Fireview burn temperatures vs. time

[fire_man]

There have been a few member posts lately about how hot and how long their Fireviews were burning so I thought I'd share mine.
It was loaded with 100% made in USA Red Oak, seasoned 2.5 years, top covered the last 6 months.
I think I could have cleaned more ash out and fit 2-3 more small splits if I tried. The splits were all 16", split small (3" to 5").
The front temp was measured in the upper right corner of the cast iron trim.

Time Front Temp. Stovetop Temp. Room temp Outside Temp

0 Hrs 250F 290F 67.1F 24F Load, engage cat in 15 minutes, set draft=1.0
1 Hr 490 550F 68.2 26 Excellent secondaries, dropped draft to 0.75
2 Hr 450 520 69.6 27 Secondaries Quit
3 Hr 400 440 70.3 28 Set Draft to 1.5
4 Hr 395 400 70.7 27
5 Hr 340 360 69.5 24
6 Hr 290 300 69.1 23 Set Draft to 3
6.5 Hr 280 290 68.5 22 Reload Time!

I have gone 10 hrs using Oak, but the draft was set to 0.5 the entire time and the final stovetop temp was 250F.

 

[Todd]

I wonder what would happen if you left the air at #1 the whole time instead of turning it down to .75 and then turning it back up later on? Are you seeing any smoke out your chimney?

I loaded mine up this afternoon with 4 good sized Oak splits at 3pm with the air set at #1. Watched the temp climb up to about 620 by 4pm, went to work out at the YMCA, got back home, it's now 6pm and stove is at 500 with the air still set at #1. The two front splits are down to big red chunks and you can see the two in back still solid and I also have some slow lazy flame going on. House temp is 80 in the basement and 75 right above in the livingroom, outside temp 16. No Keystone burning today. I figure on leaving the air alone and it should be good to load at 10pm with a stove top temp around 250-300.

7pm 440 stove top
8pm 350
9pm 320
10pm 275 time for reload at I'll set the air at .75 for a 10 hour burn and reload at 8am

 

[fire_man]

I wonder what would happen if you left the air at #1 the whole time instead of turning it down to .75 and then turning it back up later on? Are you seeing any smoke out your chimney?

I loaded mine up this afternoon with 4 good sized Oak splits at 3pm with the air set at #1. Watched the temp climb up to about 620 by 4pm, went to work out at the YMCA, got back home, it's now 6pm and stove is at 500 with the air still set at #1. The two front splits are down to big red chunks and you can see the two in back still solid and I also have some slow lazy flame going on. House temp is 80 in the basement and 75 right above in the livingroom, outside temp 16. No Keystone burning today. I figure on leaving the air alone and it should be good to load at 10pm with a stove top temp around 250-300.

Todd: You point out one huge difference between your burn and mine. I load 10-13 small splits, you load 4 good size ones. I split based on Woodstock's literature which stated 2-5 inch splits, they claim in their instructions smaller is better for quicker light ups and better burns. But after reading your post I wonder if bigger is better. I have trouble seasoning wood on my lot which is another reason I split small.

I don't think leaving the draft on 1 the entire time will matter much but I will give that a try. I open up the draft towards the end of the burn to shrink the coal base and liven it up for the reload. I am envious of your house temps, but it sounds like you are heating a basement and first floor, and I am heating two above ground floors. that could make a huge difference when it is very cold out.

 

[Todd]

I wonder what would happen if you left the air at #1 the whole time instead of turning it down to .75 and then turning it back up later on? Are you seeing any smoke out your chimney?

I loaded mine up this afternoon with 4 good sized Oak splits at 3pm with the air set at #1. Watched the temp climb up to about 620 by 4pm, went to work out at the YMCA, got back home, it's now 6pm and stove is at 500 with the air still set at #1. The two front splits are down to big red chunks and you can see the two in back still solid and I also have some slow lazy flame going on. House temp is 80 in the basement and 75 right above in the livingroom, outside temp 16. No Keystone burning today. I figure on leaving the air alone and it should be good to load at 10pm with a stove top temp around 250-300.

Todd: You point out one huge difference between your burn and mine. I load 10-13 small splits, you load 4 good size ones. I split based on Woodstock's literature which stated 2-5 inch splits, they claim in their instructions smaller is better for quicker light ups and better burns. But after reading your post I wonder if bigger is better. I have trouble seasoning wood on my lot which is another reason I split small.

