Does price make that much difference?

[Blazin]

Morning all.

While traveling today I'll be stopping at several places with wood stoves. Of the stoves that meet the EPA credit requirements, does the price of the stove relate to it's efficiency or quality? For instance I've been looking at the PE Alderlea T4 or the Englander 13NC for my house. The 13NC is less than $1000, while the T4 is almost $2000. Is this due to quality of workmanship, or just need for profit? My house is approx 1100 sq. ft., but it leaks like a sieve.

 

[joefrompa]

Yes, quality can be substantially different. Other things too like total glass area can contribute. My stove loads N/S (I put the logs straight in), but I've found that I actually prefer stoves that are HIGHER up front or have "stadium stacked" inside ceilings. You'll probably see what I mean.

Anyway, you can get freestanding stoves for $600,but I wouldn't trust them after 5 years, and you can also shell out some money for stoves with extensive warranties and really solid workmanship that will be good for 20 years or longer. What do you actually need?

 

[midwestcoast]

Lots of happy Englander owners on here. Do some searches.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Yes, quality can be substantially different. Other things too like total glass area can contribute. My stove loads N/S (I put the logs straight in), but I've found that I actually prefer stoves that are HIGHER up front or have "stadium stacked" inside ceilings. You'll probably see what I mean.

Anyway, you can get freestanding stoves for $600,but I wouldn't trust them after 5 years, and you can also shell out some money for stoves with extensive warranties and really solid workmanship that will be good for 20 years or longer. What do you actually need?

The bold statements are not accurate. Price does not always determine quality. Englander stoves are quality made stoves that perform very well that will work very well for many years. If budget is a concern, the Englander stoves will get you the heat you need without breaking the bank.

 

[Blazin]

Well, I'm not one to buy cheap stuff... usually lol. I plan on expanding the house in the next couple years. Maybe add on up to another 1000 sq. ft. most of that close to where I'm going to place the stove. A friend has an Englander with a CAT in it, but they don't really like it. I've mentioned the condition of their wood, which is rather fresh, but they don't seem to think that will matter. They've had that stove for 5 yrs or more.

I'm planning on using the stove for heat in the evenings and overnight. My house is separated into small rooms right now, but I'll be opening that up soon.

 

[Corey]

We have several people who burn each of those stoves on here. I've seen many good things posted about both. I think the englander is a little more simple/basic stove, made of sheet steel and simple/clean appearance. The Alderlea is a little more dressy, made of cast iron, and a few more features. Is it $1000 worth of extra features and dress? I guess that is something you'd have to decide for yourself.

You may also want to consider burn style. Cast iron stoves seem to like being burned smoothly and evenly. Sheet steel stoves seem more tolerant of hot, surging fires. I let my stove go cold during the day because no one is home, then light a big ripping fire in the evening, burn hot to bedtime, then cut the air back. My sheet steel stove has done this for years on end with no issues. A cast stove would likely be cracked or in need of a rebuild. Again, just personal preference for my burn style.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Well, I'm not one to buy cheap stuff... usually lol. I plan on expanding the house in the next couple years. Maybe add on up to another 1000 sq. ft. most of that close to where I'm going to place the stove. A friend has an Englander with a CAT in it, but they don't really like it. I've mentioned the condition of their wood, which is rather fresh, but they don't seem to think that will matter. They've had that stove for 5 yrs or more.

I'm planning on using the stove for heat in the evenings and overnight. My house is separated into small rooms right now, but I'll be opening that up soon.

You are correct. Your friend is not.

 

[Nic36]

I would consider the Englander stove more "utilitarian" than the PE Alderlea, not that there is anything wrong with that. Mostly everything I have read here about Englander has been positive, which says a lot. The PE stove is nicer looking (a matter of opinion I guess) and is constructed very well too. I base that assumption using my PE stove as my guide, but it's not an Alderlea.

By the way, both are steel stoves. The Alderlea has a cast iron jacket over the steel firebox.

 

[begreen]

There is a very large difference between the two stoves mentioned. It's not really a fair comparison. The 13NC would be better compared to the PE Super 27 stove, although one is not shielded and the other is.

