Electric splitter at distance?

[bluedogz]

In the interest of not blowing my back out (again) I bought a little Homelite 5T splitter at HD, and it seems to be working well. It's this one: http://www.homelite.com/catalog/log_splitters/UT49102

However, when I get it out to 150' to 200' feet away from from the outlet in the workshop, it starts to not want to start at all BUT if I wheel it closer and eliminate one extension cord (and thus 75' to 100' of wire) it runs great.

There has to be an electrical reason for this... suggestions?

 

[lukem]

You need a heavier gauge extn cord....or a portable generator.

 

[Badfish740]

In the interest of not blowing my back out (again) I bought a little Homelite 5T splitter at HD, and it seems to be working well. It's this one: http://www.homelite.com/catalog/log_splitters/UT49102

However, when I get it out to 150' to 200' feet away from from the outlet in the workshop, it starts to not want to start at all BUT if I wheel it closer and eliminate one extension cord (and thus 75' to 100' of wire) it runs great.

There has to be an electrical reason for this... suggestions?

It's a phenomenon known as voltage drop. The longer AC power has to travel, the more the voltage drops. That's why electricity has to be stepped up to extremely high voltages (250,000 Volts usually) when it's transported long distances over high tension wires. Anyway, enough electrical theory... I would guess that you're probably using a 14 (or perhaps even 16) gauge cord-as lukem posted, a heavier gauge cord might help, but 150' to 200' is still a long run. Also, with a 15 amp motor, if you start splitting some gnarly stuff you run the risk of getting the cord pretty hot. Do you split often in that spot? If so, you might want to run an outlet to a post or some type of in ground box. The guys who are more versed in electrical than me here could walk you through it.

 

[oldspark]

This site may be of some help, you might be stuck with using a shorter cord so need more details on what you available to use, can you rewire the motor for 220, would change the cord plugs so not sure what route yu want to go.
http://www.securityideas.com/howtocalvold.html

 

[PLAYS WITH FIRE]

For a 15 amp motor @ 200' is 6 awg.

 

[jimbom]

Voltage drop.

1. Drop in the house from the panel to your outlet;
2. Drop in the extension cords, a function of wire size and length.

You can find out where the drop is taking place by using a KILL-A-WATT meter. Place it at the outlet and plug the extension cord into the meter. Max out the splitter and have someone read the voltage and amps. Place it at the next extension cord and do the same. Etc until the last cord with the splitter plugged into the meter. This information will tell you where the voltage drop is the greatest. Then you can correct that segment of the circuit with bigger wire or shorter cords.

 

[bluedogz]

[quote author="Badfish740" ]I would guess that you're probably using a 14 (or perhaps even 16) gauge cord.[/quote]

Standard orange cord from Home Depot, so 16 I guess.

Running a power pole across the yard won't make a lot of sense in this case- I can just dump the rounds closer to the workshop where the outlets are. Also, a bigger (12 ga.) cord is around $50 any day, while running a power pole would be more than $50 worth of pain in the ***.

However, that's the info I was looking for... thanks guys!

 

[DanCorcoran]

I run my 15 amp splitter with a 25-foot 10-gauge cord, nothing longer. The longer the cord and the smaller the wire, the less power is getting to your splitter. You can burn out the motor that way.

 

[mayhem]

I use a 100' 12 gague cord, rated at 15A with my splitter. I notice no difference in performance of the machine wether I'm usnig the 100' cord or plugged right into the outlet.

Get a 12GA cord at a minimum, 10ga is a better choice, but costlier and shorten yuor distance to the shortest you can dump your rounds at without the wife getting annoyed.

 

[EJL923]

At that length i think plays with fire is correct with 6 gauge. I also went into your manual, and they dont even specify a gauge which will work at that length and amperage. At least not an extension cord which is readily available. HD and Lowes carry a 12 gauge as their largest size extension cord, i know, i remember looking. That is good for 10-15 amps at 100 feet. DanCorcoran is also correct in stating you can burn your motor out that way if you continue under powering your splitter. If i were you, i would stay at 100' with a 12 gauge cord. I only say that because even when i have to roll up the 12 gauge, its a p.i.t.a

 

[oldspark]

For a 15 amp motor @ 200' is 6 awg.