I don't think leaving the draft on 1 the entire time will matter much but I will give that a try. I open up the draft towards the end of the burn to shrink the coal base and liven it up for the reload. I am envious of your house temps, but it sounds like you are heating a basement and first floor, and I am heating two above ground floors. that could make a huge difference when it is very cold out.

Holy crap! 10-13 splits? This last load I put in were in the 4-6" range. I think most of my firewood is 3-6" diameter and I load from 4-6 splits for a full load. 2" is kindling for me and 3 inchers are just fillers. I think you need bigger wood like me. :coolgrin:

 

[Todd]

I'm monitoring my temps every hour with this last load and noticed my 5 hour temp the same as yours but were higher the previous 4 hours. I'd like to see what size splits others burn and what hourly temps they get. This is kind of interesting.

 

[fire_man]

I'll hunt for some bigger splits tomorrow. But yes, I am fitting at least 9 splits in a typical load.

 

[akennyd]

fire_man-Thanks for starting this thread, I'm watching and trying to learn a thing or two.

Todd-Thanks for your input

I have been burning mostly pine and am getting no where near your burn times. I'm working at getting more hardwood this winter (along with more pine) that will hopefully be ready by next winter...I'm debating and completely undecided on how large to make my splits (very interesting to see that larger spits seem to be burning longer). I'm worried that if I make them too large they will not be ready by next winter. I'm going to try to keep the stacks covered all year in hopes of getting them a little dryer a little faster.

God is good

 

[rickw]

From your data table it looks like you are trying to keep visible flames (secondaries), turning up the air when the secondaries go out. You really do not need visible flames at all (except at the beginning of the burn cycle before you engage the cat). Trust your cat and run with the firebox dark - you'll have much longer burn times.
Good luck!

 

[Todd]

Here is my morning reload after a 10 hour burn. There were more coals than usual but I just raked them forward and loaded 4 splits. Stove top was at 240. This load will be burned at #1 for a little hotter burn to get the house back up to temp, should be ready for reload at 3pm. Basement temp was down to 74 and upstairs 72 with an outside temp of 10. colder air coming in today, probably fire up the Keystone this evening.

8am- 240
9am- 550 Don't know where she peaked out, had to go shovel snow
10am- 540
11am- 480 flames about done
12pm- 400
1pm- 340
3pm- 300

 

[Backwoods Savage]

I wonder what would happen if you left the air at #1 the whole time instead of turning it down to .75 and then turning it back up later on? Are you seeing any smoke out your chimney?

I loaded mine up this afternoon with 4 good sized Oak splits at 3pm with the air set at #1. Watched the temp climb up to about 620 by 4pm, went to work out at the YMCA, got back home, it's now 6pm and stove is at 500 with the air still set at #1. The two front splits are down to big red chunks and you can see the two in back still solid and I also have some slow lazy flame going on. House temp is 80 in the basement and 75 right above in the livingroom, outside temp 16. No Keystone burning today. I figure on leaving the air alone and it should be good to load at 10pm with a stove top temp around 250-300.

Todd: You point out one huge difference between your burn and mine. I load 10-13 small splits, you load 4 good size ones. I split based on Woodstock's literature which stated 2-5 inch splits, they claim in their instructions smaller is better for quicker light ups and better burns. But after reading your post I wonder if bigger is better. I have trouble seasoning wood on my lot which is another reason I split small.

I don't think leaving the draft on 1 the entire time will matter much but I will give that a try. I open up the draft towards the end of the burn to shrink the coal base and liven it up for the reload. I am envious of your house temps, but it sounds like you are heating a basement and first floor, and I am heating two above ground floors. that could make a huge difference when it is very cold out.

Tony, with the temperatures you are giving I have to agree with Todd that you should try to leave the draft setting on 1 rather than going down further. I would also suggest setting the draft up to 4 rather than 3 at the end of the burn. We do that before it is down all the way to coals. Most times the stove top will be around 400 when we do this. I do remember yesterday though when I turned the draft up to 4 when the stove top was around 425.

I would also suggest reloading sooner than you have been. At this time of the year we rarely let the stove get below 300 or maybe 350 before we are reloading. But you also have to bear in mind that we just do not put in full loads during the daytime hours.

