considering a pellet stove.... advise, ideas welcome

[mwedd]

I am considering a pellet/multi fuel stove vs wood fired outdoor boiler. House is 3200sf walkout ranch which is getting new windows, doors, tyvek and new siding currently (almost done). I would like to put the stove in the basement family room in a location which IS central to the floorplan. Unfortunatley my stairway is at one end of the house, not in the center. However the stove would be placed against the wall to my mechanical room where there is an unused 4" B vent from my old 80% furnace. I would like to add a cold air return vent to my cold air return plenum (happens to be right where the stove would be placed) above the stove to pull warm air from the basement and circulate to the upstairs using the furnace blower. Also is it possible to coil some copper above the fire box to help with heating water? If this sounds like it would work ok, what size stove and what brand to look at? I like the look and feel of a stove in the house and my installation would be pretty easy. I dont really care for the look of an boiler in the backyard and I'm pretty much broke from the windows, doors, tyvek and siding.

 

[imacman]

Assuming that what I can figure from your description of the house (single floor ranch), IMO, what you'd like to do seems to be a lot of work. Why not just centrally locate the pellet stove on the main floor? (Maybe there's more to this that I don't know about).

EDIT: BTW, that is a BIG ranch! And welcome to the forum!

 

[mwedd]

Assuming that what I can figure from your description of the house (single floor ranch), IMO, what you'd like to do seems to be a lot of work. Why not just centrally locate the pellet stove on the main floor? (Maybe there's more to this that I don't know about).

EDIT: BTW, that is a BIG ranch! And welcome to the forum!

thats a guessed combined sf. approx 1700 main floor. we use the basement alot, it is finished and our kids live in their caves down there. the upstairs layout doesnt seem very good for a stove plus the basement is always cold anyway so it seems to me to be the best place. my cold air duct is almost directly behind where the stove would sit so it would be very easy to duct in a vent at the ceiling so my furnace could pull warm air into the blower and thru the rest of the house. does that make sense to do?

 

[tinkabranc]

Not sure about your area, but here it is against code for a return vent to
be within 10 feet of the stove. Might want to find out if this applies for you
while you are researching stove or furnace.

 

[Clay H]

i would consider 2 pellets stoves i think. The idea of circulating heat with your old furnace blower sounds a little questionable.

2 stoves on thermostats. Or one good sized stove in the basement and a large grate type floor vent between levels to allow heat from below to rise up to the upper level. Between that and the stairway you should be okay i would think.


Edit: on second thought, heating 3200' on 2 levels with one stove is not going to be a good idea i don't think. If it were a lot smaller area, maybe.
2 stoves is your answer IMO

 

[stillersnut]

Check with local laws on outdoor wood furnace, they are really cracking down with ordances. Other than good renewable heat, pellet fire is relaxing to just plain watch. Good Luck.

 

[Wet1]

i would consider 2 pellets stoves i think. The idea of circulating heat with your old furnace blower sounds a little questionable.

2 stoves on thermostats.

Edit: on second thought, heating 3200' on 2 levels with one stove is not going to be a good idea i don't think. If it were a lot smaller area, maybe.
2 stoves is your answer IMO

I have to agree. 3200 sq ft is a lot to heat with a single pellet stove, unless you're planning on just using the pellet stove as supplemental heat for your central heating system. While a stove might be capable of doing it, the appliance is going to be running hard over long periods of time to do it... far from ideal and certainly not easy on the stove.

Between the cost of the pellet stove(s) and the pellets to feed them, you're looking at a very long ROI. I would not buy a pellet stove to save money on fuel today given the cost of traditional fuels. I say this as an owner of two pellet stoves and with 9 years of pellet buying/burning under my belt. Many will argue this saying they save a lot of money buying pellets, but reality and the numbers wont lie. Trust me when I say the current ROI will be a long time... especially considering the extra work and maintenance of taking care of pellet stove(s) compare to traditional fuels. The one or two exceptions might be if you have expensive electrical resistance or propane heating. Being in MI, you should have access to very cheap NG (and electricity to a certain point), if so, that's going to be very hard to beat. Oil and NG is very cheap now, so don't buy one or two pellet stoves thinking you're going to save much if anything.

