Chimney Fire Help

[stoveguy2esw]

guys i got into this one late , seems that the technical side of the question is well covered.

as for our poster, my advice is to listen intently to what the gentlemen in here have to say for 2 reasons, first, they know what they are talking about. safety and code conformance is what they do for a living. second , they are not in any way going to profit from helping you. they are helping you because they want to. im sure that your installer is willing to help you get your problem rectified, but if there are issues there are none better at picking them out than you will find in here. so answer their questions as accurately as you can, allow them to help you, and your installer ensure that the installation is correct and safe so that you will be able to feel confident in your hearth product and its ability to perform safely.

 

[elkimmeg]

Oh yeah...and be nice to her guys. There's a 50% chance she's a Mets fan.

being nice is giving her correct advice one trip from the fire dept is enough.

Rudy her elbows are after 8' of single wall pipe has dissipated heat its not a short run and a 90. Also there is a good chance it vents into more connector pipe and not class A.

As for ignition if not heat, all it takes is one spark. I reviewed the manufacture's clearance the stove may be ok but 12" for single wall does not cut it even the manual points the 18" required.
Then there is the issue of using double wall in that support box. If the jog requiring elbiws was to adviod a rafter then code allows the ability to cut on and just double head it off not requiring doubling up the two adjoining rafters making the job much easier

Rudy have I been nice to you? safety is the main concern here and getting it done right to make it safer

 

[Hogwildz]

Although it will block that window some, why not just move the stove over and do a straight shot up through the roof & eliminate the elbow altogether?

 

[begreen]

Well I hope she comes back. Barbara, we aren't the fire police here. You're not busted and we're not going to turn you in. But we'd like to see you happy, safe and healthy and are willing to help you out. You did the right thing by asking questions. If you got burned on the installation, there may be a way to help there too.

 

[bcinny]

I can t get to my computer. I'm out of town. I m a red sox fan. You guys have me until this is worked out. I'm reading all advice and will pass it on to my guy. Go patriots. I grew up in mass.

 

[elkimmeg]

Is it possible to scan in a copy of your original bill of sale where your chimney components are itemized? naturally tape over any presonal info. Also we are
not interested in the cost but what you were billed for and it identify the parts.

Do you still have your manual if not one can be downloaded from Vermont castings.. Using your manual and codes, we can detail where your installation does not meet the rquirements.

I also think you mentioned you loading door not closing right?.. I think this should be approached where you know exactly what is required for a compliant setup.
It is quite obious your installers did not read the installation manual, Lack code knowledge, or plain short changed you.

I have to leave now a trip to the bank but promise to detail a parth to getting it correct.. Btw I live 3 miles from the Pats stadium

 

[bcinny]

I want it safe. The receipt says chimney installation. It is not itemized. The stove is dutchwest 1500. I will get more info to you when I get to my computer. Instead of my cell phone. The single wall pipe goes into the double pipe at top and is not connected. Tle store I bought the whole set up and installation is well known and respected in our community. And is coming out to fix the problem when I get bÁck to NY.. I. REALLy appreciate your help and I am learning. I HAD A FIRE. And I DON'T Want it to happen again. Sorry for the typos...At this point safety is the most important. Thanks Barbara

 

[begreen]

OK, that helps a lot. This is why knowing the stove is important. For the DW 1500, the required minimum distance at the back of the stove for a single wall pipe is 9" from the back of the stove to the wall and 11.5" from the pipe edge to the wall. So that looks ok. The next question is the exterior pipe. If that is class A chimney, then you have a safe and legal installation.

The chimney fire most likely is not related to these installation dimensions, but the safety of the installation is. When there is a chimney fire you want to be sure all systems are in tip-top, safe condition. The fire sounds like it is most likely related to either the quality of the wood, or the way the stove is being operated. If the door is not sealing correctly, that could contribute to a runaway fire.

I have to hit the road today myself. But you are in great hands with Elk and the rest of the folks here. I'll pick up again on this thread tonight.

 

[bcinny]

What about the angle of the pipe and what is a run away fire? The volunteer fire chief said the fire was from the cap and the pipe collected creoso at the angle. And I can't get the fire hot, the stack thermostat is only 250 or so. My wood is seasoned dry hard wood. So because the fires not hot I have more creoso.