As for size of splits, there are many times we can't get more than 4 splits in the stove for overnight loads. Most times though I can get in 5 or 6 maximum. If I do load at night with smaller splits the thing will roast us out in short order because the stove top temperature will be up there kissing the 700 degree mark and it will stay above 600 for a long, long time.

 

[fire_man]

From your data table it looks like you are trying to keep visible flames (secondaries), turning up the air when the secondaries go out. You really do not need visible flames at all (except at the beginning of the burn cycle before you engage the cat). Trust your cat and run with the firebox dark - you'll have much longer burn times.
Good luck!

Rick: I agree, I get very long burn times if I keep the firebox dark. But that is at the expense of HEAT!. I have measured the front of the stove (probably representing most of the stove's thermal mass other than the stovetop). If the stovetop is 650 with no flames, the rest of the stove can be way below 300F. But as soon as the firebox flames start, the rest of the stove zips up towards 550F. With my house I need all the heat I can get, thus the need for flame. During shoulder season, I do like you say and run the firebox dark and get very long (greater than 10 hrs) of good heat.

 

[fire_man]

fire_man-Thanks for starting this thread, I'm watching and trying to learn a thing or two.

Todd-Thanks for your input

I have been burning mostly pine and am getting no where near your burn times. I'm working at getting more hardwood this winter (along with more pine) that will hopefully be ready by next winter...I'm debating and completely undecided on how large to make my splits (very interesting to see that larger spits seem to be burning longer). I'm worried that if I make them too large they will not be ready by next winter. I'm going to try to keep the stacks covered all year in hopes of getting them a little dryer a little faster.

God is good

akennyd: I have been struggling with the same issue, splitting smaller to get stuff seasoned. I am now 3+ years ahead so based on what gets resolved from my present experiments I will either keep splitting small or go larger. Based on what Todd and Dennis have experienced, larger seems better. Todd seems to be getting better early burns, and similar final temperatures. My wood has been seasoned for 2.5 years and was split small, so hopefully it's seasoning quality is not in question.

 

[fire_man]

Todd:

Thanks for posting the burn times, that's a great comparison. I agree, we seem to have similar final burns, but you are doing way better early on. Dennis seems to have similar results as you.I intend to take both your advice and run with the draft turned up more, especially towards the end of the burn.

When I saw the picture of your loaded Fireview. I almost fell out of my chair! Those are monster splits by my standards! I don't have anything even close to that in my 12+ cord of split wood. Last year I re-split wood that was your size smaller based on advice from Woodstock, but I never gave those big splits a chance. Now I am kicking myself. Those bigger splits were originally intended for my old VC Resolute, but we switched to the FV.

 

[leeave96]

From your data table it looks like you are trying to keep visible flames (secondaries), turning up the air when the secondaries go out. You really do not need visible flames at all (except at the beginning of the burn cycle before you engage the cat). Trust your cat and run with the firebox dark - you'll have much longer burn times.
Good luck!

Rick: I agree, I get very long burn times if I keep the firebox dark. But that is at the expense of HEAT!. I have measured the front of the stove (probably representing most of the stove's thermal mass other than the stovetop). If the stovetop is 650 with no flames, the rest of the stove can be way below 300F. But as soon as the firebox flames start, the rest of the stove zips up towards 550F. With my house I need all the heat I can get, thus the need for flame. During shoulder season, I do like you say and run the firebox dark and get very long (greater than 10 hrs) of good heat.

Tony,

You need flames to max the heat out of these cat stoves. When the temperature plunges in combo with my drafty house, need more heat output on my Keystone than just stove top driven cat temperatures and open the damper. The most I can get is about 4 hours of flame burn time with max heat output.

I don't know if your house is in need of insulation and windows like mine, but when the temperature moderates, I get a sample of what a sealed-up house might feel like along with lower stove temperatures, longer cat driven burn times - with 75ish room temperatures.

I wouldn't fret your wood. Just burn it as required, play around with the damper settings and when you reload your woodpile, you can adjust the size. You also may be able to trade some wood with someone with larger splits too.

Good luck,
Bill

 

[BrowningBAR]

You need flames to max the heat out of these cat stoves.

That's not entirely accurate. I am getting the most heat out of the Intrepid when my flame activity is at it's lowest. I know this is very close to the way Woodstock's work, also.