Where are you coming up with that figure, 15amp load at 200 feet with 12 wire give you a 9.95 voltage drop, at 120 volts that is with in the 10% range. Unless I have the wrong figures.

 

[PLAYS WITH FIRE]

If you use a 3% drop in voltage:
120V*3%= 3.6v

R=3.6v/15A= .240(ohms)

The length of run is 200' but must be double for the return, so:

.240(ohms)*(1000/400')=.600(ohms)/1000'

Look at my chart for copper is .6282(ohms)/1000' is actually 8 awg.

Our resistance for this 1000' was .6000

So should be smaller like 7 awg but try to find 7 awg, never heard of it, so use 6 awg.

 

[Badfish740]

If you use a 3% drop in voltage:
120V*3%= 3.6v

R=3.6v/15A= .240(ohms)

The length of run is 200' but must be double for the return, so:

.240(ohms)*(1000/400')=.600(ohms)/1000'

Look at my chart for copper is .6282(ohms)/1000' is actually 8 awg.

Our resistance for this 1000' was .6000

So should be smaller like 7 awg but try to find 7 awg, never heard of it, so use 6 awg.

Just Googled "6 gauge extension cord" and looked at prices... Yikes!

 

[bluedogz]

[quote author="Badfish740" date="1318982784Just Googled "6 gauge extension cord" and looked at prices... Yikes![/quote]

Indeed- I'll just drop the rounds closer to the shop. Job done.

 

[fossil]

dogz, I'm moving this thread to The Gear forum. Rick

 

[oldspark]

No way do you need a #6 cord for that load, been wiring motors for a long time and use thevoltage formula and 10% rule, but I agree droping the rounds closer to the shop is a better idea.

 

[oldspark]

To add to this the 3 % voltage drop is for power to panels and switch panels, for non critical circuits the 10% rule still applies and if you are in that 10% drop (circuit has to be a good one) that motor will run all day long.

 

[fossil]

...R=3.6v/15A= .240(ohms)...

When applying Ohm's law to an AC system, don't you have to include the Power Factor? Rick

 

[SolarAndWood]

Keep an eye on Harbor Freight for 10 gauge cords. I picked my 100 footers up there a couple years ago for $70 a piece. No problems running a 15 amp motor on that cord.

 

[PLAYS WITH FIRE]

I am an electrical engineer but by no means an expert on all things electrical. I am not an expert on rules of thumb or what is exceptable voltage drops for certain equipment. I look at mafg data or use the web etc.. I picked 3% and used a my fundamental circuits book by Boylstad. This is the calculation you use and maybe not the acceptable % voltage drop per foot of wire using as an extension cord. However if you use the online calculators, it will yeild the same answer.

 

[fossil]

Ohm's Law as applied to an AC circuit:

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/electric/acohml.html

 

[PLAYS WITH FIRE]

Yes this isn't a problem! This is ohm's law using phasors which basically is the study of the voltage with respect to time and angle....Simply, figuring out what the voltage is at any given point on a sine wave. Man....this is taking me back;-)

Now, I may have made a mistake! I may not have had to double the length for the return(neutral). To me it seems 100%! I have been trying to contact a couple friends with no luck.

 

[fossil]

...Man....this is taking me back;-)...

Yeah, me too, my friend. I'm a Mechanical Engineer...but I last graduated from a college nearly 30 years ago, and I've been retired completely for 11 years. I just thought I'd give your chain a gentle yank about using the DC form of Ohm's Law in an AC application. If you're an Electrical Engineer, then you've forgotten more about it all than I ever knew. ;-) Rick

 

[PLAYS WITH FIRE]

I am a bit younger than you (35) and have been out of the number crunching for a bit. I basically trouble shoot vfd and electromechanical stuff. Used to be electrohydraulic in the coal mine, completely different story.

I have forgotten all that I didn't really want to know, ya know!

I try to teach the boy stuff and well, that is another bench mark!

 

[fossil]

...I have forgotten all that I didn't really want to know, ya know!

Oh yes, I know all too well.

...I try to teach the boy stuff and well, that is another bench mark!

Yeah good luck with that...I think patience on your part is one of the basic keys to making some of that work. Rick