Econoburn in the great outdoors

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Hello again,and greetings from the north.

I've so far had a great winter with the EWB-100 that i installed last fall.Wood consumption has sure gone down .

I am however planning on moving the unit out of the house to a outdoor situation. Under roof of coarse and perhaps in a room with no insulation value. Keep in mind that I am in northern canada above the 60th. Temps here get fairly cold at times -40 to -45 for weeks . Although with global warming less and less frequent . But still we are getting cold snaps. I bought the Econoburn because of its rugged build and the fact it has simple off the shelf electronics. My only concern with putting it outside is the electronics at cold temps. They are pretty simple basically relays and a digital temperature sensor and control. I would think the electronics would be fine when the boiler was running ,or having been run recently. But if your running with storage which I plan on doing then sometimes it might not run for 2 days at warmer times. Most likely though I would be running it every day . The pump on the circulation loop would have to be insulated somehow as well I guess.

Does any one have any experience with a similar situation? Or perhaps any thoughts on this move?
 
Don't make any sense to spend money on a boiler and not put it inside an insulated building. Looking at the whole investment, not much money in the long run to insulate. Good Luck.
 
I'm putting the new Econoburn 150 in an accessory building which is insulated. Insulation is relatively cheap and is a small percentage of your total cost. Are you running the 100 with or without storage?

Earl
 
Northern Heat said:
Hello again,and greetings from the north.

I've so far had a great winter with the EWB-100 that i installed last fall.Wood consumption has sure gone down .

I am however planning on moving the unit out of the house to a outdoor situation. Under roof of coarse and perhaps in a room with no insulation value. Keep in mind that I am in northern canada above the 60th. Temps here get fairly cold at times -40 to -45 for weeks . Although with global warming less and less frequent . But still we are getting cold snaps. I bought the Econoburn because of its rugged build and the fact it has simple off the shelf electronics. My only concern with putting it outside is the electronics at cold temps. They are pretty simple basically relays and a digital temperature sensor and control. I would think the electronics would be fine when the boiler was running ,or having been run recently. But if your running with storage which I plan on doing then sometimes it might not run for 2 days at warmer times. Most likely though I would be running it every day . The pump on the circulation loop would have to be insulated somehow as well I guess.

Does any one have any experience with a similar situation? Or perhaps any thoughts on this move?
NH; You don't say why you are moving it out of the house. Has there been problems with it? Randy
 
Sounds like you need all the heat you can get with those cold snaps. Why are you inclined to move it outdoors? Maybe you could build a room for it in the house. Space issues? If you must move it out, build an insulated structure for it, also....big enough to hold some wood, tools, etc. Do NOT skimp on your underground pipeing(size and insulation).
 
Thanks so far for the replies;

I am moving it outside to free up space in the house for a heat storage tank,and to eliminate the need for the constant bringing in of wood into the house as well as the ash in the inside environment.As well as get a better insurance rate .The local brokers and insurance companies have a problem with these things indoors. They have to be at least fifty feet from the house with no wood anywhere near them.

I imagine I will probably insulate the room that I eventually build for it ,I was just throwing it out there to see if anyone had come across any limitations with these things as far as cold.Obviosly I do not want to waste precious heat . I think if everything was kept circulating in the loops and was filled with the appropriate glycol it would not have any problems ,but then again I don't think I am willing to experiment.
 
Northern Heat said:
Thanks so far for the replies;
I imagine I will probably insulate the room that I eventually build for it ,I was just throwing it out there to see if anyone had come across any limitations with these things as far as cold.Obviosly I do not want to waste precious heat . I think if everything was kept circulating in the loops and was filled with the appropriate glycol it would not have any problems ,but then again I don't think I am willing to experiment.

Your not really wasting any heat if you insulate the space that the boiler will be as the boiler will "leak" allot of heat while burning anyways. If your area is uninsulated then this heat will just dissipate faster and you will get no benefit from it. If your boiler room is well insulated then it holds the heat and it is allot nicer to refill the boiler from a warm room. Also the air entering the boiler will be warmer and this helps the boiler burn a little bit better as the secondary air will be warmer. The boiler room doesn't have to be extremely large so the insulation costs aren't that high when compared to the building and the underground lines.
 