 

[jetmech]

I concur with BAR my intrepid seems to put out max heat after flames are dying down and starting into coaling stage.

 

[leeave96]

You need flames to max the heat out of these cat stoves.

That's not entirely accurate. I am getting the most heat out of the Intrepid when my flame activity is at it's lowest. I know this is very close to the way Woodstock's work, also.

It is accurate. I can't speak to the Interpid, but my Woodstock Keystone, max heat comes with more flames. For lack of better words, these stoves have two modes of heat, cat driven heat and whole stove heat - which includes cat heat. So if you want more heat than the cat can drive out of the stove, then you need flames. This combo gets the stove sides hotter than just the cat alone. But - there is a balance between how much flame you can get before you are sending a goodly amount of heat up the chimney via opening the damper to much.

Bill

 

[Todd]

You need flames to max the heat out of these cat stoves.

That's not entirely accurate. I am getting the most heat out of the Intrepid when my flame activity is at it's lowest. I know this is very close to the way Woodstock's work, also.

It is accurate. I can't speak to the Interpid, but my Woodstock Keystone, max heat comes with more flames. For lack of better words, these stoves have two modes of heat, cat driven heat and whole stove heat - which includes cat heat. So if you want more heat than the cat can drive out of the stove, then you need flames. This combo gets the stove sides hotter than just the cat alone. But - there is a balance between how much flame you can get before you are sending a goodly amount of heat up the chimney via opening the damper to much.

Bill

I have to agree with Bill, more air and flames equals more heat with these Woodstock stoves. The Intrepid has the cat in the lower back of the stove so that would make a difference compared to the Woodstock design where the cat is on top. I think a lot of people see those high stove top temps with a smouldering fire and get fooled thinking they are seeing max output and don't realize the rest of the stove is relatively cooler. I can tell this just by placing a thermometer on the loading door and watching the difference.

 

[Todd]

Todd:

Thanks for posting the burn times, that's a great comparison. I agree, we seem to have similar final burns, but you are doing way better early on. Dennis seems to have similar results as you.I intend to take both your advice and run with the draft turned up more, especially towards the end of the burn.

When I saw the picture of your loaded Fireview. I almost fell out of my chair! Those are monster splits by my standards! I don't have anything even close to that in my 12+ cord of split wood. Last year I re-split wood that was your size smaller based on advice from Woodstock, but I never gave those big splits a chance. Now I am kicking myself. Those bigger splits were originally intended for my old VC Resolute, but we switched to the FV.

I almost fell out of my chair when you told my you loaded 10-13 splits in yours. lol, I never noticed Woodstock's recomended split size, I've just always split mine in the 3-6" range and sometimes have a few bigger. I've also been told by some here that my kindling looks like small splits.

Even with your smaller splits I think you will find leaving the stove at a higher setting should give you more heat at the beggining of the cycle which may boost your house temps up a little. The first couple hours is when the load does all of it's outgassing and smoking which creates most of the heat. Turning up the air later on just burns down the coals quicker.

 

[fire_man]

Todd: I liked your Picture of the loaded FV so much I had to post mine.

Regarding Flame activity vs temp - I agree with you and Bill, The Woodstock stoves put out more heat when there is flame in the box - I have measured this. Other designs may behave differently as you point out.

I am now burning a load of mostly soft maple and some oak, I'm gonna leave the draft on 1.0 all day and see how I do. Very cold air coming, 0F tonight so I want to get the house temp up.

 

[Todd]

Quite the load there Tony. Sounds like that #1 setting worked out good. Take a look at your upper door hinge pin, looks like it's ready to work it's way out. Mine does the same thing.

I just loaded mine up an hour ago with 4 big splits, bigger than the previous, barely got the last one in, stoves cruising at 620, air set at #1 with a good lazy flame and red hot coals. Nice and toasty.

 

[fire_man]

Quite the load there Tony. Sounds like that #1 setting worked out good. Take a look at your upper door hinge pin, looks like it's ready to work it's way out. Mine does the same thing.

I just loaded mine up an hour ago with 4 big splits, bigger than the previous, barely got the last one in, stoves cruising at 620, air set at #1 with a good lazy flame and red hot coals. Nice and toasty.

Yup, loose upper hinge pin alright. Good catch. I should photograph the rest of the stove and find out if any gaskets need replacement!
Thanks for all the great tips.