extend the Lopi burn just a little?

[gpcollen1]

I'm reading over some of the fine print in the Freedom's user's manual, and I found a couple interesting things.

In the "Overnight Burn" section (page 18) it reads "This stove is large enough to accommodate burn times up to 8 hours" which seems to contradict Lopi's advertisements of "heating a 2250 sq ft. house for 12 hours" --- unless its 60 degrees and sunny outside, and you OVERHEAT the house and then let the temp drift down during the last 4 hours, I imagine.....

The manual also states on page 18 that to achieve an overnight burn, you need to burn enough wood to get the stove up to 500+ degrees (which I've found is NOT an inconsequential amount of wood) and when the stove is 500+ degrees, THEN "Load as much wood as possible. Use large pieces if possible." This idea is kinda is contrary to their advertisement "Heat up to 2,250 sq. ft. for 12 hours on one load of wood" since you had to use 1/3 load of wood to get the stove up to temp....

So actually, you need 1 1/3 loads of wood, packing the stove as full as possible, to get the fire up to temperature and then have an 8 (not 12) hour burn time under best circumstances according to the manual. And that's probably not including the drain on the stove that the "optional" blower draws.

The fine print in the manual seems to substantially contradict the large print in the advertisements.

I hope you are kidding with all of this. Blaming advertising over your not understanding how wood stoves work is not the right choice. THERE ARE NO MAGIC STOVES.

OF COURSE you have to use WOOD to get the stove hot and ready for a FULL load to get an overnight burn!!

After 7 to 8 hours overnight, I have a hot and coal filled stove. After 12 - 14 hours, I have enough coals to get her going again.

 

[woodzilla]

I put 5 splits in this morning at 7 am and still have the blower moving air. Stovetop temp is just above 300. I had enough room in my masonry fireplace to add in some kaowool (ceramic insulation) this summer and it definityly has helped extend the usable heat time. Todays mix was 2 ash, 1 white oak and one small piece of red oak. I have gotten 12 hour times (blower running continuously) with mild outside temps in the 30's. As the thermometer drops and I let the top end of the cycle reach higher temps, the cycle is shortened. I have learned that cutting the air intake down seems to help the thermostat for the fan get hotter faster, resulting in quicker fan activation.

 

[stockdoct]

Ummm, no. Not kidding. I think the Freedom's advertising is deceptive.


But I will, this evening, do everything right. I have dry seasoned wood, I will get the temp up to 600+ and then pack it till to the gills with large splits, put the blower fan on low so as not to stress the poor thing too much, and see how long I get heat until the blower cuts off. Any bets?

 

[stockdoct]

I put 5 splits in this morning at 7 am and still have the blower moving air. Stovetop temp is just above 300. I had enough room in my masonry fireplace to add in some kaowool (ceramic insulation) this summer and it definityly has helped extend the usable heat time. Todays mix was 2 ash, 1 white oak and one small piece of red oak. I have gotten 12 hour times (blower running continuously) with mild outside temps in the 30’s. As the thermometer drops and I let the top end of the cycle reach higher temps, the cycle is shortened. I have learned that cutting the air intake down seems to help the thermostat for the fan get hotter faster, resulting in quicker fan activation.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Two excellent ideas. Thanks!

 

[gpcollen1]

My bet will be that you kick yourself in the butt before you post again - if you do it right that is.

I always have the fan on low for daytime burns [12 hours or so] and it will depend on overnight burns based on how much heat I want/need.

 

[drdoct]

Judging from your above post about having to add wood to get it up to temp, I think your expecting too much. I don't want to be remedial, but burning is an art. I usually start my cold Revere with 2 splits about 5" apart N/S and a 1/8 of a firestarter brick with pallet kindling bridging the 2 splits right over the burning brick. When all this catches I've got a nice little fire going so then I stack about 3 more smaller splits to get the temps up to 350 or so. Then I close the bypass. I keep the air open all the way until I see it getting around 400 or so. Then depending on how it looks, I'll go ahead and fill up the firebox with all the wood facing the same direction. Then I leave the door unlatched until it gets good and burning and then latch the door and move the air inlet to about halfway. I'll be at about 500 or so and it will slowly rise to around 600 and stay there for about 3-4 hours. Then after about 5 hours it will start coaling and when it gets down to around 400 or so and it'll pretty much just be coals with a little fire left. I'll load it up again. Same thing with the door not latched until it gets good and hot again. I keep it hot trying to time it to bedtime. At bedtime you load that sucker up even more, really poking it all together and jamming. Same thing with the door cracked until it gets hot then I close it down to about 1/3. In the morning I get up and I'll have nice coal logs. I'll rake them to the front and add 3 pieces of pallet kindling and crack the door while I go get 3 splits. Come back to fire and then load up the splits. Get them going good and then fill that sucker back up and get burning and shut down to 1/3 again. Leave the house for work. Come home at 6pm with nice coals... repeat. I know this is remedial, but I kinda got from your post above that you plan on just starting a fire and then putting in a few logs expecting it to make it 12 hours. No stove will work like that. It's an ongoing thing. Stove temperature being the most important. You've got to get the mass up and heated before it really will burn long periods. The heated stove mass is what keeps that fire going. I don't know how they sold you the stove and what they said, but you should have no problems once you get used to running that thing. Just don't expect it to start and stop like a furnace though. It's more like a train than a Trane. My Lopi people here suck though so maybe you got a bum salesman. I sure wish I had your extra cuft. though.