I have an EKO installed in an outdoor uninsulated shed and while we don't have the extreme cold you have it can be pretty cold ( 2F last night ).
I have had no problems at all with the electronic systems. The pipes are insulated but the shed itself is not. The next shed will be larger and insulated or an insulated room for the boiler just for the reasons stated above. The ease of delivering wood, cleaning ash and avoiding the smoke smell are worth the PITA of going outside to load the boiler. It sure is alot nicer to just drive up to the door with a trailer full of wood verses hauling it down the basement stairs.
 
Do you guys with the outdoor setups ever worry about the current/future regulations being imposed on OWB's?
 
Tony H said:
I have an EKO installed in an outdoor uninsulated shed and while we don't have the extreme cold you have it can be pretty cold ( 2F last night ).
I have had no problems at all with the electronic systems. The pipes are insulated but the shed itself is not. The next shed will be larger and insulated or an insulated room for the boiler just for the reasons stated above. The ease of delivering wood, cleaning ash and avoiding the smoke smell are worth the PITA of going outside to load the boiler. It sure is alot nicer to just drive up to the door with a trailer full of wood verses hauling it down the basement stairs.

Thanks Tony for the input. I agree on the outdoor situation.I've had the boiler in a room attached to the house and only accessable from the outside so far and have loved the lack of smoke in the house as well as the dust. The room is 6x 14 not large at all and the temps in there because it is insulated get to 42 degrees Celsius way too hot to stand in there for too long,and that is when it is 30 below outside. Sometimes I worry that my pumps will burn out faster than need be. The only thing I worry about is the -40 cold start up as far as the pumps are concerned and the electronics . If one was to light the fire in it and get it good and hot before you turned on the boiler main switch the electronics would be warm. The pump motors would not be so forgiving I think.

But really I haven't gone one day without firing it as I don't have any storage for it.YET !
 
I cannot fathom why the room would get to 43c/109f... My Tarm is in my basement with a insulated heated floor above it. The basement pretty tight and has no heating zone in it. It never gets above 60* down there and that is with a series hookup that keeps my OB hot all the time. Does your unit have any insulation in it? Is your piping insulated? That is a lot of standby heat loss (granted the room is pretty small...)
 
stee6043 said:
Do you guys with the outdoor setups ever worry about the current/future regulations being imposed on OWB's?

I have thought about this and it does cross my mind. My thoughts are that first Grandfathering the boilers along with the extremely low smoke output I don't see anyone having a problem. Its all a mater of how much do I worry about things I really can't control...I did install my water heater (which I can't in the State of Michigan as its "pressurized") and my EKO I'm sure doesn't have all the stamps I should have as required by the State.

I was cleaning the boiler the other day and I have a question for the indoor installs. How do you deal with the fly ash when cleaning out the bottom chamber. No matter how careful I am in cleaning it out, I get allot of "dust" in the air. I move the ash slowly and carefully and it still flies everywhere and coats everything. My wife reminds me all the time that its time to change out the furnace filter even before its been a month as dust drives her nuts. I realize how to reduce the smoking in the house with properly time fills but the ash still has me wondering.
 
WoodNotOil said:
I cannot fathom why the room would get to 43c/109f... My Tarm is in my basement with a insulated heated floor above it. The basement pretty tight and has no heating zone in it. It never gets above 60* down there and that is with a series hookup that keeps my OB hot all the time. Does your unit have any insulation in it? Is your piping insulated? That is a lot of standby heat loss (granted the room is pretty small...)

My room will get around 90ish when the boiler is really cooking. The EKO is a little lacking on the insulation in my opinion. I lifted the boiler during the install for 1. ease of loading and 2. allow more insulation under the boiler. I layed a extra batt of fiberglass on the top of the boiler which has helped but I still want to get the sides insulated more when I get around to it.
 
You will definitely want to put your boiler in an insulated shed outdoors. Cold combustion air will absolutely wreak havoc on your boiler. It will increase condensation inside the firebox and heat exchanger, decrease combustion efficiency at the beginning of each on/off cycle, and cause premature failure of the refractory as frigid air passes through the secondary ports and into the nozzle when coming out of an idle cycle.

Not to mention, the doors give off a ton of heat on the Econoburn, and the bottom of the boiler does not have any insulation on it whatsoever. Without an insulated shed... your basically throwing that all away. I think you would be suprised how much more wood you will use by going outdoors with that boiler especially in an uninsulated shed feeding it cold combustion air... I have seen wood consumption cut in half when going from outside to inside... so in your case it could double depending on your circumstances.

cheers
 
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