Cutting White Oak
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I just cut up some 30"+ white oak logs a few months ago with an 026PRO and with a brandy new chain cut like butter. Only problem I had was with a short bar ending up meeting on the other side perfectly and having the round not fall off the log due to the mis-cut.
It is dense though.
It is dense though.
Missouri Frontier
Feeling the Heat
I second that. Those safety chains are dog doo. A 290 ought to be plenty to deal with 20 inches of oak. I work 30 plus inches of oak with a 250. The 250 does great with a sharp full chisel chain. If the chain even comes close to the ground it needs to sharpened.
Missouri Frontier
Feeling the Heat
Right you are spark! Lovely dry hedge. When I cut that stuff I cant decide if I'm going to keep at it with the chain saw or if I need to grab the concrete saw!
Is this what you are referring to?
http://www.stihlusa.com/products/chain-saws/saw-chains/rsf/
I'll try it if it's faster and cuts better.
Ashful
Minister of Fire
Standard 3/8" x 0.050" full chisel chains from Stihl: 33-RS or 33-RSC.
Basically, the full-chisel chain has a cutter that, when viewed straight on, looks like a sharp "7". A semi-chisel chain has a cutter that, when viewed straght on, looks like a rounded "7" or a "?". That's issue no.1, and it doesn't really matter so much who's full-chisel you use, as much as whether it's full or semi-chisel.
Your second issue is safety vs. non-safety chain. A standard (non-safety) chain has only one depth gauge in front of each cutter. It's actually stamped onto the same link as the cutter. A safety chain will have some sort of secondary bump on the tie strap in front of the cutter link, whether it be a full ridge back, or just a smaller bump that aligns with the depth gauge while the chain is straight. This is likely your biggest issue, when burying the nose of the bar in a bigger log, as safety chain does NOT cut well with the nose buried.
Full-chisel will cut a little bit faster than semi-chisel, when sharp, but it dulls quicker. That's the primary advantage of semi-chisel, and why it's usually spec'd for homeowner / ranch grade saws. If your saw is struggling, I suppose full chisel may help, but you also may find it's more grabby... counterproductive. Your bigger issue, when burying the nose, is probably safety (green label) vs. non-safety (yellow label).
BTW... 33-RS/RSC = yellow. 33-RS/RSC-3 = green. All full chisel. The "-3" is the option for the safety link.
Basically, the full-chisel chain has a cutter that, when viewed straight on, looks like a sharp "7". A semi-chisel chain has a cutter that, when viewed straght on, looks like a rounded "7" or a "?". That's issue no.1, and it doesn't really matter so much who's full-chisel you use, as much as whether it's full or semi-chisel.
Your second issue is safety vs. non-safety chain. A standard (non-safety) chain has only one depth gauge in front of each cutter. It's actually stamped onto the same link as the cutter. A safety chain will have some sort of secondary bump on the tie strap in front of the cutter link, whether it be a full ridge back, or just a smaller bump that aligns with the depth gauge while the chain is straight. This is likely your biggest issue, when burying the nose of the bar in a bigger log, as safety chain does NOT cut well with the nose buried.
Full-chisel will cut a little bit faster than semi-chisel, when sharp, but it dulls quicker. That's the primary advantage of semi-chisel, and why it's usually spec'd for homeowner / ranch grade saws. If your saw is struggling, I suppose full chisel may help, but you also may find it's more grabby... counterproductive. Your bigger issue, when burying the nose, is probably safety (green label) vs. non-safety (yellow label).
BTW... 33-RS/RSC = yellow. 33-RS/RSC-3 = green. All full chisel. The "-3" is the option for the safety link.
Missouri Frontier
Feeling the Heat
Yes that chain is one step above the RS or rapid super. I have not used the the RSF I'm sure it's greasy fast. I was referring to the RS which is plenty for me.
Missouri Frontier
Feeling the Heat
TreePointer
Minister of Fire
You want RS. This is the standard chain with a full compliment of cutters per chain length. AKA "full comp.")
The link you posted is for RSF chain. The "F" in RSF stands for Full skip. It has fewer cutter links than RS per unit length of chain.
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The difference between RS and RM is the shape of the cutter. RS has full chisel shaped teeth. RM has semi-chisel shaped teeth. These are standard chains with a yellow tie strap.
If you add a "3" to the chains mentioned above, that will be a "low kickback" version of the same chain. It will have a green tie strap. That is, RS becomes RS3, and RM becomes RM3. RS is noticeably faster than RM3.