 

[stockdoct]

An experiment on my Lopi Freedom blower fan ..... since I hate to have the blower fan shut off (cuz it takes 20-30 minutes of high-intensity burning to resume blowing) I wanted to know when exactly it shuts off. In addition, I wanted to know how much heat I'm NOT getting at night after blower fan shuts off and the stove is sending its heat up the chimney. This is what I found out today:

With stove top temp at .......and Blower on "high" ( 80% engaged)
500 air from blower is 135 degrees
450 131
400 126
350 114
300 102
270 Blower cuts off


With stovetop temp at ..... and Blower is on "low" (30% engaged)

500 degrees air from blower is 148 degrees
450 140
400 136
350 122
300 110
250 100
220 Blower cuts off


I'm not sure what to make of these numbers. Is it surprising that the air blown from the blower at a stovetop temp of 400 degrees is only 14 degrees cooler than when the stove was churning away at 100 degrees hotter? Not really. Is it surprising that air from the stove blower is warmer on "low" setting than when the blower is on "high"? Not really, we can expect air to absorb more heat when it goes across a hot surface more slowly.

I guess what I learned is that when the blower cuts off on "high" setting (270 degrees), the air being blown is so cool I'm really not missing much warmth by not having the blower go an hour or two more. There's simply not much heat left.

But as recommended on this thread, I'll try re-starting the stove with the air-intake cut down a bit to see if I can get the blower going a little earlier.

 

[stockdoct]

But I will, this evening, do everything right. I have dry seasoned wood, I will get the temp up to 600+ and then pack it till to the gills with large splits, put the blower fan on low so as not to stress the poor thing too much, and see how long I get heat until the blower cuts off. Any bets?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

5 hours and 40 minutes.

Thanks all. With your suggestions, I ran my stove hotter than I ever have, jam-packed it fuller with seasoned wood and loaded it when it was 600+ degrees (makes for a hot face!) and learned how to get more than a 2 1/2 - 3 hour "blower-on to blower off" burn.

And as to the claim of "heat a home for 12 hours on one load of wood", I've learned that even in the best of circumstances that ain't happening.

Thanks to all for your suggestions, and even your criticism. I'm still learning.

 

[pyro68]

can you give any description of how the unit is vented? Do you have a liner in the chimney? Is the liner insulated? Have you had the draft checked in your chimney? Are you getting any help from your dealer? Many different factors in play here, keep in mind the marketing depts are going to put the best performance under optimum circumstances. My opinion Travis is much more realistic than many others. My friend put a woodstove in and had extreme difficulty getting good burn times, he was using seasoned Oak & Hickory. After much experimenting he had the draft in his chimney checked and found he was one of a very small percentage, he had excessive draft. Ended up installing a damper to control the draft. Be careful with that, a very small percentage need this, and if you take too much away from the chimney you can have severe creosote problems. I've found one or two bigger splits with smaller ones packed around it tightly gives longer burn times. Keep in mind that the more you can reduce the air flow in between the splits the longer the fire will burn. If your wood is short enough, try loading north to south. Just out of curiosity, what type of wood are you burning?

 

[stovetechri]

Something's wrong, for sure. I don't do overnight burns, but my Endeavor does an easy 6 hours of real heat on 5-6 splits in the 5" or smaller range. It's been a long time since I loaded it full, but loading 3/4 full, I'll have usable coals after 8 hours.
That said, I can't imagine 12 hours of heat. Maybe 10 with tight-packed oak, but after 12 hours I'd expect only enough coals to start kindling, if that, no real heat production. The claims are based on some kind of "ideal situation". Who knows what it is. There's no standardized testing for burn times, so they get to use an unlikely scenario in their ads.

YOUR NOT FILLING YOUR STOVE ALL THE WAY......... 12 hrs dampend down is good for the lowest sq ft. you burn more wood to heat more sqft and the wood burns faster 4-7 hrs. R U guys not Listening. ive installed over 300 lopi stoves. And im not seeing any problems but you wood or your comprehension of the way you use a stove.

