Castile Flame Running Too High

[Harris Magoon]

I've run a Castile pellet stove on wood pellets for 5 years with good results. Part way through the current season, I noticed that the flame gets too high, reaching the guard under the heat exchanger tubes until a new charge of pellets hit the burn pot and knock it down. This pattern seems to happen after 8 hours of burning, getting progressively worse until I shut it down and clean it out. There is also black soot inside the stove, which never happened before.

Originally I thought it was an air issue, so I thoroughly vacumed out the stove, behind the bricks, under the heat exchanger tubes, inside the exhaust pipe, and I took apart the exhaust pipe right behind the stove to vacume that out as well as far inside the stove i could reach from that end. It didn't help.

Then I replaced the door gasket and the gasket on the cleanout door. That didn't help.

My current hypothesis is that it's dumping too many pellets into the burn pot. The feed hole is adjusted as small as the adjustment allows. I've tried several kinds of pellets.

Has anyone had this problem, or does anyone have any thoughts of what to try next?

Thank you,
Harris

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Did you clean all of the holes out in your burn pot.

How is the burn pot gasket?

Has your combustion blower ever been removed and cleaned? You need a gasket on hand before attempting to clean this and the area it sits in.

Is the air intake clean?

The area under the burn pot is it clean?

How does your combustion blower sound, does it appear to be weak and not running at speed?

You have an air issue, you just haven't located it yet.

 

[PoolGuyinCT]

I've been down this road before, monster flame in castile insert, clean holy hell out of exhaust.

When you vacuum you are not dislodging anything significant.

Clean out gasket, burn pot gasket? I didn't know castile had these, dam!

Ray

 

[tjnamtiw]

Clean out gasket, burn pot gasket? I didn't know castile had these, dam!

Ray

I never heard of them either It sounds like you cleaned everything but the exhaust and the combustion blower. Smokey and PoolGuy's suggestions should ALL be followed and answered for us to keep helping, Is the flame lazy now or is it still swirling and blue/yellow like a blast furnace? This one is important to answer too.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

I never heard of them either It sounds like you cleaned everything but the exhaust and the combustion blower. Smokey and PoolGuy's suggestions should ALL be followed and answered for us to keep helping, Is the flame lazy now or is it still swirling and blue/yellow like a blast furnace? This one is important to answer too.

Hey, I just toss common Quad problem causes out there. The last Castile I saw had a nice almost pure white with a blue base flame just a swirling in the pot, looked like you could have done some metal cutting with it.

 

[tjnamtiw]

Hey, I just toss common Quad problem causes out there. The last Castile I saw had a nice almost pure white with a blue base flame just a swirling in the pot, looked like you could have done some metal cutting with it.

Yep, I thought of throwing in some screw driver tips to case harden them

 

[Harris Magoon]

Thanks VERY much for your responses! Yes, I took a small piece of wire to make sure every hole in the burn pot was clean. Like PoolGuy, I didn't know about the burn pot gasket, but now I do see it on the diagram. I cleaned the impeller on the combustion blower as well as I could but did not take it out. Is it difficult to remove? The outside air intake seems to be clear. The ash pan sits directly under the burn pot, and I dump that every cleaning. The blower sounds the same as it always has.

There is no hint of blue in the flame. It's all yellow except when it gets really tall, it's a little orangey around the edges.

Thanks again!

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

You need something other than a small piece of wire for those burn pot holes, there is build up that decreases their size and the holes have to cleaned back to their original sizes.

I'll let tj talk about combustion blower cleaning on that unit.

 

[Harris Magoon]

There didn't seem to be any buildup, but I'll check tomorrow when I take the exhaust fan out.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Can you get from the firebox out to the combustion blower cavity?

Have you checked your vent in particular the termination cap they get plugged up with ash from the stove going through repeated burn cycles.

About combustion blowers if the edges of the impeller get rounded over with just a little ash the air flow gets reduced by a good amount.

We are playing with a very fine balance and several small things can make as much difference as a single big one would.

 

[tjnamtiw]

Smokey's right about the termination cap. I was surprised when I climbed up to mine to see how much soot had accumulated on the screen. The absence of any blue in the flame points, IMHO, to an airflow issue. I use a .32 caliber pistol bore brush for my holes although I admit it's worn down to about a .22 caliber now. I keep putting off getting a new one.
So that's two good places to start to look for restrictions in airflow. I'd also check underneath the burnpot to make sure that the cleanout dump valve is not sagging down away from the pot by more than the thickness of a dime. If you leak air there, then less air comes into the small holes and you don't get as good a burn. Now we're up to 3 things to check.

 

[Harris Magoon]

To get from the firebox to the combustion blower, I take out that right side brick. I cleaned off the impeller and tried to reach into the cavity as well as I could. There's not much space there between the fins of the impeller. I guess that's why it's necessary to take out the blower to get to that space. It sounds like that's what I should try next. I'll get the gasket before I start the job though.

I know what you mean about the termination cap. I have a screen on the end of the exhaust pipe that I go out and just tap it a bit, and the ash falls right off it. Then once in awhile I take it off and vacume out the whole pipe.

I used a wood stove many years and appreciate the precise science of getting the right fuel/air mixture to get the optimum heat output. It also amazes me how clean these stoves run.

