Castile convection blower assembly question

[smalltown]

Very happy with my Quad Castile. This upcoming heating season will be my second year. If I could change one thing it would be a quieter convection fan assembly. It's not making any strange noises so I don't think it's defective, rather I think it's just the design that is using what I'd call twin squirrel cages. Has anybody tried to change their convection blowers or modified them for less noise? Mine is still in warranty so I don't see me changing anything right now. I do wonder about twin muffin fans especially 2 that rotate in opposite direction yet blow the air in the same direction to reduce noise. I am thinking that all that would be necessary would be to move the same amount of air as the OEM convection blower.
Just imagine a Castile without convection blower noise!

 

[smwilliamson]

Very happy with my Quad Castile. This upcoming heating season will be my second year. If I could change one thing it would be a quieter convection fan assembly. It's not making any strange noises so I don't think it's defective, rather I think it's just the design that is using what I'd call twin squirrel cages. Has anybody tried to change their convection blowers or modified them for less noise? Mine is still in warranty so I don't see me changing anything right now. I do wonder about twin muffin fans especially 2 that rotate in opposite direction yet blow the air in the same direction to reduce noise. I am thinking that all that would be necessary would be to move the same amount of air as the OEM convection blower.
Just imagine a Castile without convection blower noise!

I'm not sure what you would change it to. Anything with less RPM would fail in the system. Something needs to cool the air between the firebox and the fuel.

 

[smalltown]

[/quote] I'm not sure what you would change it to. Anything with less RPM would fail in the system. Something needs to cool the air between the firebox and the fuel.[/quote]

I am certainly no expert with these stoves, but looking at what Castile information I have read (It's not particularly in depth) it indicates that there are three different voltages applied to the convection fan assembly 115V for the high, 94v for medium and 84V for the low position, further it states the convection fan assembly moves 160CFM of air although it does not state on which setting. I am assuming that this is when the fan is running on the high setting. This could be conjecture on my part, but I don't think the Castile electronics is sophisticated enough that it senses the RPM's of the convection blower motor. I do not see any sensing leads from the motor. So I was wondering if my assumptions are valid and if 2 combined muffin fans could be found that pushed a total of at least 160CFM, and would operate with the 3 different applied voltages it would seem plausible to remove the convection blower assembly and modify it to accept the 2 muffin fans along with constructing a small sheet metal shroud to direct the air flow as the old assembly used to. Then bolt the modified convection blower housing assembly back onto the stove.

There is of course the issue of if there ever was a fire regardless of the cause I would imagine the manufacturer would point a finger, and say it was the mod that should never have been done. Just thinking out loud here.

 

[Havlat24]

I'm not sure what you would change it to. Anything with less RPM would fail in the system. Something needs to cool the air between the firebox and the fuel.[/quote]

I am certainly no expert with these stoves, but looking at what Castile information I have read (It's not particularly in depth) it indicates that there are three different voltages applied to the convection fan assembly 115V for the high, 94v for medium and 84V for the low position, further it states the convection fan assembly moves 160CFM of air although it does not state on which setting. I am assuming that this is when the fan is running on the high setting. This could be conjecture on my part, but I don't think the Castile electronics is sophisticated enough that it senses the RPM's of the convection blower motor. I do not see any sensing leads from the motor. So I was wondering if my assumptions are valid and if 2 combined muffin fans could be found that pushed a total of at least 160CFM, and would operate with the 3 different applied voltages it would seem plausible to remove the convection blower assembly and modify it to accept the 2 muffin fans along with constructing a small sheet metal shroud to direct the air flow as the old assembly used to. Then bolt the modified convection blower housing assembly back onto the stove.

There is of course the issue of if there ever was a fire regardless of the cause I would imagine the manufacturer would point a finger, and say it was the mod that should never have been done. Just thinking out loud here.[/quote]

When we test dry kilns for airflow, we use airflow meters... the little devices are quite accurate in measuring air flow.. I have a sante fe... never though of taking the airflow meter home to measure CFM.... maybe I will.



Chris C.

 

[smalltown]

Thanks Chris. I am not sure but the Santa Fe is very similar to the Castile and I wonder if you have the same convection blower as the Castile? If so wouldn't you agree they are noisier than they should be?

 

[jtakeman]

smalltown,

I think you will find that the problem is how the air passes thru the stove and not so much the fan. Also the stove body will amplify the noise of the fan. Pull the fan out of the stove and plug it in with a lamp cord and see if it seems more or less noisey to you?

Your fan at voltage at full voltage is 160CFM

84V=117CFM

94V=131CFM

Does your motor have an RPM rating?

I have been tinkering with my stove and found that if the motor is a shaded pole motor. You need to replace it with such. Other wise the control will not control the fan speed. It will run at full RPM all the time. So you would nee to figure out what type motor you have and replace it with the same. I would also stay with the same or less amp draw as to not tax the control board. Seems they only build the boards to handle that fan and not much more. If you increase the fan too large with more amp draw. There is a chance the board can't handle it.