If you want to save money, burn wood. And with 3200 sq ft, you should consider a boiler rather than a stove, unless you're okay with cold areas. Outdoor wood boilers are being regulated, and for good reason. They can burn dirty and they generally consume a lot of wood. If you want to go with a boiler, I'd look into a gasifier, but the systems are costly. If you want to consider wood stoves, you should look at a 4+ cu ft stove with this large of an area... These include the Buck Model 91, the Hearthstone EQ, and the Blaze King King.

 

[Clay H]

i would consider 2 pellets stoves i think. The idea of circulating heat with your old furnace blower sounds a little questionable.

2 stoves on thermostats.

Edit: on second thought, heating 3200' on 2 levels with one stove is not going to be a good idea i don't think. If it were a lot smaller area, maybe.
2 stoves is your answer IMO

I have to agree. 3200 sq ft is a lot to heat with a single pellet stove, unless you're planning on just using the pellet stove as supplemental heat for your central heating system. While a stove might be capable of doing it, the appliance is going to be running hard over long periods of time to do it... far from ideal and certainly not easy on the stove.

Between the cost of the pellet stove(s) and the pellets to feed them, you're looking at a very long ROI. I would not buy a pellet stove to save money on fuel today given the cost of traditional fuels. I say this as an owner of two pellet stoves and with 9 years of pellet buying/burning under my belt. Many will argue this saying they save a lot of money buying pellets, but reality and the numbers wont lie. Trust me when I say the current ROI will be a long time... especially considering the extra work and maintenance of taking care of pellet stove(s) compare to traditional fuels. The one or two exceptions might be if you have expensive electrical resistance or propane heating. Being in MI, you should have access to very cheap NG (and electricity to a certain point), if so, that's going to be very hard to beat. Oil and NG is very cheap now, so don't buy one or two pellet stoves thinking you're going to save much if anything.
If you want to save money, burn wood. And with 3200 sq ft, you should consider a boiler rather than a stove, unless you're okay with cold areas. Outdoor wood boilers are being regulated, and for good reason. They can burn dirty and they generally consume a lot of wood. If you want to go with a boiler, I'd look into a gasifier, but the systems are costly. If you want to consider wood stoves, you should look at a 4+ cu ft stove with this large of an area... These include the Buck Model 91, the Hearthstone EQ, and the Blaze King King.

Good point, i am on propane so using pellets, even at 270 a ton, i will still save close to 50% on my heating this winter with the current price of propane.
But fuel will go back up and i would encourage you to get at least one pelet stove for the basement and then your that much ahead of the game when heating oil goes back up...might hapen this winter even. Another reason i have a pellet stove is ice storms and electricity outages...they are common here and its nothing to be without power for 2-3 days or weeks. My genset will power my pelet stove as well as several lights, TVs etc. but will not power my elec. ignition furnace.

 

[hossthehermit]

If I'm reading this right, you have a FHA propane furnace and distribution ductwork in place. They make pellet furnaces, designed for whole house heating, tie in to your existing ductwork. BUT, maybe I'm reading it wrong, it's been a long day.

 

[jtakeman]

They make pellet furnaces, designed for whole house heating, tie in to your existing ductwork.

I have to agree with hossthehermit. Most of these furnaces are multifuel ta boot. They are more expensive than stoves, But cheaper than buying 2 stoves. If all the duct is there, You can sister it in to the system. Use what ever fuel is cheapest.

Trust me, If you put just a stove in the basement. You will have to overheat the basement to see any heat up stairs. The furnace tied to the duct work is the way to go! Force that heat upstairs.

just my 2
jay

 

[mwedd]

Thanks guy's for all your input. Sorry I forgot to mention yes I currently have LP forced air. Last years LP bill was in the neighborhood of $2300. The new windows will help along with the tyvek and I also caulked any gaps in the exterior sheeting. I am not interested in 2 stoves and I most likely would choose an outdoor boiler over a multi fuel add on furnace. Since I have no prior experience with pellet stoves, my first thoughts were that it would be an easy installation since I already have the "b" vent from my older LP furnace. I grew up with wood heat so I know the labor involved, not that I dislike it but it would be yet another chore to fit into my schedule. Also I enjoy the look of a fire in the house (contained that is). I willl try to get a more accurate sf of the house. Another thing is we have 2 rooms (one upper & one lower) that we do not heat in the winter so I would subtract these from my measurements.

