Certifiable nut looking for a stove (insert?) in south Alabama

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True dat. Forklift would be best. . .makes getting it into your pickup really easy. :) Might as well call Woodstock, give them your ZIP, and find out how close they can get to you with one of their carrier's depots. Don't be surprised if you find yourself talking to them for 30 mins about all of your requirements and eventually ordering from them. :)
 
I'm limping along here...

Quick comment... The Woodstocks appear to require a 7" flue. I'm a bit hestitant to invest $$$ in a 7" flue being as most stoves of this size call for a 6" flue. Am I right to be thinking/concerned about this or am I going overboard worrying about things that I shouldn't?

Ed
 
Generally, you want chimney size = flue collar exit..best chance for optimum draft. And 7" is in the minority. The smaller Woodstocks - Keystone - have 7 " flues while the larger Fireview has 6" flue...go figure. Woodstock had refurbished stoves on half price sale last month. Check with them - may be a great deal.
 
Intheswamp said:
I'm limping along here...

Quick comment... The Woodstocks appear to require a 7" flue. I'm a bit hestitant to invest $$$ in a 7" flue being as most stoves of this size call for a 6" flue. Am I right to be thinking/concerned about this or am I going overboard worrying about things that I shouldn't?

Ed

Their stoves are approved for 6" flue and they sell an adapter. I bought one for mine.
 
Try calling Lehman's - 888-438-5346. They are a catalog oufit in Ohio. They carry many stove lines, but not are all listed on their web site due to manufacturer's restrictions. They have excellent customer service and technical know how. We had a stove shipped from them to our local FedEx freight terminal. The price was several hundred dollars less with shipping than we could have gotten locally.

http://www.lehmans.com/store/Stoves___Heat_Stoves?Args=&view;_all=&sort;_by=
 
tutu_sue said:
Try calling Lehman's - 888-438-5346. They are a catalog oufit in Ohio. They carry many stove lines, but not are all listed on their web site due to manufacturer's restrictions. They have excellent customer service and technical know how. We had a stove shipped from them to our local FedEx freight terminal. The price was several hundred dollars less with shipping than we could have gotten locally.

http://www.lehmans.com/store/Stoves___Heat_Stoves?Args=&view;_all=&sort;_by=
Thanks for the tip on Lehman's...I hadn't thought about them. I'm beginning to get some pricing on some things now. Ed
 
Well, I'm still studying over stove manuals and trying to figure things out. Here is some info I'm comparing taking into consideration that my install has:

* Limited lintel clearance: 27" (the big factor here)
* Limited hearth width to sidewall: 53-1/2"

These are the three stoves in the running:

Quadra-Fire Yosemite
Centerline of rear flue exit: -
Theoretical top of flue: 22-7/16" (what the drawings show)
Maximum height remaining for hearth pad: (27" minus 22-7/16")
Required hearth R-value: 2.2 (was not found in manual, had to email QuadraFire for it)
Width of Stove: 25-5/8"
Width of hearth: 53-1/2"
Clearance required to sidewall required: 10"
Clearance required with heatshield : N/A
Total stove width plus unshielded sidewall clearance: 45-5/8" (fits by ~8")
*No Mantel shield is required.
Log size: 18"
Firebox size: 1.45cf
Weight: 365 lbs
Pros: (1) It's 1.46cf firebox is almost a half a cubic foot larger than the fireboxes of the other two stoves. (2) It appears that no side wall or mantel shields will be required. (3) Longer burn times(?) (4) Welded steel firebox and firebricks...should extend heating time (?).
Cons: (1) Will require a heavier duty hearth pad. (2) I have read of issues with the side door handle not securely latching. (3) I am not sure if the Yosemite has had as much real-life use by consumers...seems not as many owners here...??? (4) Heaviest stove of these three due to welded steel firebox and firebricks (which is probably a good thing) (5) Baffle design causes problems sometimes with logs rolling out the front (or am I thinking of another stove...they say your memory is one of the first things to go). (6) Apparently not much choice in finishes...cast iron or mahogany.

