Condor Flue Thermometer Installation

[JRunner01]

Hi All...

I installed a Condor Flue Thermometer on my double wall black pipe as per the instructions, drilling a smaller hole first through both walls of the double wall pipe and then a second larger hole only on the outer wall. However it seems I have 3 walls, as the 2nd wall has an inner wall right behind it. I think I have this 3rd wall as the pipe is an adjustable length sleeve. It was tough to drill through the 2nd\3rd walls too. So much so that I think the bit walked a bit and now consequently my thermometer is angled. I guess I should have tapped it with a punch each step of the way to minimize bit walk and make sure I was always level with the drill.

When the pipe heats up it appears to angle even worse than when its cool, I guess from the expansion of pipe caused by the heat. The picture attached is about this time.

Is this OK? I was thinking to try to straighten it out a bit by re drilling the 2nd\3rd hole a bit bigger on the top part of the hole to straighten the angle but then I don't want to leak exhaust between the the walls of the pipe since the inner hole will be bigger than necessary by making the correction.

Or now that I think of it maybe it be best to elongate the bottom hole to straighten it out, which shouldn't leak any exhaust out since the inner hole will remain the same size and shouldn't change.

Let me know what you think or how I might be able to correct this angle issue, if it even is a problem.



Thanks in advance...

 

[pen]

I'd say slightly ovalizing your outermost hole might be the best bet depending on how tight those inner layers are too each other. If the inner layers are far enough apart, there probably won't be enough room for it to drop even with a bigger outer hole.

In all, I can't see it really being a problem as far as changing how the thermometer reads. Unless you have OCD that will make looking at the non-level thermometer for all eternity true agony, I'd say just leave it.

 

[Watchguy]

This post came at the right time. I just installed one this afternoon. It looked really straight when I first installed it but when I fired up the stove it tipped up just like jrunners did. Made me pretty nervous. What I am hoping is it won't damage the thermometer. I noticed it was really tight in there. I might want to ovalize it as well. I'll see in the morning.

 

[JRunner01]

Yes part of it is seeing it crooked \ pitched irks me from the side view, but I was more worried initially about it leaking exhaust into the house by the way it was not sitting flat and flush and the magnet not really touching the outer wall flat against it to really pull it in tight. I was expecting if it was perfectly level, the magnet would provide a sort of block on the hole to not allow any smoke through.

That picture above doesn't show it too well but the magnet isn't touching the wall. There is a hair line gap. However, the magnet is truly providing some "pull" to keep it in. Plus with the angle going down it has gravity on its side to keep it in the hole.

I am slightly worried if I elongate the outer hole on the bottom to straighten it out, that it might leak some exhaust into the room if the inner hole then lets any smoke by.

 

[JRunner01]

This post came at the right time. I just installed one this afternoon. It looked really straight when I first installed it but when I fired up the stove it tipped up just like jrunners did. Made me pretty nervous. What I am hoping is it won't damage the thermometer. I noticed it was really tight in there. I might want to ovalize it as well. I'll see in the morning.

Not sure why yours pitches after it heats up especially if you had it straight in there from the first place. You would think both holes are both level so it should remain level no matter the temp.

Mine is pitched from the start even before it heats up cause I must have drilled it that way by not being as careful keeping the drill level and also the bit walking somewhat. It does pitch more as it heats up though, so maybe the shaft of the probe is bending from the heat ??!?

 

[razerface]

I could not stand it. I would have to straighten it,,but I have the "everything must be straight" problem.

I would elongate the hole. If you are scared it will leak, get a band of material, maybe bend or curl a strip of stainless to wrap the pipe. ,,drill a hole in it,,run the probe thru it while it covers the elongated hole,,,which I would do cause i have the "everything must look good" problem too,,,,

It would look good with the stainless band around the pipe,,,,everybody will want one. They will beg you to install theirs too.

 

[Watchguy]

You won't have a problem with a flue leak if you elongate the outer pipe in your double wall pipe because it does not see flue gasses at all. It's just a heat shield around the flue.

Do you have a telescoping double pipe? I am using double wall telescoping Ventis pipe in my installation. I drilled the hole for the thermometer 18" above the flue collar as instructed. It happens to go through the overlap where the two sections slide past each other. What I discovered was that the two sections move from expansion and try to cut the little thermometer prob in half. I let the stove go out this morning so I could check it out. The thermometer was pinched and stuck in there pretty good. I got it out after a struggle and it was scrapped up but not too bad. So I elongated the hole in the outer section of the inner slip pipe and it works a little better. I might have to elongate it just a bit more so it doesn't pinch it too hard. Anyway that was my experience.

 

[JRunner01]

You won't have a problem with a flue leak if you elongate the outer pipe in your double wall pipe because it does not see flue gasses at all. It's just a heat shield around the flue.

