Everything Fisher

[tickbitty]

I must be getting a little nutty - but in this craigslist ad for liberty bricks, they show a stack of them in a garage. Is that one of your original steptop papa bears there in that garage? It's kinda blurry, but that is definitely an overhanging top plate. Did the imitators do that too?

http://norfolk.craigslist.org/grd/1627091234.html

 

[hareball]

Nice find Tickbitty

Coaly--Those articles and ads are so cool! Have you ever come across any for the tri state area?

 

[coaly]

Don't know what stove that is, but the angled step plate looks too high, and too vertical for a Fisher. The ash fender looks too large and squared off on the corners as well. If the top's step piece is vertical, it would only be a 2 piece top. Easy way to find out. Ask !
Craigslist sellers don't bite ! (they just don't respond) We'll soon find out. Message sent.

 

[coaly]

Here's how you can find local info hareball. If your local papers are archived it's easier. If not, search "fisher stove" in quotes. It will bring up anything to do with the stoves locally or even in current news. Here's an Obituary that gives the road name of a dealer in Western NY state;
http://post-journal.com/page/content.detail/id/509173.html

Once you get a name or location of the dealership, you can search from there. This one being "Button Valley Road". By doing some research, you can find who all your local dealers were, some still in business as a plumbing or hardware store. Go in and talk to the oldest employees there and someone may say, you know there's still a bunch of literature upstairs from those stoves, you want it? That's where you'll find old dealer price lists.

I contacted the seller of that '76 Grandpa Bear to let him know he had something more collectable than the average stove, and he called me right away. He reconditions Round Oaks, and has a friend who has a "Huge Fisher" in his garage with a sun on the door, and a 10 inch exhaust. The information's out there, you just have to chase it down.

 

[Dakotas Dad]

I contacted the seller of that '76 Grandpa Bear to let him know he had something more collectable than the average stove, and he called me right away. He reconditions Round Oaks, and has a friend who has a "Huge Fisher" in his garage with a sun on the door, and a 10 inch exhaust. The information's out there, you just have to chase it down.

Well there goes my chance to get a cool stove cheap for the basement..

 

[coaly]

Nah, He feels his reserve is high enough so he didn't have to change it. Go for it. If you need a Grandpa, that's the one to have.
The pitting on the top to the right of the flue is pretty deep though. Still very fixable.

 

[coaly]

Can't tell you what that stove is. The fuel being sold is stacked at a customers where the picture was taken, so he doesn't know what the stove is.

 

[tickbitty]

Can't tell you what that stove is. The fuel being sold is stacked at a customers where the picture was taken, so he doesn't know what the stove is.

That's what I figured, I have seen their ads before but not that particular picture so I figured it must be a customers. Seems like you have it figured already though and ruled out, that expert eye can tell at first glance!

 

[summit]

Hey coaly, what do you make of this? BB posted on a previous thread a link to a company in new zealand that still made a stove called a fisher... Is that a load of bull, just ripping off the name? or is it an original licensee?
I found a thing for it (not the original post) here it is:

http://www.fisherstoves.co.nz/

 

[coaly]

There's a loaded question. Something Fishy in New Zealand !

That's why I posted the article back on page 2 of this thread, (post #28) that mentions 33 licensees from US, Canada, England and New Zealand attending the 1980 convention of licensees. Coincidence?

Here's my speculation;
In the news article giving details of the first convention that the book ends with in June 77, the names of those responsible for overseas expansion are given. Henry Eaton, the first President taking over for Bob was sending himself to England and the Vice President John Lynn was being sent to "the far east". These are the two men at the end of "The Fisher Story" that set up this first convention where Bob had to speak. Bob was only a director at that time. John Lynn is also the husband of the author Claudia Lynn.
It wouldn't surprise me if either of these two are the ones that went to the huge company Reliance Engineering for the fabrication of the new stoves.
http://www.nre.co.nz/

It could be one of the original licensees that went to the fabricator as well, but these two were well versed in global business. They also use the exact same trademarked logo today. Bob should still get royalties from the sales unless when he no longer was the owner / president, (The Wings eventually owned all of the company. Fisher - Century became Century Ind.) they possibly bought the rights to the registered trademark as well? Or they could have then been sold to whoever is having them made now? Or does Earl possibly still own them being the last company owner??
I don't know, but you would think this company would give the history and the affiliation with the original "Fisher Stove Works".