 

[Harris Magoon]

Thanks, TJ. I'll try the brush I use on my 250 Savage on those holes tomorrow.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Well a few of us on here are quite obsessed with keeping our air paths clean.

If you ever get hold of a real ash maker pellet you'll quickly understand why.

While you are at it try to think of anything that you have changed in your house since the stove last burned correctly, I'm interested in things done to tighten up the house or in the way of other devices that burn fuel or move air.

 

[tjnamtiw]

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs...l1-1-_-NA-_-100660183-_-N#product_description
I just spied this gem while searching for a miniature vacuum attachment set that I bought. The piece with the clear hose would be perfect for snaking back into the combustion blower cavity at each cleaning. That's what I do with my 'not so pretty' version.

 

[Harris Magoon]

The only thing I've done is take out the Christmas tree. The pellets I used last year from the Strong pellet mill were AWFUL. Funny thing, they were okay the previous year.

I like the looks of that hose. Using one of those I might be able to clean the airway behind the exhaust fan without removing the blower.

Thanks very much for your help!

 

[Stevekng]

Smokey's right about the termination cap. I was surprised when I climbed up to mine to see how much soot had accumulated on the screen. The absence of any blue in the flame points, IMHO, to an airflow issue. I use a .32 caliber pistol bore brush for my holes although I admit it's worn down to about a .22 caliber now. I keep putting off getting a new one.
So that's two good places to start to look for restrictions in airflow. I'd also check underneath the burnpot to make sure that the cleanout dump valve is not sagging down away from the pot by more than the thickness of a dime. If you leak air there, then less air comes into the small holes and you don't get as good a burn. Now we're up to 3 things to check.

There is a tool that comes with the castille that is made for cleaning the pot air holes. The door that opens the access for the ash pan has a gasket that should prevent air leakage. The quad tech that put my castille in 5 years ago had to remount the latch to the ash pan door because it was on upside down; causing air leakage.The tech said." The factory assemblers don't always assemble this right and it will cause smoke and air leakage".

 

[Harris Magoon]

Funny thing, mine was the same way. In the course of replacing the gasket on the cleanout door, I noticed that it didn't shut tightly. There was a gaping hole around the latch itself. There were two spacers behind the nut holding the latch on from the inside. I put one of the spacers behind the door handle, and now the thing shuts tight. I never have seen the blue flame that Smokey mentioned, so I wonder whether it has actually run properly to begin with.

I really like this stove and am determined to get it fixed. I'm off to the parts store to get that exhaust fan gasket.

Thank you for your help!

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Burn quality can be quite touchy a lot of things have to be exactly right. The unit I got to watch had been taken care of very well and appeared to have access to outside air. I didn't ask the owner but suspect that is the case. He was busy with a house full of guests.

He has been burning his stove since early 2009.

 

[kinsmanstoves]

without reading any other posts I will tell you to close the restricter flap in the hopper, that will slow down the flow of pellets.

Eric

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

without reading any other posts I will tell you to close the restricter flap in the hopper, that will slow down the flow of pellets.

Eric

Already been done from post #1 "The feed hole is adjusted as small as the adjustment allows. I've tried several kinds of pellets."

 

[kinsmanstoves]

What is the setting on the control box? Did someone up the feed?


Eric

 

[tjnamtiw]

Something is not right! Neither my Castile or my Sante Fe, both built in 2007, came with a tool to cleanout the holes, not does either one have a door to close off the ash pan access! You swing open the cast door front on the Castile, and there is the ash pan waiting to be pulled out. Also, before I layered in high temp gasket, there was a huge gap for air to be sucked into. It still can be sucked in under the pan. I would sure love to see a picture of this mystery ash pan door.

 

[SwineFlue]

What setting are you running the stove on (low/med/high)? Does the stove act the same on all settings?

Something is not right! Neither my Castile or my Sante Fe, both built in 2007, came with a tool to cleanout the holes, not does either one have a door to close off the ash pan access! You swing open the cast door front on the Castile, and there is the ash pan waiting to be pulled out. Also, before I layered in high temp gasket, there was a huge gap for air to be sucked into. It still can be sucked in under the pan. I would sure love to see a picture of this mystery ash pan door.

swing open the cast door front, and see: glass door, under that is the small access panel for the ignitor, below that is a gasketted full-width door to the ash pan. Does the Castile Insert not have that bottom door?

Anyway... IMO the gasket on that ash door is irrelevant. All burnpot airflow (whether indoor or OAK) comes from the ashpan area. Air leaking into the ashpan will not hurt the burn. I assume the gasket is to keep any smoke from smoldering freshly-dumped ash from getting into the room.

 

[DexterDay]

The Santa Fe doesn't have a complicated ash trap/exhaust system. It's a couple of baffle plates and the blower can be seen and felt behind the right side panel.

If that area is clean, comb vanes are clean, and the vent (and Vent CAP) are clean, then it could be a slowing/failing combustion blower?

Have you tried to oil the 2 sealed bearings? They still suck oil in, even being sealed?

I'd normally say check intake too, but Quads are not a sealed system and this unit can get air from several locations if one was plugged or had something stopping it.