Do you have a telescoping double pipe? I am using double wall telescoping Ventis pipe in my installation. I drilled the hole for the thermometer 18" above the flue collar as instructed. It happens to go through the overlap where the two sections slide past each other. What I discovered was that the two sections move from expansion and try to cut the little thermometer prob in half. I let the stove go out this morning so I could check it out. The thermometer was pinched and stuck in there pretty good. I got it out after a struggle and it was scrapped up but not too bad. So I elongated the hole in the outer section of the inner slip pipe and it works a little better. I might have to elongate it just a bit more so it doesn't pinch it too hard. Anyway that was my experience.

I think that is exactly what I'm up against. I too have a telescoping double pipe. I see 3 layers, the outer layer is the wall that we see on the outside, then two inner layer walls right on top of each other, no gap, that if not perfectly aligned, you can't get the probe in and I imagine like you described can't get it out if they move during expansion and bite the probe.

So what must be happening is the 3rd layer, looking in from the outside, counting the outside layer that we can touch as the 1st layer, the 2nd layer as the in between layer, and then the 3rd layer closest to the exhaust gases, must be riding down during expansion, causing the probe to point up towards the ceiling.

Then it calms down during cooling and goes back somewhat to normal level, except being that I probably was off on the initial drilling, so I'm never 100% level after cooling.

 

[razerface]

Then it calms down during cooling and goes back somewhat to normal level, except being that I probably was off on the initial drilling, so I'm never 100% level after cooling.

you could always redrill while it is hot and open up the hole thru all the layers. I take my probes out sometimes to trade them, change them,ect,,,all it does is whistle while the probe is out of the pipe. The draft draws air in,,,does not smoke.

Mine whistles in 2 different tones (2 different holes)

 

[JRunner01]

you could always redrill while it is hot and open up the hole thru all the layers. I take my probes out sometimes to trade them, change them,ect,,,all it does is whistle while the probe is out of the pipe. The draft draws air in,,,does not smoke.

Mine whistles in 2 different tones (2 different holes)

Good to know there is no exhaust leakage with it out. I guess like you comment suggests, the draft is too strong to let exhaust air escape into the room from such a small hole, even if elongated.

 

[razerface]

Good to know there is no exhaust leakage with it out. I guess like you comment suggests, the draft is too strong to let exhaust air escape into the room from such a small hole, even if elongated.

draft is always pulling into the pipe. The only bad thing with a hole is that it is introducing cold air into the pipe,,,,,cooling the exhaust. Good draft won't let smoke come out a big hole either. Like when you open a door on the stove.

 

[smokedragon]

The draft draws air in,,,does not smoke.

I don't have the everything must be straight problem, but this is good info for the OP to understand. If you drill the holes a little bigger to get that probe in straight, it is not going to smoke up your house. It may let a tiny bit of smoke out on a cold start, but even then, not much.

I would fix it because I would be afraid of the pipe damaging the probe as it expands and contracts.

Besides, razerface is exactly right. If you are worried about flue gasses escaping, you could always put a band around the original pipe (or use a little furnace cement at the hole before you put the probe in).

 

[Highbeam]

The reason for the tilt is two different materials, stainless and steel, and each of those with different thermal expansion rates and each at wildly different temperatures. If you want it level when hot then drill it while hot, level while cold then drill it while cold.

Fixing it can be tough but using a rat tail file(chainsaw file) works well to ovalize the inner or outer holes.

 

[Highbeam]

There is no risk of probe damage. The probe is a solid metal rod with no internal parts. It's function is to conduct heat to the spring area.

 

[JRunner01]

The reason for the tilt is two different materials, stainless and steel, and each of those with different thermal expansion rates and each at wildly different temperatures. If you want it level when hot then drill it while hot, level while cold then drill it while cold.

Fixing it can be tough but using a rat tail file(chainsaw file) works well to ovalize the inner or outer holes.

Good point about the different metals and heat effects on each are different.

I guess look at it from the front and be happy. Leave well enough alone.

Thanks for everyone's replies by the way !

 

[Highbeam]

I've actually used the tilt as an indication of when the flue is getting hot when I'm sitting beside the stove and can't read the dial but can see that tilt. I wish they made a single wall probe meter. Heck, maybe I could modify and calibrate the meter to read well enough on single wall.

 

[razerface]

I've actually used the tilt as an indication of when the flue is getting hot when I'm sitting beside the stove and can't read the dial but can see that tilt. I wish they made a single wall probe meter. Heck, maybe I could modify and calibrate the meter to read well enough on single wall.

put a piece of insulation between the dial and the pipe? Use digital probe,,it does not care what the pipe is.

 

[Highbeam]

put a piece of insulation between the dial and the pipe? Use digital probe,,it does not care what the pipe is.

Yes it does care what the pipe is. See, the probe meter still uses a bimetallic coil spring behind the dial face to read the temperature and the dial's reading corresponds to the amount of heat felt at the dial face. This is why the condar probe meter is specific to double wall pipes.

It's not like we're using thermocouples here that read temp at the tip of the probe. The probe is simply a conduction rod.

 

[razerface]

High beam,,,read my post again. I state the digital probe does not care......
It was 2 different solutions. I failed to use the word "or"'.

 

[razerface]

It's not like we're using thermocouples here that read temp at the tip of the probe.

That is exactly why a digital probe will work in any pipe, they do read at the tip.