Jotul F3CB
Centerline of rear flue exit: 22-9/16"
Theoretical top of flue: 25-9/16"
Maximum height remaining for hearth pad: 1-7/16" (27" minus 25-9/16")
Required hearth R-value: 1.1
Width of Stove: 22-3/4"
Width of hearth: 53-1/2"
Clearance required to sidewall required: 24"
Clearance required with heatshield : 14-2/5" (Figured at conservative 60% of unshielded)
Total stove width plus 60% clearance with shields: 51-11/20" (fits by ~2")
Log size: 18"
Firebox size: ~1.0cf
Weight: 265 lbs
Pros: (1) Well known brand and quality. (2) Supposedly easy to learn to burn. (3) I like the looks<grin>. (3) Quality and durability are recognized as being high. (4) Several finishes to pick from...for me it's either unpainted cast iron or the blue/black enamel. (5) Seems to be the most popular stove of the three listed here...there must be a reason(?).
Cons: (1) The biggest "con" is the small firebox which relates directly to shorter burn times, not much of a chance of getting an overnight burn (chances are slim to none). (2) The ash drawer is a bit on the small side...ash build-up behind the drawer can cause problems shutting the drawer. (3) Did I mention a small firebox?

Morso 2010
Centerline of rear flue exit: 23-1/4"
Theoretical top of flue: 26-1/4"
Maximum height remaining for hearth pad: 3/4" (27" minus 26-1/4")
Required hearth R-value: 1.0
Width of Stove: 23-5/8"
Width of hearth: 53-1/2"
Clearance required to sidewall required: 22"
Clearance required with heatshield : 13-1/5" (Figured at conservative 60% of unshielded)
Total stove width plus 60% clearance with shields: 50-1/40" (fits by ~3-1/2")
*Mantel shield is required.
Log size: 18-1/2"
Firebox size: 1.093cf
Weight: 279 lbs
Pros: (1) Nice looking stove and recommended by several people. (2) I haven't heard really any negatives about this stove. (3) Probably a touch bigger firebox than the F3CB
Cons: (1) Small firebox. (2) Not much discussion about this stove.

Lot's of information there (basically getting it together for my use) but also for any of you to look over and see if I've made any errors in figuring things....and, of course, if anybody else can use the information. ;)

Ed
Sitting here going slowly nuts one brain cell at a time...

P.S. Not responsible for typographical or punctuational or hieroglyphical mistakes...my apologies to King Tut, how'd you get so funky, King Tut... ...one cell at a...
 
If you have access to those three stoves I'd go measure the actual usable fire box space. I think some manufactures fire box measurements may be off or include space above the baffles. Maybe even ask them if you could load some splits in them for a comparison.
 
Todd said:
If you have access to those three stoves I'd go measure the actual usable fire box space. I think some manufactures fire box measurements may be off or include space above the baffles. Maybe even ask them if you could load some splits in them for a comparison.
I wish it was that easy...probably the closest stove store to me is going to be about 100 miles...one reason I'm trying to do so much homework online. :) The store that I've spoken with some and really like is about 195 miles from me...they carry both the F3CB and the Yosemite. The guy there seemed to really enjoy talking stoves with me, seemed like an older guy. Me and my wife are supposed to be traveling basically through his town in a few weeks and I'm hoping we can drop in on him. Interesting, but he said he's never really kept the blue/black enamel F3CB in stock much, pretty much all the other colors, though. Anyhow...

Ed
 
You are the perfect candidate for buying online. Nobody is going to provide anything for you anywhere near "locally".
 
Intheswamp said:
Todd said:
If you have access to those three stoves I'd go measure the actual usable fire box space. I think some manufactures fire box measurements may be off or include space above the baffles. Maybe even ask them if you could load some splits in them for a comparison.
I wish it was that easy...probably the closest stove store to me is going to be about 100 miles...one reason I'm trying to do so much homework online. :) The store that I've spoken with some and really like is about 195 miles from me...they carry both the F3CB and the Yosemite. The guy there seemed to really enjoy talking stoves with me, seemed like an older guy. Me and my wife are supposed to be traveling basically through his town in a few weeks and I'm hoping we can drop in on him. Interesting, but he said he's never really kept the blue/black enamel F3CB in stock much, pretty much all the other colors, though. Anyhow...

Ed

I wasn't impressed with the Yosemite when I looked at it. The side loading door is tiny and imo useless. The fire box looks smaller than advertised, maybe someone could measure.

