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Does anyone have their Oil Tank bare copper line burried in their basement concrete floor?? Oil line

Post in 'DIY and General non-hearth advice' started by Don2222, Feb 1, 2012.

  1. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hello

    All the split entry houses on this street were built that way, back in the early 60's. Now it is against the law to do that.

    Some of my neighbors had their boiler men come in and slap in an over head line because it is the easiest solution. Now instead of the oil line being in the basement floor it is essentially in the livingroom or hallway floor!! Is that any better?? Sure is a little harder to bleed the oil line after changing the oil tank filter!! Some burners like the Riello will not support it, so a tiger loop must be installed. $$$$

    So I teamed up with an independent boiler man and between the two of us ran it along the floor thru two sheetrock walls and under the door to the garage. We also changed the filter using a 5 year 30 micron commercial filter ($8.00) and then we blew out the old line with a compressor.

    Should I cover the the line with cement where it goes under the garage door next to the threshold?
    What is the best way to cover it??


    BTW This way with a new Carlin burner blededing the oil line is cake.

    So after a filter change, Open the bleeder with 3/8" wrench (Put small bucket under it - I use a cuttoff bottom of a plastic coke bottle) and just connect terminals FF (Ususally two yellow wires on them) together with a jumper momentarily after the burner starts put the jumper back on and see the air come out. Run till there is a steady stream, remove jumper and close the bleeder. Dump this good oil back into the tank! That is it!!!

    The pic below shows the new ORANGE protective sleeve around the copper oil line!
    This orange sleeve dows allow burial in concrete.

    Attached Files:

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  2. maverick06

    maverick06 Minister of Fire

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    jeez... mine is buried in the floor, but only for about 5 ft... at 30 gal/year, hope not to put any money into that heater.
  3. semipro

    semipro Minister of Fire

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    Don,
    I don't know too much about this but I do remember an earlier post here about copper in concrete and some concerns related to that.
  4. daveswoodhauler

    daveswoodhauler Minister of Fire

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    Agreed. When my furnace tech came out a portion of the line was buried in concrete above the floor. He chipped off the concrete and indicated that the copper shoud not be buried in the concrete, but if it is it should have a protective sleeve around the line. (I'm guessing one of he boiler/furnace folks will chime in about the specifics)
  5. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hello

    The concrete reacts with the bare copper causing green corrosion like on a bronze statue. The line can break where it comes out of the floor. See my pic below. I snapped it off after purging all the oil. Check your line at this point to see if you have any green corrosion on it. Maybe you can wrap something around it.
    Unfortuneately you cannot check the line in the concrete. One guy I knew had a flood in his basement and at the same time the oil line in the concrete was breeched so the water in his basement was also a big oil spill!!! This was an very expensive cleanup operation and made the home uninhabitable for quite a while.

    My oil line above ground was not so bad since I do not get water in the basement. So if you do not get water it should still be in decent shape. However water in the ground that may get into the concrete will corrode the line where it cannot be seen!! That can be a dangerous situation!!

    Mass now requires a valve on the oil tank that will shut it down when a large oil flow is sensed. This will kepp alot of the oil from flooding the ground or the basement. This is the very least that people should do ASAP!

    Attached Files:

  6. nate379

    nate379 Guest

    I know all the homes I have been in that have oil heat had the plain copper line buried in the slab. I guess it was "ok" back then?

    Now it has to have the orange like in the pictures.

    As far as that line running across your garage floor, for a "temp" solution I would cut a piece of hardwood to use as a molding/step plate, the bottom would have a groove that the line will go in. When you redo your floor, then you can just notch out the slab.

    Though I am curious why you have wood trim and what looks like linoleum in your garage??
  7. billb3

    billb3 Minister of Fire

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    I just replaced my copper pipe with a lined one.
    Concrete chipped right out with a good hammer. Wet so as not to make dust.

    I don't know if the line can be on the floor like that, exposed and possibly stepped on / crushed.

    Alternative with my other basement was to run it on the floor up against the wall and cover the pipe with about 2 inches of concrete.


    that looks like buderus blue
  8. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Yes as u can see in my sig. Buderus cold start triple pass with a Techmar 260 Outdoor Reset. Saves oil!!
    the threashold in the door on the backside will keep the line from being stepped on and crushed. I am thinking of a nice piece of hardwood on the front side.
  9. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    That is inside the basement going out to the garage.
  10. mrjohneel

    mrjohneel Burning Hunk

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    I ran it up from the tank, along the basement ceiling, and then down to the boiler. Easier than digging up the floor and inserting the copper line in plastic.
  11. greythorn3

    greythorn3 Minister of Fire

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    i got copper water pipe comming up thru our slab from the well. no problem with them. dont see how a fuel oil copper line would differ.
  12. billb3

    billb3 Minister of Fire

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    If your water pipe leaks that's no big deal, you lose some water.
    If your oil pipe leaks that's an expensive hazardous waste spill to clean up.
    Here in Ma. most of us have oil tanks in the basement, although mobile homes must have them outside and last I knew those had to have a containment bathtub under them in case they leaked.
  13. peakbagger

