) of them. He has certain relationships with the plant and management in Vermont.
No problem if you asked "hey, can someone point me to a video of how these stoves are made?", but in this case (and many others) Elk has an agenda that is a bit more than just being a stove owner.
Just thought you should know - it's always "buyer beware" in stove shopping and I would suggest you cast a wide net, look at all the reviews and see what stove best fits your needs.
Thank you webmaster, after being on this site for a couple months i am well aware that you and Elk have "issues". I am only trying to make an informed decision . roben.
webbie
Seasoned Moderator
Cool.
Maybe VC should officially hire him so he can put it in his signature, then we won't have to worry anymore about it.
Maybe VC should officially hire him so he can put it in his signature, then we won't have to worry anymore about it.
Mike Wilson
New Member
VC and Jotul stoves both suck. They are made from recycled Vogelzangs. I think the paint may be from China.
Buy an Englander.
Buy an Englander.
webbie
Seasoned Moderator
Well, we can see what happens when folks "push" a brand with a bit more than just a casual mention!
I guess I should suggest that you buy a stove from the sponsors that pay me the most and have been with me the longest - that would be Woodstock and Jotul.
But I won't do that. I'll continue to say that you have to take some time, talk to dealers, read the reviews, etc.
I guess I should suggest that you buy a stove from the sponsors that pay me the most and have been with me the longest - that would be Woodstock and Jotul.
But I won't do that. I'll continue to say that you have to take some time, talk to dealers, read the reviews, etc.
With the quality of stove manufacture these days buy the size and looks you like and you can't go wrong. If you get one with something wrong with it pretty much every stove maker is going to take care of it.
Thanks guys, I spend so much time on this forum i should be a sponsor. :-S I just need the perfect combination of looks and performance. I want a cast stove because I stare at plate steel and shapes all day long at work, I want to look at something different when I get home. roben
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