 

[MCPO]

I am considering a pellet/multi fuel stove vs wood fired outdoor boiler. House is 3200sf walkout ranch which is getting new windows, doors, tyvek and new siding currently (almost done). I would like to put the stove in the basement family room in a location which IS central to the floorplan. Unfortunatley my stairway is at one end of the house, not in the center. However the stove would be placed against the wall to my mechanical room where there is an unused 4" B vent from my old 80% furnace. I would like to add a cold air return vent to my cold air return plenum (happens to be right where the stove would be placed) above the stove to pull warm air from the basement and circulate to the upstairs using the furnace blower. Also is it possible to coil some copper above the fire box to help with heating water? If this sounds like it would work ok, what size stove and what brand to look at? I like the look and feel of a stove in the house and my installation would be pretty easy. I dont really care for the look of an boiler in the backyard and I'm pretty much broke from the windows, doors, tyvek and siding.

I think you would be making the classic mistake of trying to heat the entire house from a simple (but expensive) basement space heater.(pellet stove) Not a good design by any means. It means a very uncomfortable basement with a lousy method to transfer heat out of it.
Personally I think a new fuel efficient central heating system should have been a priority that would do much more for you and add value to your home.
As it is , you might want to consider heating just the basement with a small pellet stove and leave it at that. If your (rather good sized) ranch main floor isn`t zoned, then have it zoned and be done with it. I heat almost all of my finished basement with pellets and everything upstairs with the central heat system. For the past 12 months I used only 549 gals of fuel oil and 2 tons of pellets . My pellet stove has to be on low or the finished basement would be uncomfortable but I`d have to believe a small amount of heat has to rise up thru the stairway but minimal since the basement temps are kept at 72 degrees .
The 549 gals includes domestic hot water for 4 adults which I calculated at .7 gal per day = 250 gals for the year. That means I`m using only about 300 gals of oil plus 2 tons of pellets to heat 2500 sq ft.
My oil furnace was state of the art 12 yrs ago but remains quite efficient.
I believe I now have what is an ideal balance of comfort , efficiency , labor, and cost.

 

[mwedd]

Ok, you guys have made me do a little more research. Thanks for your input GIO (and everyone else), Just curious, what BTU is your pellet stove? I realize that I most likely would not be able to heat my entire home with any stove in the basement. I would be supplementing my central heating system. My home is not zoned so normally to try to keep the basement warm I partially close off most registers on the main level and fully open all in the basement. By running a space heater downstairs I'm hoping to close off all registers in the lower and open all in the upper level. I'm guessing that is what you do right? That would greatly reduce the heat load on the central heating system which I installed a new 95% LP furnace part way thru last winter. I measured my finished (heated) area of my basement and it is 1100 sq ft. I have approx 1400-1500 sq ft upstairs (house is irregular shaped). So the 3200 measurement I stated in the first post was wrong. I took that from a heat load calculation a guy did when he was trying to sell me Geo Thermal (I let him hold the smart end of the tape).

I think I'm pretty stuck on the pellet stove idea.
1. I already have an unused exhaust vent.
2. I do not have an area I would want a wood stove that would allow me to install a chimmney pipe.
3. The outdoor boiler is just too much coin. (Not willing to finance)

So now I have to decide what size stove. I would rather have a multi fuel stove since we have alot of corn in our area which would allow me to buy the cheapest fuel available. Who else burns corn or any other bio mass fuels on this site? This forum seems to be very pellet oriented. Is there a reason for this?

 

[imacman]

.....This forum seems to be very pellet oriented. Is there a reason for this?

First of all, I decided not to give my opinion on what direction you should go with trying to use pellet stove to heat the house...I think you have too many variables.

As for the lack of corn burners here, I'm sure there are some that do, but corn is harder to get and is just as expensive in a lot of areas as pellets.

You could try this site too:

http://forum.iburncorn.com/

 

[Fsappo]

I burn corn in our Europa and our Magnum. What I would do before buying a corn stove is to find out what you can get dried, clean corn for locally. It can range from 100 bucks a ton to 300 per ton.

 

[krooser]

Why not look at a pellet furnace? Hook it up to the existing ductwork.

 

[imacman]

Why not look at a pellet furnace? Hook it up to the existing ductwork.

he mentioned this: "I most likely would choose an outdoor boiler over a multi fuel add on furnace"

BTW, how you been Krooser? long time, no read.