When you take tha fan out please snap a picture of the label on the motor. And a overall picture of it. There isn't alot of info out there and I would like to try crossing these. I did the same with the Breckwell fans. The replacements are actually the same fan, Without the factory part number and large price tag. But they bolt in and last just as long. It may help others down the road!

Thanks
jay

 

[Havlat24]

Thanks Chris. I am not sure but the Santa Fe is very similar to the Castile and I wonder if you have the same convection blower as the Castile? If so wouldn't you agree they are noisier than they should be?

Its pretty loud on high.... sometimes something rattles on it somewhere and i need to give the top the old "FONZ Slap" to make it stop. Pretty reliable stove... and it loves Spruce Pointe Pellets...which is nice because the mill is across the street for where I work.

 

[Havlat24]

On a side note, the Castille and the Sante Fe are pretty much identical aside from cosmetic design.... it sure would be nice if the fan speed not linked to the burn rate... by that i mean putting the fan on high while the burn rate is on medium... or any variation of the 3 settings.

 

[jtakeman]

On a side note, the Castille and the Sante Fe are pretty much identical aside from cosmetic design.... it sure would be nice if the fan speed not linked to the burn rate... by that i mean putting the fan on high while the burn rate is on medium... or any variation of the 3 settings.

I think they did that in feer that some one would turn the stove to high but forget to increase the fan. This wouls overheat the stove. So they just tied them to the same speed.

If you want to there is a way around it. Use the factory wiring to just turn on a relay to turn fan on and off. Use a fan speed control and 115V power off the relay. You could vary the speed anywhere you wanted. Stove on low fan on high. But I would not recomend if the stove is under warrenty. It could void it.

 

[Havlat24]

On a side note, the Castille and the Sante Fe are pretty much identical aside from cosmetic design.... it sure would be nice if the fan speed not linked to the burn rate... by that i mean putting the fan on high while the burn rate is on medium... or any variation of the 3 settings.

I think they did that in feer that some one would turn the stove to high but forget to increase the fan. This wouls overheat the stove. So they just tied them to the same speed.

If you want to there is a way around it. Use the factory wiring to just turn on a relay to turn fan on and off. Use a fan speed control and 115V power off the relay. You could vary the speed anywhere you wanted. Stove on low fan on high. But I would not recomend if the stove is under warrenty. It could void it.

Yeah I agree thats probably why they are linked.... I love my sante fe, its a great stove, but Im sure if I could put my fan to high with a medium burn rate I'd be at the sweet spot on really cold days.


Chris C.

 

[Meneillys]

[quote author="havlat24" date="1282464863
Its pretty loud on high.... sometimes something rattles on it somewhere and i need to give the top the old "FONZ Slap" to make it stop. Pretty reliable stove... and it loves Spruce Pointe Pellets...which is nice because the mill is across the street for where I work.[/quote]

I found that the sheet metal above the door liked to rattle against the top of the stove. I bent it down slightly and the noise went away.

 

[smwilliamson]

Just to toss it out there, the control box for the Castille are near $400. Don't blow it!

 

[tjnamtiw]

Yeah I agree thats probably why they are linked.... I love my sante fe, its a great stove, but Im sure if I could put my fan to high with a medium burn rate I'd be at the sweet spot on really cold days.


Chris C.

I'm with you on the speeds! I wish it had a separate control but with safety built in (idiot proof). If you look at the logic of the whole operation, it is so darn simple that they should be ashamed to charge that much for the control box. The only thing keeping you from replacing it with a small plc is the amp loads for the starter and the fans, but a few relays would take care of that with some load resistors dropping the voltage. Once they are out of warranty, that's my pet project so I can have more control and also trouble shooting lights checking on each step. Pretty darn simple. So many choices of microcomputers and plc's out there. Even ezautomation, that I used at work, would be wonderful.

 

[peirhead]

smalltown,

I think you will find that the problem is how the air passes thru the stove and not so much the fan. Also the stove body will amplify the noise of the fan. Pull the fan out of the stove and plug it in with a lamp cord and see if it seems more or less noisey to you?

Your fan at voltage at full voltage is 160CFM

84V=117CFM

94V=131CFM

Does your motor have an RPM rating?

I have been tinkering with my stove and found that if the motor is a shaded pole motor. You need to replace it with such. Other wise the control will not control the fan speed. It will run at full RPM all the time. So you would nee to figure out what type motor you have and replace it with the same. I would also stay with the same or less amp draw as to not tax the control board. Seems they only build the boards to handle that fan and not much more. If you increase the fan too large with more amp draw. There is a chance the board can't handle it.

When you take tha fan out please snap a picture of the label on the motor. And a overall picture of it. There isn't alot of info out there and I would like to try crossing these. I did the same with the Breckwell fans. The replacements are actually the same fan, Without the factory part number and large price tag. But they bolt in and last just as long. It may help others down the road!

Thanks
jay

I know this is an old posting, but Jakeman I was wondering if you have the CFM ratings for low and med for the combustion fan on the castile?? ...I can see that on High it is 80 CFM Thanks!!