The link you posted is for RSF chain. The "F" in RSF stands for Full skip. It has fewer cutter links than RS per unit length of chain.
* * * * *
The difference between RS and RM is the shape of the cutter. RS has full chisel shaped teeth. RM has semi-chisel shaped teeth. These are standard chains with a yellow tie strap.
If you add a "3" to the chains mentioned above, that will be a "low kickback" version of the same chain. It will have a green tie strap. That is, RS becomes RS3, and RM becomes RM3. RS is noticeably faster than RM3.
Ashful
Minister of Fire
Safety chain ain't that much safer than non-safety. Avoid the kickback zone with either, and you'll be fine. Ram the top half of the nose into something with either, and you'll have kickback. The number of situations where a green chain would save you from a mistake are very limited.
TreePointer
Minister of Fire
Flatbedford
Minister of Fire
I cut for years with a 029, 20" bar and full chisel chain. I often cut 20"+ Oak and Locust with it. I kept the chain sharp and let the saw do the work at its own pace. I few years ago I tried a friend's 036 and realized how much I had been suffering with the 029. I talked him into selling the 036 to me and sold the 029. There is no replacement for displacement.
Backwoods Savage
Minister of Fire
For sure I'd grab all the hickory you can get! Get the oak too if you have room to store it a few years before burning it.
"So does this thing kick-back a lot? I don't want to lose my face."
Don't worry too much about kick-back. I've always thought this has been overplayed for many years and it is getting worse. I've but a bit of wood in my time and have never been concerned about it nor have I experienced it.
I watch videos like this everytime I'm warned about kickback. Better to be safe than sorry
Backwoods Savage
Minister of Fire
No problem firecracker. Yes, there is some danger involved but I am just saying it is overplayed in my estimation. Have you ever experienced kickback? Did it pose any danger?
Imagine if you will running a chain saw before the invention of the chain brake. Today if kick back would happen, that is what that chain brake is designed to do; to stop the chain and not let it cut you. The chain brake will also stop the action that would take place without it; that is, without the chain brake, a kickback would literally throw the saw up and back. Yes, there have been some terrible accidents back in those days. Not too much today. The chain brake was one of those badly needed inventions and they serve us well.
Imagine if you will running a chain saw before the invention of the chain brake. Today if kick back would happen, that is what that chain brake is designed to do; to stop the chain and not let it cut you. The chain brake will also stop the action that would take place without it; that is, without the chain brake, a kickback would literally throw the saw up and back. Yes, there have been some terrible accidents back in those days. Not too much today. The chain brake was one of those badly needed inventions and they serve us well.
aansorge
Minister of Fire
A great chain works wonders. Made my 250 into a great little saw. Still (Stihl?) like the 360 for the bigger stuff but generally run my 250 (full chisel). Course I generally cut smaller trees as I clean out a lot of old fencelines....
Woody Stover
Minister of Fire
So you never had the top of the bar nose contact something, even a twig or a branch, and the saw rock back, even a little? That's amazing.
Contrary to what Dennis says, I would say, be concerned about kickback and be aware of where the nose of the bar is at all times, especially when cutting in heavy brush, because kickback does happen. And don't rely on the chain brake to save you from a mistake. Keeping your left arm straight when possible is another precaution you can take, as is keeping you thumb around the bar.
Ashful
Minister of Fire
True, kickback can occur... but I think my original statement holds true:
We are debating yellow label chain versus green label chain, with respect to helping the OP cut faster, not whether or not someone has ever bumped the nose of their bar on something.
Holzstapel
Burning Hunk
I'm happy with my 290. I think it's a lot of saw for a homeowner, but I don't have anything to compare it against. Hasn't let me down yet and the only time I thought the saw was acting up and not working properly was when the chain was very dull or im just about to run out of fuel.
I think the most dense wood I have cut with it so far is Red Oak.
I think the most dense wood I have cut with it so far is Red Oak.
Adios Pantalones
Minister of Fire
In addition to the basics- cut it fresh, not dry, if at all possible.
Ashful
Minister of Fire
Why's that? Always seems to me that green wood requires more HP than dry.
Adios Pantalones
Minister of Fire
Having cut fresh vs drying- I get MUCH easier cutting with just felled. This was especially apparent when I went to buck up red oaks that I had girdled vs fresh ones.
Green wood is a lot softer then dry wood, night and day difference between green oak and oak thats beeen dead a while and started to dry.
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