Clayton 1602m concerns and questions

[mmead1014]

Hello all. I've been reading thru some posts and have decided that I need to start a thread of my own. In advance I appreciate the help.

I recently purchased a home built in 2001, 2000 square feet, 2 story, and have added a Clayton 1602m that I purchased used from my uncle (furnace is a year old). I'm not too sure about what it's BTU rating is but it has two 800 CFM blowers. Ive installed it and plumbed it into my existing ductwork in the basement. I've burned wood most of my life, but all the stoves have been radiant wood stoves in living rooms.

When I purchased the stove it had a air plenum attached to the top that has two 6inch openings for heat source and a plenum on the rear for cold air return to 8 inch openings.

Now that we have had a few nights that have been below freezing I've had problems keeping the house up to a comfortable temp (70). I'm not too sure what temp is an acceptable/safe range for burn temp. I have a thermometer on the pipe.

Is 450 to high to get the house up to temp before I damp it down? can I get it hotter?

Is my return ducting and heat ducting to and from the furnace adequate?

What temp do most people run there furnaces at?

Is 800 or 1600 CFM adequate? If not can I do anything to move more air?

I know this is kind of long, but I've got a lot of question and a wife and two kids to keep warm. Any advise is appreciated.

Also I have a Woodstock Fire view I'm selling, it was existing in the home.

 

[webbie]

Welcome to the forums!

You should list the Fireview in the classified section....lots of folks here who may want it!

It's hard to measure the performance and output of a furnace based on stack temperatures. Most furnaces use electric controls of sorts which control the temperature until the upstairs thermostat is satisfied. Manual control of a whole house heating system just is not going to work right!

1600 CFM should certainly be enough to warm most homes in that size range. But there is much more to it than that! The exact installation setup is important. Just because the fans are rated 1600 CFM combined does not mean that much air is flowing around the unit and also getting pushed into your ductwork.

You can often move a small amount of additional air by using in-duct fans or even fans which mount on the floor vents in a room.

 

[mmead1014]

That was going to be my next question. US stoves sells a draft inducing kit for $289. Forced induction blower and a thermostat for the living space. Is that worth the money? I'm completely new to controlling a wood fire like that.

What do you mean by insulation set up? Probably a dumb question but I'll assume home insulation and not ducting?

 

[webbie]

Most furnaces do use those draft induction kits and a thermostat- or, even an electric damper and a thermostat, otherwise there is no way for them to control the heat.

I said "installation", not insulation. Make sure you check out the manual for various things such as the layout of the return and feed ductwork as well as the clearances from the ducts to wood framing, etc.

Installing central heating systems correctly can be fairly complicated.

 

[Fred61]

Are you picking up the return air from the previously plumbed ducts from the fossil furnace or are you getting it from the room that the furnace is in? Sounds like you're trying to heat a 2000 square ft house with 2 six inch ducts. You probably aren't getting the air flow you need no matter where you set your fans.

 

[webbie]

Are you picking up the return air from the previously plumbed ducts from the fossil furnace or are you getting it from the room that the furnace is in? Sounds like you're trying to heat a 2000 square ft house with 2 six inch ducts. You probably aren't getting the air flow you need no matter where you set your fans.

Yes!
That's what I mean about installation. You are almost certainly not getting the correct airflow around the unit. The two 8" inputs to the blowers may be enough for the return (since it's high power and close to the blowers), but the output plenum should probably be the full size that it was at the factory - which I think is about 18" x 13"

Putting it into square inches, the furnace has a 230 Sq In. output, but if yours is two 6" pipes, you have it throttled down to about 60 square inches. All of this affects the heat able to be moved from the furnace.
http://www.efireplacestore.com/uss-1602r.html?productid=uss-1602

 

[brenndatomu]

Yep, ducts too small, or at least not enough of them. I just installed (4) 7" ducts on my sisters new Yukon Big Jack furnace which is smaller BTU output than your furnace. Heats their 2000 sq ft. ranch like a monster!

450* temp could be OK, depends where you are measuring that temp from...

 

[mmead1014]

I'm getting the return air, from the return air previously plumed into the house.

And that's correct it's only has two 6" ducts from the heat source. In the interest of saving money I used the air plenum that was attached to the furnace. I'll start changing the square inches from the plenum this weekend

If I run square ducting from the furnace to the existing ducted work in the basement what should I do about a back draft damper on the wood furnace. As of right now there are two 6" automatic butterfly dampers attached to the plenum. I'm guessing I'd have to buy a weighted or mechanical square damper that would fit on top of the furnace?

Thanks for all the help so far

 

[webbie]

I'll let others weigh in on the backdraft damper - some of it depends whether you are going to have the regular furnace working as a backup, or if you are just going to turn it off when you are using wood 24/7.

If you turn it off, then you could even use a manual damper of sorts to close up the furnace return somewhere after the clayton pulls the return air.

Way back when I did some of these I would have the output from the wood furnace enter into the regular ductwork using a small scoop or spoiler of some sort, so it headed in the right direction and would not cause as much backdraft if the regular furnace fan kicked in.

Something like this.....

 

[brenndatomu]

Look in your owners manual for some backdraft ideas, if you have it. If not, I found one online, you could download one.

 

[mmead1014]

That makes sense. I want to have the propane as a backup. If I were to install either a weighted or motor actuated damper are there any suggestions on what company I should order from?

I have to confess that I haven't installed one on the existing furnace yet. As of right now were house broke. For the time being to keep back draft from coming thru the propane furnace. I've cut a hole in the return ducting by the propane furnace and wedged a piece of cardboard against the intake. It's turned off so it won't fire and when I do run it I obviously take the cardboard out. The square hole I've cut I have rudimentarily sealed for now, to easily gain access to the cardboard. After I get everything sorted out I'll be able to tape it off and it'll be hardly noticeable.

The manual is very vague. And when i contacted US Stoves they didn't want to give me any info, and said to contact a contractor.

 

[Fred61]

I suggest you test the results after you un-choke your supply and if it is successful, operate it manually until you can purchase the hardware to automate it.

 

[mmead1014]

OK guys, next concern.

My wife was home for the day tending the stove. House held a very nice temp with very little work. That’s not the concern just and update. )

After dinner last night the propane furnace kicked on... The thermostat is turned to off. As I've said in a previous post I've got a piece of cardboard blocking the intake of the furnace. So I ran down and removed it and had no choice but to let it run until it turned off (I can't unplug it and there is no master power switch that I can find). The heating element was not firing, just the blower was going. The furnace has an AC unit attached to the top before the ductwork. It felt warm, not hot but warm.

I was under the opinion that since the propane furnace blows up thru the AC and obviously heats up quite a bit, than the heat transfer down thru the duct work into the AC and furnace from the wood furnace shouldn't be an issue. Am I correct? I'm wondering could the furnace has some sort of safety feature that if it gets to hot it tries to cool itself off with just the blowers.

For reference it's a Ducane CMPA1004U. I'm looking thru the manual but haven't found anything yet.

 

[Fred61]

Yes! The blower limit switch reached it's setpoint and started the blower. It means you warmed up the plenum with the woodburning unit. I can't see where there's a problem with this but others with more knowledge and experience may chime in.

You need to get the wood heated air flowing away from the fossil unit.