The Morso is pretty cool looking but a 1.1 cu ft fire box? Too small for me, it would be tough to just build a fire in there. I think it's more of a one room heater. Also don't know if I like the air controls, is there one on each door? Kind a looks like the old spin knob type on old air tights, could be a pain to get use to?

Jotul has a good rep and I think it would be a safe bet. They have been building stoves for a long long time.
 
The F3 may be loved by all but that little sucker is just too small of a firebox to heat a house. Does fine in my basement office but that is because I am there to keep feeding it.

Go big or go home.

Roll Tide.
 
BrotherBart said:
The F3 may be loved by all but that little sucker is just too small of a firebox to heat a house. Does fine in my basement office but that is because I am there to keep feeding it.

Go big or go home.

Roll Tide.

Classic :), but true.
 
Don't forget this is southern AL and the fellow already has a geothermal heat pump.

Intheswamp, what is your worst case heating bill for a month?
 
BeGreen said:
Just don't forget this is southern AL.

Cold is cold. Just for shorter periods in some places. I heated with wood in a house halfway between Fort Worth and Dallas. In the only month in history, before this year, where it never got over 32 degrees. If I was going to try to heat a house with the .93 cubic foot firebox in an F3 in any winter weather I would just buy a kerosene heater. Well maybe not. I have two stored in the garage.

And the coldest week I ever lived through was in basic training in South Louisiana. Of course some of that was because I had to low crawl in the snow. ;-P
 
Ok, getting back to the beginning. :)

I'm looking for something to compliment my geothermal system, it doesn't have to replace it completely. We are located south of Montgomery, Alabama where we get the oily gulf breezes blowing in and when it snows an inch...maybe two, it shuts the area down and they bring out the dump trucks loaded with sand (certainly they don't have any salt!), schools let out, and the national guard armories are on stand by. This past winter, though, was the worst we've had in a while and had a lengthy spell of sub-freezing temps and several inches of snow (yelp it shut things down). If I can heat a couple of rooms during sho'nuff cold times I'll be pretty happy. I know you can just build a small fire in a large stove but 'm just afraid that a large heater might be a little overwhelming in our living room. Plus, the clearance and venting issues will be much greater. But, if I was to go larger it would probably be the Jotul Castine. :)

Also, I'm looking at it as an emergency backup shut we be without power during a cold spell...just this morning I had the Alabama Department of Transportation, Alabama Power/REA, and Centurylink phone all scurrying around my house....lots of cutting bushes, limbs back from power lines, burying a telephone cable, etc.,. It was kinda weird seeing all these different utility companies/agencies around my place (I live rural). Ya'll don't reckon' they got a six sense like those elephants and other animals that headed for high ground when that tsunami hit Indonesia, do you?!!! :gulp:


Montgomery, AL Jan. April July Oct.
Average Temps 46.6 64.3 81.8 65.4


Avg Hi Avg Low Avg Year Record Hi Record Low
Birmingham 73.4 50.9 62.2 107/1930 -6/1985
Huntsville 71.1 50.1 60.6 104/1966 -11/1966
Mobile 77.4 56.2 66.8 104/1952 3/1985
Montgomery 77.0 53.1 65.0 105/1952 0/1985

Cooling is a much bigger chore down here...now if they made a wood-burning air conditioner that'd cool us down THEN we could make some serious money!<grin> Evaporative/swamp coolers don't even work good down here because of the humidity.

Ed
 
The Castine would be nice, but it's too tall. There are about 4 choice to rear-vent here. If you want to go largish, get a Woodstock. In the medium range it looks like Yosemite fits well. On the smaller side it looks like the 3CB or the 2110. The smaller heaters will work fine. You will just be feeding it more often when it gets cold enough to fog your glasses. Seeing that is maybe about 5 days a year, I would focus on covering the other 60 days of winter in south AL.
 
BeGreen said:
The Castine would be nice, but it's too tall. There are about 4 choice to rear-vent here. If you want to go largish, get a Woodstock. In the medium range it looks like Yosemite fits well. On the smaller side it looks like the 3CB or the 2110. The smaller heaters will work fine. You will just be feeding it more often when it gets cold enough to fog your glasses. Seeing that is maybe about 5 days a year, I would focus on covering the other 60 days of winter in south AL.
Your right, BG...the Castine wouldn't do the limbo that's required. Basically what I'm seeing is five stoves that could work...