Here's the June 1977 article giving the information of the upcoming licensee convention that the book ends with and mentions the overseas plans.
Manufacturers of Fisher Stoves to convene in Eugene Thursday; 6-22-77
http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...7ITAAAAIBAJ&sjid=mdkDAAAAIBAJ&pg=4303,5713689

The other scenario; Once a company is out of business, is there a time limitation of trademark use? Could someone just start using it again? I notice there is no little r in a circle meaning it is a "registered trademark". Business law is not one of my strong points.

 

[coaly]

Here's what I can tell you about the domain name;
Date registered; 06/26/2007
Date Billed until; 06/26/2010
Last modified; 01/07/2010

Registrant name; Retail Links Limited
Contact address; P.O Box 8020, Victory
City; Nelson
Country; NZ (New Zealand)
Postal code; 7046
Contact email; [email protected]

Admin. name; Supra Limited
Admin. address; P.O Box 8020, Victory
City; Nelson
Admin. contact email; [email protected]

 

[coaly]

In my search of an ad in the local area of hareball, I came across the "I wish I'd had a Fisher" Benjamin Franklin ad as used on the dealer poster. Now I've got a reason to learn this page capture and screen shot thing;

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...=1719,481176&dq=fisher+stoves+papa+mama&hl=en

 

[hareball]

I did some searching of the local papers archives but none of them offer much in the way of archives, or at least online maybe?

 

[summit]

I see the nz co lists them as wood or coal burning, interesting.

 

[coaly]

I think those folks down under have a thing about burning a wood / coal mix.
The first stove shown on this dealers site is not a Fisher product but states "mix" with no ash pan for air under the fire. The largest Fisher Lochinvar can "burn wood or a wood / coal mix" and has no ash pan under the fire either. Notice that thing is rated to heat over 2600 s.f. too. The other two with ash pans make sense to burn wood or coal.
My cat would take up residence in the Warminton at the bottom of the page. She loves laying under any stove thats going. I swear she's medium rare.

http://www.thegrateplace.co.nz/4844/4979.html

 

[coaly]

Since this is 'Everything Fisher';
This is the warranty card that came with a new stove. Each model was pictured on the card. The bottom half was a tear off that the consumer filled out and sent back.

 

[coaly]

My opinion of the WORST fisher ad;

Goofy Bear (Might be his own grandpa)

6 Stove models listed giving detailed heating capacities.

7 stoves shown in the picture.

At least this gives a good comparison of the entire line in '79 with a picture of them lined up next to one another. Goldilocks being the showcased model in the foreground.
The stove missing in the description is the XL on the far left with the first style door before the sun. The height and width makes the Grandpa next to it look small. And a Grandpa is huge when you have to move it.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...BAJ&pg=5019,3683041&dq=fisher+woodstove&hl=en

 

[Pagey]

Those are some attractive beer prices! :coolgrin:

 

[coaly]

Bear Fact stranger than a $1.59 six pack;

Fisher Stove;
THE "Official Wood Stove of the 1980 winter Olympics" held at Lake Placid, New York USA

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...IBAJ&pg=1824,585205&dq=fisher+woodstove&hl=en

 

[coaly]

Factory Smoke Shelf Baffle (as designed in the Goldilocks using 6 inch top exiting flue)
Here's your measurements Pen;

5/16 steel plate, same as top material. Plate measures 20 1/2" long (21 inch inside firebox width)
Plate measures 8 inches wide. Notches at corners are cut 3 inches in from ends, 2 inches removed from the 8 inch width of the plate. (3 X 2 notch cut out)

Tack welded from top to angle iron and firebox sides on 30* angle. (measured with machinist protractor, not a guess)

Upper cooking surface measures 8 inches from rear to radius edge of bend. 6 inch flue pipe centered on 8 inch width of upper surface.

Front edge of Baffle Plate is 6 inches down from upper stove top plate.

Flue pipe extends 3 inches below top plate. (extends 3 inches into fire box above baffle)

Vertical straight edge against plate front edge shows flue pipe is set back 1/2 inch beyond plate edge.

Extending straight edge flat on baffle plate, (continuing 30* angle towards stove front) straight edge contacts center of lower bend radius with 3 1/2" air space between baffle plate and radius bend. (3 1/2 X 21 inch opening)

This stove has been used since 1982 when new, mostly only seasoned oak, and baffle has never been cleaned. No rust, metal looks brand new with no warping, no discoloration.

Stove only takes logs to 16" comfortable, (18 max) and usable height of 10 inches high in rear to baffle, 14 inches high at front of baffle, 15 inches to stove top lower cooking surface. I don't load all it will take overnight, about 3/4 full and always have a good bed of coals in the morning. Sometimes a glowing chunk depending on the size used. I didn't load it this morning since it was our first 58* day, so I raked it around at 3 PM and opened the air to burn out the coals that were left over. Some paper and kindling would have started it right up, and the stove was still warm.