 

[jf254]

[quote author="propainsuks" date="1255637725"]
I think I'm pretty stuck on the pellet stove idea.
1. I already have an unused exhaust vent.
2. I do not have an area I would want a wood stove that would allow me to install a chimmney pipe.
3. The outdoor boiler is just too much coin. (Not willing to finance)

Up above I believe you said you had B-Vent... P-stove shouldn't be vented into b-vent

 

[tonyd]

Sounds like and outdoor wood boiler to me. My boss has a wood boiler for the house that heats his water and pool also . He loves it. Has a Quad in the huge basement/ family room and he doesn't use it much. I have a 2500 sf split foyer and my Accentra does a fine job heating both floors but I wouldn't expect it to do much more. This is how I get the heat upstairs. Most foyers, this wall is not opened. If it was blocked off, you would roast.

 

[SaveYourPets]

I am considering a pellet/multi fuel stove vs wood fired outdoor boiler. House is 3200sf walkout ranch which is getting new windows, doors, tyvek and new siding currently (almost done). I would like to put the stove in the basement family room in a location which IS central to the floorplan. Unfortunatley my stairway is at one end of the house, not in the center. However the stove would be placed against the wall to my mechanical room where there is an unused 4" B vent from my old 80% furnace. I would like to add a cold air return vent to my cold air return plenum (happens to be right where the stove would be placed) above the stove to pull warm air from the basement and circulate to the upstairs using the furnace blower. Also is it possible to coil some copper above the fire box to help with heating water? If this sounds like it would work ok, what size stove and what brand to look at? I like the look and feel of a stove in the house and my installation would be pretty easy. I dont really care for the look of an boiler in the backyard and I'm pretty much broke from the windows, doors, tyvek and siding.

I just picked up the multi-fuel furnace that my local tractor supply sells.. its the big one a 6500... I ducted it right into the duct work in my basement , it has its own blower and its all automatic
you have to start the fire yourself and clean it of course but the rest is all automatic.
My house including the basement(always cold) is about 2800sf and when this thing is on the lowest setting it gets my basement to 75 degrees..
i mix corn and wood pellets, and some cherry pits and its all good so far.. I do have to tweek a few things, I have to figure out why sometimes the corn ect.. pops out of the hopper and lands where the ash goes sometimes..
Craig

 

[imacman]

i mix corn and wood pellets, and some cherry pits and its all good so far......
Craig

Boy, you people up in Michigan have got it made with the cherry pits......I'd love to try some in my new stove.

 

[hoverfly]

I would suggest a pellet boiler, it would just be much simpler in my book for a house that size and with your requirement for domestic. A heat exchanger could be placed in the furnace using an in/out door pellet boiler with a zone for domestic. Some companies who produces furnaces offer a domestic option. Boiler or furnace it's going to cost you some money. A pellet stove in the family room would only heat in a localized area and also you want to conciser rooms like bed rooms how they get heat if the doors are closed.

 

[SaveYourPets]

i mix corn and wood pellets, and some cherry pits and its all good so far......
Craig

Boy, you people up in Michigan have got it made with the cherry pits......I'd love to try some in my new stove.

Hey.. Just go to www.tractorsupply.com and see if there is one near you, call them and they can order them for you.. my store by me does not stock them we have to special order them.. 1500 lbs per pallet.. or if one is not that close to you maybe you can order thru the web site and it might be cheep enought to have them shipped ( you might have to get like 3 pallets to make it cost effective) but you will have plenty for a while
Let me know how you make out and if you hear of any oyster shells i can get to mix in im up for that !
craig

 

[Havlat24]

I put a sante fe in my basement, and my stairs are located on the opposite far side wall. I turned my furnace off, and set the pellet stove to turn on at 75. Its been keeping the upstairs at about 72. Burning a bag every 1.5 to 2 days or so. (House is 1300 square feet in the basement and 1300 square feet upstairs, insulated for Northern Canadian winters)

I have a ceiling fan in the far side bedroom across the house constantly running. The outside temperature here has been 14-41F. I imagine when it gets to -4 to -40 It wont heat the whole place, (Maybe running constantly on medium or high) but its doing a good job right now, and I'm guessing my furnace will run 50-60% less this winter.


I tried to distribute hot air with the furnace fan.... I wasn't impressed with the results. Hot air rises.... If your house is insulated, you'd be surprised how well these pellet stoves can heat your house.