Medium size:
Yosemite
Hearthstone Homestead
Woodstock Keystone

Small:
F3CB
Morso 2110

The Yosemite is "iffy" with some of the issues noted. The Morso, I just don't get that many reviews on though sounds like a solid stove. The Homestead and Keystone....I dunno, just something about stone stoves. Growing up down here a little west of "Green Fried Tomatoes"-land I just never really saw a stone stove...plenty of cast irons and a few steels. Other than the small firebox, things just seem to lead to....

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http://www.prestontradingpost.com/F3_4s.jpg
 
http://www.mytractorforum.com/images/smilies/14_6_5.gif

The guy pushing the plunger is my realization that I may not have planned correctly...the guy blowing up is my current stove plans...this happened just a few minutes ago when a dim (witted) light went on in the caverns of my skull....

I had pretty much decided on the F3CB and had been researching building a R=1.1 hearth pad, had actually gotten some quotes on stoves, and was going to look at some stoves Monday or Tuesday on the way back from north Georgia.

I figured I'd go ahead and build a hearth that would cover the existing white ceramic tile hearth and would (hopefully) look nice when I got through. I was going to build it "portable", in other words *not* screwed down to the wood floor but rely upon the weight to hold things in place. My hearth layers were pretty much basic....

hearthlayers1Small.jpg


This morning that little dim-wit light came on in my head and warning buzzers started sounding. That 27" lintel has struck again.

22-9/16" center of rear flue (plus) 3" to top of rear flue (equals) 25-9/16"
27" lintel height (minus) 25-9/16" top of rear flue (equals) 1-7/16" clearance above flue
2-3/4" proposed hearth thickness is not going to fit in 1-7/16"......<duh, I'm ah genius!>

If I cut the plywood back to 1/2" and do away with the thinset other than between the durock and the tiles that will bring the height down to only about 2"....still 9/16" too tall.

hearthlayers2cLarge.jpg


The Morso 2110 requires a R=1.0 floor protection so going that route isn't an option, being as that's about where I'm at with the F3CB.

I checked the Quad Yosemite since it is so much shorter than the two stoves above and would have more clearance above it. The email I got from Quadrafire is that the Yosemite requires R-2.2 floor protection. This would involve using two 1/2" pieces of micor but the Yosemite is so short that it would still and would let the stove flue fit under the lintel...actually the whole stove could still fit in the fireplaces firebox...I'm just not real gung-ho about the Yosemite...
hearthlayer3aMedium.jpg


I guess some options are:

1. See if I can get a short leg kit (but what does this do to the r-value requirement of the floor?)
2. Go with an Quad Yosemite.
3. Go with an insert.
4. Bust a hole in the fireplace and go into the chimney above the damper. (Which would involve a lot of things...)
5. Build a fire outside in a metal drum, wear a dirty trench coat and fingerless gloves...

And I thought I had it figured it out... :-S
<sigh>
Ed
 
Yep, you are getting the picture correctly, though the troweled thinset will be more like +1/8".

I'd be looking at the Woodstock, especially in your climate. It has an easier hearth requirement. With their requirements you could just remove a section of flooring in front of the existing hearth, then lay down some cement board and tile to extend it.

An insert would work too.
 

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Well you don't need 3 layers of thinset for sure. Maybe you can use 1 1/4" cement board screws and eliminate the plywood? I just read in the F3 manual that the short legs reduce the height by 2 1/4 inches and there's nothing I could find about the r-value changing.
 
What about moving the lintel up? Maybe remove a layer or two of bricks to make that opening taller?
 
Yeah, I'm not sure really what to do right now....I'll revisit the Woodstock and take another look at it. It's just that down here in south Alabama I was around cast iron stoves a bit as a kid....not much stone around here, most folks seem to work with brick and cast iron. I guess I'm just accustomed to cast iron and not sure of the stone stoves. If I don't get a good answer on the short leg kit I'll definitely have to be looking at something else or another approach.

I'm going to be away from the computer for a few days so I'll have some time to think about it. Ya'll do some thinking, too. :)

Take care and thanks for the feedback,
Ed
 
Email Lehman's at [email protected] about the short leg kit. Tell them there is nothing in the manual about the R-value with short legs, but you need to be sure. They will ask Jotul directly and get back to you.
 
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