Post in 'The Pellet Mill - Pellet and Multifuel Stoves' started by libirm, Oct 31, 2011.
X3 on the glass pattern...Looks pretty much like mine does burning on level 3 also!
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Filled and started stove @ 4:00 EST.
Ran @ setting 5 for three hours to burn off oil,paint smell.
Set to the 1 setting for evening
Filled hopper @ 7:15 am EST with about a half of bag this morning
NOW ON TO A CONCERN
The stove makes a rotisserie sound every time the auger feed the stove! I think this is normal right?
Can here it through out the whole house.
The only thing I tried so far is shut the stove off, unplugged it and started it again.
It is actually pretty annoying when all things are quite.
My friend dosnot seem to have the sound, only differance is I put a log set in, looks great, but I wondering if that might have something to do with it? Unlikely, but I am cooling the stove off now and will remove the log set to see.
Will put a call into my installer this morning ans see what he thinks.
Other a happier than a pellet pig in a pile of pellets!
Warm in LI
Hey guys it's me again,,,I am repeating my test to determine the pounds per hour of pellets that I am using but am adding another metric. I borrowed a high end Mitchell digital thermometer from my friends at Johnson Controls that run my building so that I can get a temp for my test. I guess my question is, what & were should I be measuring??? If I take a temp just at the front door of the insert, close to the tubes I get about 275 degrees after 1 hr of running. If I try to get a measurement from within the tubes, (with stove running) it fluctuates wildly between 450 to 525 because the blower is running. (setting are at heat =3, comb = 3 feed = 1).
Stove was completely cleaned inside and out, pellets (lignetics) were sifted and 40 full pounds were added. Running the stove on manual so that I can accurately determine exact hours run, accounting for the first several minutes at start up before I get flame. I will likely turn it on & off about 3 times, so it will not be running an straight 9 -12 hours for the test since it is around 50 in Boston right now.
I spoke to my dealer about adjusting the pellet preventer within the hopper as well as the Turbo Fan that is supposedly now coming with this years version of the M55 Insert, but which I am certain that don't have,,,and he told me he knows nothing about either of these issues - go figure. BTW my stove was a replacement for their crappy empress which failed after 2 months last winter and was replaced with the M55, (i paid the difference) last Feb of 2011.
Any further advice on my process for testing would be great and THANKS to everyone on this forum for all of you info and guidance. You guys are the best
I will keep you posted.
OK...here are my results. I filled the hopper TOTALLY full (requires pushing pellets back into hopper) at 9PM last night. Same settings as FredfromBoston (heat level 3, feed trim 2, combustion trim 3). Mag set around .15-.16. Only difference is I am burning Blazers (Doug Fir) instead of Lignetics. I refilled the hopper at 6AM this morning which equates to exactly 9hrs running. The stove was already running at 9PM, so I'm not factoring in startup usage.
3.5lbs/hr is my usage. My living room ended up at 80F, the temps outside only got down to about 32F. Upstairs at the farthest point from my stove (coldest part of house) ended up at 70F.
After filling with pellets, I weighed what was left in the bag. It was 8.5lbs. So that equates to 31.5lbs used, divided by 9hrs, equals 3.5lbs/hr.
I do not have the adjustable auger plate cover, so this is full out as many pellets as the stove will feed at these settings. Actually, I'm kind of surprised...I thought it would burn more than it does.
Extrapolating the data:
At this setting, 1 40lb bag will last 11.4hrs. 2 bags 22.8hrs. So a hair over 2 bags/day if running 24/7 and it was cold enough outside to run at heat level 3 non-stop. I'm guessing with my situation, it would take temps to dip down to 0F before I would really need to burn like this 24/7. Otherwise, my stove will be in hi/low mode running on a thermostat holding the living room temp somwhere around 74-76F.
The best and only way to measure temp is to put a probe into the heat exchanger tube without it touching the tube itself. Look at my 3rd picture in the post above. That is the setup I am using. I modified the metal thermometer clip that comes with a cooking thermometer so that it will stick into the stove above the heat exchanger tubes. There is a slot there and I had to cut and bend the clip to: 1. Hold the probe at the correct angle so as to not touch the walls of the heat exchange tube. 2. Jam into the slot above the tube so that it doesn't move.
Since you don't have the higher output blower, you are going to see a lot higher temps than me...but they should be pretty steady. Sounds like you are touching the stove itself and that's why your measurements are fluctuating so much. The steel itself fluctuates a lot as the fire goes from big to small, but the air within the tube stays pretty steady (within 10-15F or so).
Also, if you really want to compare apples to apples, mount your probe in the 2nd hole from the left side of the stove where mine is. And get the higher output blower. My dealer quoted me $250 for it (part # 50-2481).
Personally, I think the stove puts out more heat (or runs more efficient?) with the higher output blower. I'm not an engineer, but you would think less air coming out at a hotter temp would be the same as more air coming out at a lower temp. But, our house sure feels warmer with the new blower.
I was listening closely while at the showroom last week and I could hear the auger, but it didnt seem that it was loud enough to be heard through the whole house. Is it possible that because its an insert, the sound is sort of intensified being it is set in and maybe the sound echoes in the chimney? Just guessing here. Does your friend also have an insert? I am getting the logset also. Let me know what Billy has to say.. Hope you are warm !!
Thanks FlynfrFun,,, I will save your results since I may need them for my dealer so that I have something to compare against.
I am rerunning my test and really am hoping that I missed or miscalced something in my initial test.
I probably won't have the result until the end of this week-end though.
BTW I would be happy if I could get the same results that you got,,,,2 bags a day for 20 to 24 hours for this stove would be great!
I will let you know.