They are both efficient. The 13NC is heating a lot of hearth forum homes and does a good job. The difference is in the construction details. The PE stove has a heavier steel body and then has a massive, surrounding cast iron jacket. In a small space, the cast iron jacket means you can be close to the sides of the stove without discomfort. It emits a soft, convective heat. Inside, the Alderlea has a stainless baffle system that is guaranteed for life. The Englander 13NC has high clearances because shielding is optional, the Alderlea has shielding built in and has close clearances. A big difference is with the hearth requirements. The bottom of the 13NC is essentially unshielded and needs a lot of hearth protection (R= 2.0). The Alderlea needs just ember protection. The Alderlea also has a unique and flexible trivet system.

PS: If you do want an Alderlea, you would be much better off with the Alderlea T5, not the T4. Or get a PE Super 27 which has identical innards, in a steel shell. And whatever you choose, start sealing up those leaks! Get some caulking. In a day you can dramatically reduce the heat losses, no matter what stove you choose.

 

[Dix]

There is a difference between the NC13 and the PE Pacific. The PE has a more flexible box, while the 13 is more limited to E/W burning, unless you have shorter pieces (we're putting these pieces on the side for the Dixette to use in the Timber Ridge when ever we find them, next year, we're cutting shorter pieces).


Airflow through the stoves is very different, as are the "style" of secondary burns.


I will say that I am pleased with the quality and construction of both. And, had I done my homework more when I was looking for a first stove, would have no problem having gotten and Englander insert 3 years ago. I am also very happy with the PE, but with the current layout of my house, 1 stove just isn't going to cut it.

 

[KeithO]

This is a bit of an apples to oranges comparison. Even the less dressy PE stoves without the cast iron would be fine for you in terms of heat output and durability. PE probably uses the best materials for the secondary air system (proper stainless double wall baffle with more expensive fiber insulation). If you read here about the drama people have experienced with refractory baffles and other components on equally expensive stoves (Hearthstone, Vermont Castings) it will make your hair stand on end. The problem is that if you make a wrong decision and buy one of the "trouble" stoves, you will basically end up with recurring expenses.

There is no doubt that the Englander is a more "utility" stove and those of us with wives who claim to have taste will generally fail to get a plane jane steel plate stove through the door or face various ultimatums. On the other hand, the Alderlea series from PE is one of the few plate steel stoves available with cast iron cladding to give it a more traditional look. At the same time, they have avoided the difficulties inherent with true cast iron assembled stoves (failure of the cast iron, joints opening up and leaking with time, custom made refractory to to the geometry of the castings etc).

Also consider where PE is made. Canada has a "challenging" winter, combined with a general lack of hardwood trees. If you try heating 24/7 with pine in a cold climate, it poses some different challenges compared to heating in the lower midwest with hardwood.

Not knocking the Englander, if I was a lot less well off, I may own one too. I bought my uncle and aunt in VA the smallest Century stove for a special of $250 and it keeps them warm too. But they live in a milder climate, burn only a cord of wood a year, so that 1/8" plate steel stove will probably outlive them. Here in southern MI where I bought it, I imagine it would be looking pretty rough after 4-5 years and the only thing to do with it at that point is sell it for scrap value.

 

[Blazin]

Thank you all for your advice. I ordered an Englander nc-30 today in anticipation of building an addition to the house, as well as siding and windows. That should solve most of my problems. The 30 seems oversized, but the predominant cordwood here is cottonwood, which is far down the list of BTU's per cord. With it's twisted grain, it's also a pain in the rear to split, lol.

 

[Renovation]

Well, I'm not one to buy cheap stuff... usually lol. I plan on expanding the house in the next couple years. Maybe add on up to another 1000 sq. ft. most of that close to where I'm going to place the stove. A friend has an Englander with a CAT in it, but they don't really like it. I've mentioned the condition of their wood, which is rather fresh, but they don't seem to think that will matter. They've had that stove for 5 yrs or more.

I'm planning on using the stove for heat in the evenings and overnight. My house is separated into small rooms right now, but I'll be opening that up soon.

You are correct. Your friend is not.

And that's why your friend is not happy with their cat--they are ruining it with wet wood.