 

[elkimmeg]

2003 NFPA 211
Chapter 9

9.3 Length.
A connector shall be as short and straight as practicable. The appliance shall be located as close as practicable to the chimney or vent.

9.7.5.1 Any unexposed metal that is used as part of pass-through system and is exposed to flue gases shall be constructed of stainless steel or other equivalent material that resists corrosion, softening, or cracking from flue gases at temperatures up to 1800°F (982°C).

9.7.8 Connectors shall be installed without sharp turns or other construction features that would create excessive resistance to the flow of flue gases.

2006 International Mechanical codes
Chapter 5
504.6.1 Maximum length. . The maximum
length of the duct shall be increased 21/2 feet (762 mm)
for each 45 degree (0.79 rad) bend and 5 feet (1524 mm) for
each 90 degree (1.6 rad) bend.


Your manual limits the length of single wall connector pipe to 10’ Code wise those 2, 45 degree elbows effectively increases the connector run to 13.5’ far exceeding manufacture’s listing. Furthermore two sets of standards are required for compliance to combustibles. The actual stove location, , which appears ok and the clearance required for the connector pipe which your manual states being 18” as does code. I would cut and pasted that code here but it is inn a chart and PDF chart conversions can’t be made to the forum post.

I think BeGreen afte reading the exact cut and paste of governing codes will agree there are issues that have to be addressed to become code compliant. It appease your installers used double wall connector pipe above you single wall pipe. The second code addresses this. This is a blatant disregard for code and
your personal safety. No professional should done as such All it tells m,e is they are far less than considered worthy or professional. I want you to get in the proper frame of mind and stop thinking of these wonderful installers. There is a reason the fire dept was called these (professional damn near burned your home down you were lucky you got a warning shot first and was awakened enough to ask questions. My credentials are I am nationally certified building and mechanical inspectors. I did not find this code language by chance. In a perfect world professionals would do professional work there would be no need for inspectors. You presented the very reason inspectors are needed. Its time you get familiar with your.s You may need his/her help to get the corrections made. With the inspector suppor,t it will be a lot harder. for installers to dispute his findings

 

[bcinny]

Ok guys I would like to solve this problem without conflict. My email address is [email protected]

 

[bcinny]

:coolsmile:

 

[DriftWood]

I would not burn a stove that had a fire as you discribe untill its fixed lifes to short already. Dont let problems happen. When they do happen learn fast from them.

You could read the instilation instructions in your owners manual about clearences to cobustables to get a idea about what has to get done. Just go to the manufactures web site if you do not have one and down load it.

You can read the instilation instructions for the stove pipe and chimney pipe you have about clearences to cobustables to get a idea about what has to get done. Just go to the manufactures web site if you do not have one and down load it.

You should call in the local building inspestior to see what he wants to see done to pass inspection. Your insurance company my not cover you if the next chimney fire starts a house fire. With out a local inspection OK on your stove instalation you may not collect any money from the insurance.

 

[restorer]

I can t get to my computer. I'm out of town. I m a red sox fan. You guys have me until this is worked out. I'm reading all advice and will pass it on to my guy. Go patriots. I grew up in mass.

Snicker, snicker, snicker. You'se guy's wanna 'pologize? She's a nice girl. erhhh lady?? You'se shud be ashamed. For myself, I never Really thought you were a Net's Fan.

 

[restorer]

Hotmail

HUHH?? I'm from the West, what'ya mean?? :red: :question:

 

[rudysmallfry]

Sox and Pats fan? WELCOME TO THE FORUM!!

Anyway, Elk, you're plenty nice to me. I love this forum cuz you guys know your stuff. I wouldn't ask questions if I didn't need the answers. I didn't realize that heat drops that dramatically within 8' of single wall pipe. My run is only about 4' before it enters the chimney, which makes my elbow much less of a factor.

Barbara, you're in good hands with these guys. Thanks for being a woman too. We've gotta even things out around here.

 

[bcinny]

Hello everyone, I'm. In Florida until sunday. My stove is staying cold until I know it's safe. Monday my stove man is coming out to fix it. I'm emailing the link to this page. Because of you I know what needs to be done. Thanks. This is my first year burning wood. Can anyone tell me what a run away fire is? Barbara

 

[begreen]

A runaway fire is one that you lose control of. Kind of like a runaway car or train.