Uh, yeah. I don't fill my stove. I was sharing that I get better times out of my stove without filling my stove. And you sort of proved my point about burn times. 12 hours is heating the smallest sq ft. with a full box of hardwood damped all the way down. Not how it's always going to be run. When they say 'up to 2500 sqft, up to 12 hours,' it's not both, it's either/or. That's what seems a little misleading. No need to insult my wood or my comprehension.

I Dont understand not filling your stove up all the way full and adjusting your air for the amount of heat you want. im sorry i mislead what you were saying. There is always some people that should never be allowed to own a woodstove. In fact these idiots usually have a lexus parked in there driveway and could afford to burn dollar bills instead

 

[stovetechri]

I'm not familiar with your stove's controls, but it seems odd that you cannot switch the blower to a manual setting. Do you have an owner's booklet that came with the stove. I'd check that out and see if they mention anything about the blower being set to manual.

should u be giving avice? answer is no

 

[kenny chaos]

I'm reading over some of the fine print in the Freedom's user's manual, and I found a couple interesting things.

In the "Overnight Burn" section (page 18) it reads "This stove is large enough to accommodate burn times up to 8 hours" which seems to contradict Lopi's advertisements of "heating a 2250 sq ft. house for 12 hours" --- unless its 60 degrees and sunny outside, and you OVERHEAT the house and then let the temp drift down during the last 4 hours, I imagine.....

The manual also states on page 18 that to achieve an overnight burn, you need to burn enough wood to get the stove up to 500+ degrees (which I've found is NOT an inconsequential amount of wood) and when the stove is 500+ degrees, THEN "Load as much wood as possible. Use large pieces if possible." This idea is kinda is contrary to their advertisement "Heat up to 2,250 sq. ft. for 12 hours on one load of wood" since you had to use 1/3 load of wood to get the stove up to temp....

So actually, you need 1 1/3 loads of wood, packing the stove as full as possible, to get the fire up to temperature and then have an 8 (not 12) hour burn time under best circumstances according to the manual. And that's probably not including the drain on the stove that the "optional" blower draws.

The fine print in the manual seems to substantially contradict the large print in the advertisements.

now your reading the manual not a surprise. say the unit from travis industries sucks and then read the manual. get a clue

Tough day today?

 

[BrotherBart]

should u be giving avice? answer is no

I'll give some advice. Tone it down.

 

[stovetechri]

real bad day

 

[North of 60]

And now back to the post folks. :cheese:
stockdoc it looks like after a bit of a rouse you have attempted to pay attention to some more detail. Sounds like you are now trying to work with your stove in a positive way. This will always lead to positive results or at least some answers you have been seeking. Your session on the hearth couch has been a good start. Believe me we are all pulling for you. Hopefully even the fellow that has had the bad day. This should be the place to come to and enjoy and hopefully learn. My remarks/wording has to smarten up from time to time also. This thread has reminded me of that. I wonder if Doctor Bart will be sending us a bill for this session on the couch. ;-P Please keep the stove junkies informed on your progress as we can also learn from you. Cheers :coolsmile:
N of 60

 

[madrone]

I Dont understand not filling your stove up all the way full and adjusting your air for the amount of heat you want.

Fair enough, here's why: I'm not a 24/7 burner. I supplement with wood. If I'm only going to be home for part of the day, I'd rather load up what I can enjoy. I don't do overnights. If I am home all day sometimes I load full, but usually 3/4 or a little less. I enjoy fiddling with the stove. When my furnace failed in December a few years ago, I did indeed fill it up all the way, many times. Sorry your day sucked.

 

[madrone]

5 hours and 40 minutes.

Nice. It took me almost 2 years to figure out what the heck I was doing with my stove. Of course, I didn't have the manual or this site. Time spent getting to know the stove is worth it. Glad things are improving.

 

[gpcollen1]

<<Thanks to all for your suggestions, and even your criticism. I’m still learning.

Sometimes criticism is full of suggestion....sometimes not.

I think you are moving in the right direction. I think with some fine tuning, there is still some burn time and heat to be gained out of that big stove. Now that you have surpassed the 600 mark - get her up to 700 and 800. It is there you find some great results in filling that firebox, secondary combustion and clean burning of a big load of wood.

Also remember - that air control push/pull has a small range from open to closed. Even though you can slide the thing a mile, it is only that inch or so that determines open/closed. You will need to get real comfortable with that too.

 

[pyro68]

OOHHH the Love in this place. . . makes me so warm I can stop feeding my stove. . . . ;-)

 

[stockdoct]

I have learned that cutting the air intake down seems to help the thermostat for the fan get hotter faster, resulting in quicker fan activation.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Works like a charm!

I reload my 270-300 degree stove part way with easily-combustible small stuff, I shut the air intake down by 50%, and the fan is blowing again before the temp needle has even moved, within 5 minutes the fan is blowing again. Then I let the air intake full open again to get the fire really going again. Works wonderfully

Thanks!