This model does not use the through the door intakes, it draws up through the pedestal using a flapper all the way across the front of the stove. Air is controlled by the "Bear-O-Matic tm Draft Control" through the door adjustment that the threaded rod spun by the brass draft cap pushes on a welded tab connected to the air flap. A clean out is provided under the flap to remove ash or debris that falls through the flap. When left door is opened, flap drops open to prevent smoke roll back. Closing the doors resets the adjustment to where it was. I open it a turn or more until going, then close it down a fin at a time (1/5 turn) until it's cracked about one fin (we call one notch) for the night. 1/4 turn open if it's really cold, below 10* f. and 1/2 to 3/4 for cooking temperatures. But it soon gets too hot in the house if cooking too long. I included a third picture of the door cracked open to show the threaded rod with a rounded cap nut I added to prevent the threaded end from wearing or damaging the threads in case I have to take it out of the door.

 

[coaly]

As close as you can get to what the original style door would look like, ready for paint.

And presumably what the first Baby Bear would look like brush painted with Stove Bright.

 

[coaly]

Fin idea on the draft cap to keep cooler than the original pipe cap; 3 Fins

Baxter Fisher's Patented 4 Fin Draft Cap

5 Fin newer style, EZ-Spin trademarked Draft Cap

 

[hareball]

Really nice Coaly! Is that your baby Bear all finished?

What firebox is your stove closest in relation to?

Are the 5 fin much cooler? The 4 fin gets damn hot! I usually put one finger against the fin and rotate the cap while keeping my finger in the same position so I don't just burn one spot on my finger haha

 

[coaly]

Yeah, that's my finished Baby Bear from the crate and rust removing days. Thanks.

The fire box didn't change over the years until the angle iron corners were dropped in 1980 to the bolt on legs. Only the top is different. One piece tops are bent at 22 to 22 1/2 degrees. The three piece is steeper, I think I measured 15* off a 90* bend instead of the 22.

Within Baxter's Patent of the 4 fin cap;
"To assure comfortable grasping of the damper, heat radiating fins are provided which also enable foot control of the damper."

Now it doesn't mention wearing shoes.

I've often wondered about reducing the heat transfer to the cap. It's just a normal 1/2" bolt, double nutted to the door. It's all in the heat transfer from the door to the bolt. If you loosen the inside nut and back it off to the very end of the threads, less bolt will be sticking into the firebox. By drilling a hole about 1/4 in diameter into the end of the bolt, the depth of the door thickness and double nut, you would remove some metal that causes the heat transfer. It should be the thinnest "half nut" you can find.
The best way would be to definitely insulate it from the door; My way would be to turn down the bolt end where it contacts the door. Thread it for 3/8 instead of 1/2 inch. Still plenty strong enough. This would make a shoulder bolt out of it, and only a 3/8 washer would be needed on the outside of the door. Less mass, less transfer. Then wrap the bolt with an insulator material to prevent contact with the door. (3/8 diameter bolt in 1/2" hole) Material like asbestos sheet for gaskets between the washer / nut and door would isolate the stud from the door contact. I make my own high temp gasket material. (Back in the day....... boilers on steam locomotives were covered with "lagging" to insulate the boiler shell. An asbestos paste was made to a plaster or paper mache consistency, and the boiler was covered. When dry, the outer sheet metal covers it all. Here and there are 5/8 or 3/4 studs sticking out of the boiler to punch a hole through the exterior sheet metal where it overlaps to the next piece. A nut on these studs holds the sheet metal in place. When reconditioning a locomotive today, the original material is removed wet, or by professional asbestos removal team, boiler thickness is measured and x-rayed, and the new insulation is a material that looks like plaster when mixed with water, then strips of newspaper are dipped into it. You place the newspaper strips in all directions and build it up an inch thick or more. This is the white flakey stuff you find under boiler jacketing that looks like asbestos insulation. So I make my own insulating gaskets with newspaper and this paste material. Newspaper is laid up on wax paper, and when dry, there's your gasket material. Dunk the end of the bolt into this paste, and no contact is made)

I keep the threads coated good with silver anti-sieze as well to decrease metal to metal contact.
I touch the 5 fins bare handed. Wouldn't want to keep my hand on it for long.

 

[coaly]

Here's a profile of the steeper angle of the original top.

And the finished stove.