    peakbagger Minister of Fire

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    I had a line fail due to concrete corrosion last winter. The original line was wrapped with somehting that looked like electrical tape and poured in concrete along the floor to wall seam. I lucked out, it was only seeping, so I didnt have much leakage to deal with. It was on a saturday so I couldnt get the vinyl coated pipe so I ran new tubing through a PVC pipe along the wall. The pipe does go under the floor in one spot but it runs in a PVC pipe that was installed in the slab before the furnace went in. I have two tanks and one of these days I need to check them one of them out as its close to 20 years old plus the level gauge isnt working. I expect I will just switch back to one given my major reduction in oil usage.
  14. Jack Straw

    Jack Straw Minister of Fire

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    In the fall I replace the filter on the tank and then the nozzle. I clean the boiler and then put everything back together and clean up.
    I have some lunch and go back and fire it up. If I wait long enough it will bleed itself!
  15. maple1

    maple1 Minister of Fire

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    My parents had theirs redone when a new tank was put in a couple of years ago. It used to be bare copper in concrete, now it is the orange coated stuff on top of the concrete with a piece of what looks like angle iron bolted/screwed over top of it for protection.
  16. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hello

    Just wanted to say that the orange coating is more than just a coating. It has veins in it!! See red arrows below:

    Therefore if a leak in the copper develops the vein carrys the leak to either the boiler or tank end and that is where the leaking will occur!! Smart stuff. Makes it really nice!! See pic below. Click to enlarge!!

    Attached Files:

  17. heat seeker

    heat seeker Minister of Fire

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    Pretty neat! Shows somebody was thinking when they designed the coating.
  18. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    This would never work with an ovehead line does your line run along the floor or under the floor?


    It is still better to do it this way to take out all the air. Also took some pics for ya. :) See yellow wires on FF and spout for bleeding.
    So after a filter change, Open the bleeder with 3/8†wrench (Put small bucket under it - I use a cuttoff bottom of a plastic coke bottle) and just connect terminals FF (Ususally two yellow wires on them) together with a jumper momentarily after the burner starts put the jumper back on and see the air come out. Run till there is a steady stream, remove jumper and close the bleeder. Dump this good oil back into the tank! That is it!!!

    Attached Files:

  19. Morgan

    Morgan Member

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    Why are you jumping your cad cell terminals? Just power off your burner, change filter, open bleeder, power burner on, shut bleeder when you get a stream of oil coming out, if your quick enough there won't be enough oil come out to bother pouring back in your tank. Maybe I am missing something but I see no need to be messing with the cad cell (flame sensing eye) when bleeding your oil pump.
  20. CTguy9230

    CTguy9230 Feeling the Heat

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    thats all i have ever done...just power off the burner, crack the bleeder
    and then flip the burner switch back on
  21. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Oh, I only use the boiler for Hot Water now that I have a pellet stove. So the boiler does not come on unless I run back upstairs and turn the T-Stat on and bump up the temp to 80 Deg F. So jumping out the CAD teminals is much easier. :)

    Also I have a commercial cartridge filter and it holds quite a bit so bleeding is needed. The 30 Micron filter is supposed to last 5 years though!!
  22. Jack Straw

    Jack Straw Minister of Fire

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    Jack Straw - 01 February 2012 01:24 PM
    In the fall I replace the filter on the tank and then the nozzle. I clean the boiler and then put everything back together and clean up.
    I have some lunch and go back and fire it up. If I wait long enough it will bleed itself!

    This would never work with an ovehead line does your line run along the floor or under the floor?


    My line runs on the floor. The tank is only 4' from the burner.
  23. Hogwildz

    Hogwildz Minister of Fire

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    The lines in my old place had a casing that looked like clear tubing around them. Concrete against copper is not a good thing.
  24. WES999

    WES999 Minister of Fire

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    Mine used to be buried in the cement. I could see the copper was corroding and turning green by the tank. I recently replaced the line with the plastic coated oil line, I covered the line with flexible conduit, ran the line along the wall and buried in the floor where it runs to the furnace.

    When I replaced the electric wires I added a male and female plug on the oil burner line so it can be easily disconnected. This makes it easy to remove the burner for cleaning/service.

    Also to bleed the the system all I have to do is remove the oil line to the nozzle, place in a bucket and plug an extension cord into the burner connection, let it run till the air is purged.

    Attached Files:

  25. Don2222

    Don2222 Minister of Fire

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    Hello Wes999

    Nice work!! That will give you some piece of mind!!

    Did you put in one of those nice spin off type Garber Oil Filters on the oil tank?
    Thread on servicing your oil burner >> http://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/72591/

    I just went from a 2 year 10 Micron Spin Filter to a 5 year 30 Micron filter! See pics of old sponge filter and new spin filters below!

    Click to Enlarge

    Attached Files:

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