Don't forget to factor in that smaller pellets (length and/or dia.) will be fed faster than average size pellets. Since more will fit in each flight of the pellet auger and more weight is dumped into the burnpot in each shot. So, you have to assume that Lignetics are the same physical size & density as Blazers to really compare the two. But, at least this should give a pretty good idea of what the stove burns with an average pellet. I know Bear Mtn pellets are cut shorter and maybe even smaller dia. Yes, they feed quicker, but the heat output is also higher. That's what's great about these stoves...you can tweak the feed trim to take all this into account.
Another thing...Enviro has released a hopper plate that supposedly allows the stove to use more of the pellets before shutting down. It basically is a plate that mounts to the back of the hopper at a steeper angle. They had complaints of too many pellets left in the hopper when the stove shut down due to lack of fuel.
I've got one, but haven't installed it yet. Looking at it, I'm guessing it would block about 10lbs worth of pellets since it takes up part of the hopper space. However, if that 10lbs is unusable anyways, I guess it's a wash.
I'm wondering if Fred's stove has this? Maybe that's why he can't get as many pellets into the hopper? I know I can get a lot more than a bag when my stove is empty.
Sounds like your auger motor is defective. I had to have 2 replaced before I got a good one. It should be almost silent and not make the grinding noise a rotisserie makes. You will have to convince your dealer of this though as they might say it is OK since it's working.
The insert does tend to magnify all noises thru the house if you installed it into a pre-fab fireplace. That's how mine is. I believe it is because it is sitting directly on the hard tile with a lot of surface area directly resting on the tile. The freestanding only has 4 spots where it touches the tile and therefore is a little more insulated from transmitting noise to the house. I think I've got a way to fix this though...I'm going to lay 1/8" thick Lytherm under the stove railing/support structure. I'm thinking this will be enough to isolate the stove from a lot of the motor hum/vibration that gets transmitted to the house.
Mine -0- clearance fireplace was completely removed, box built to accept the unit.
The frame of the unit does sit on four leveling legs with the only attachment to walls is the stabilizing screw in the front, pressing up on the header.
I do agree a insert in a brick fireplace or stand alone will be more apt to deaden sound, be more quite.
I was thinking to myself that possibly a defective motor or part, which could happen to any brand or machine, your comments help me feel even stronger towards that conclution.
My installer will stopping by and will see what he says, it is hard to explain the sound over the phone, he have to experience it for himself.
Also I wait to my other friend who has the same install going on has the same complaint when it is done.
Again thanks for the help.
Good luck with it. Let us know what Billy has to say.. I do think Enviro needs to have a little better Quality Control on their units before sending them out though.
I can hear mine each time it turns when im sitting in the same room. Its more like a hum, no big deal. I cant here it any where else in the house. Keep us posted.
I added the log and didnt change a thing. Doubt that the log is making any noise
Here are some pics of what my install looked like when I did it. I don't use the leveling bolts which I believe helps cut some of the noise transmission down. The hearth was built level, so they really were not needed. I do however, use the jam bolt on the top side to keep the docking station in place.
Here is what my auger motor sounded like prior to them finally getting me a good one...
The new one is almost silent. I can hear a very slight "hum" when it runs, but I have to really listen for it. The old one about drove me nuts!
I forgot something. Are you in premium fuel setting (red LED)?
First- Beautiful install, box and tile nicely done-
Wow- sound? How did you do that? Very nice, I have a digital camcorder I try and record it and post, I guess on vimeo as well.
And finally yes it is on Premium-red light
Hey Fly thanks so much for the help this- I will try and post something later.
It has been warm here, in 50's so stove has not been on, just having a pellet stove seems to chase the cold away?! ;-)
My digital camera has a video setting. So, I just recorded with that and posted to vimeo. Yeah, it took me a week to tear out the old gas fireplace and build the box and new hearth.
While looking in the stove I don't remember the agitator moving, I should move when the auger moves- I think that how it should work, right?
Does the Agitator work independently of the auger?
When the stove was being installed, I remember the two sprockets connected by a chain...I have to believe that they run the auger & agitator together.
Not sure which why I am asking here.
Later- I put this to a test, if the agitator should be moving and it is not, it may be producing the loud rotisserie sound I been asking about.
In premium mode, the agitator runs for 1 min every 30 minutes. It does make some noise. If the chain is too tight, it will make more noise though. The chain will get tighter as the stove heats up, so you want it a little on the loose side when the stove is cool. It is adjustable.
Also on start up the agitator will start to turn after 5 minutes and stop when the stove detects the fire. In the manuel it states that the auger wont turn for 10 min. on startup. Obviously this is incorect.
I have noticed a lot of M55's (including mine) tend to have more fire in the left side of the burn pot. I did some experimenting and have been able to even up the fire so that it is pretty even across the burn pot. After looking at how the pellets drop, I was able to determine that the auger pushes them slightly to the left side of the chute as they fall. I think it has to do with the direction the auger turns. Anyways, I made a little sheet metal diverter which diverts just enough of the pellets to the right side of the pot to get a nice even fire. It's basically an extension of the existing chute, but straightens out the pellets that are heading too far to the left. I've been tinkering with this for a few months and am glad to finally have good results. The fire is even more enjoyable to watch now!
i am looking at the m55 or the gci60 (regency), and from some other posts understand them to be the same. the room that this would reside in has the main tv in it. does any noise from the insert make watching tv difficult without cranking the volume?
I have the M55 insert...It is relatively quiet, but you can hear it!!
they are a little noisy. You should see if a dealer has one operating so you can judge for yourself. the higher the setting the louder the fan noise. The m55 is a great stove. A lot of happy owners on this site.
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