fireview flames in screen

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Lead Hot

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Oct 15, 2011
37
Upper Piedmont, NC
I've been trying to get long overnight burns in my fireview. Many times I get flame inside the screen and have to clear the flame. This leads me to run the stove with a little flame and shortens my burn cycle. Any advise on long cat. burns without getting flames in the screen.
 
I remember this question when I had the FV. The answer I remember is that the flame as a result of secondary combustion was not a concern, but the flame directly from the wood supply running up and into the screen is a problem. I'm not sure I know why, flame is hot either way. It probably has more to due with draft intensity/flame combination.

I remember worrying the first time I got those rolling secondaries that I was going to hurt something, but then I realized that's the way the stove operates.

I would suggest you call WS and please let us know what they say!
 
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My suggestion is to not worry. As you know, if you keep some flame in the stove you will get more heat and yes, it will shorten the cycle but not by all that much unless you give it a lot of draft.

With the rolling flame and looking like the pits of he!1 itself, that will not shorten the cycle. In fact, if you turn the draft down to where you have no flame, most times, with a full or nearly full firebox, you will come back later and see that the rolling flame is there even though you had it down. It won't last too long and won't shorten the cycle or at least that has been our observation.

Not sure where you have the draft set but with our stove about .75 seems to give the best results. That is, enough heat to keep us warm and yet a long enough burn so that you don't wake up to a cold house. We have tried setting the draft lower but what we then find is that the stove is not all that hot and there is a huge amount of coals and not yet burned wood. Of course, simply giving it more draft takes care of that.

I suggest you experiment with draft settings perhaps a .5, .75, 1 and 1.25. See how long the fire keeps with the different settings but you'll have to do it more than once because other factors come into play, such as the type of wood, the size of the wood, the outside temperature, wind, etc, etc.

Also when the burn gets almost down to all coals, we then open the draft full. Sometimes we will even rake the coals which will help them burn down faster.

Naturally the type of wood has a huge effect. This is why we keep our oak for the cold January and February nights. Also how you load the stove matters a lot. We try to have not a huge bed of coals before we load up for the night so that we can get more wood in. Then we move the coals to the front (daytime we just spread them). Then the most important piece of wood goes in the bottom rear. This could be a large split or round. This piece is the key to holding longer fires.

In addition, when splitting wood I like to split a lot so that we end up with rectangles and/or squares. Looking at the picture below, notice the ends are built with squares and rectangles. We really like these for that bottom rear. Most times we will have very few coals under that piece and will have it tight to the rear of the stove. We do this even when the weather is not so cold, like lows maybe in the 20's. Usually with those temperatures we do not necessarily fill the stove but it will give plenty of heat so that we wake up to a house that is still in the high 70's. Then we add wood and get the temperature to around 80. Plenty of folks winch at those temperatures but this is how we keep our home all winter long.
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I thought the original post was questioning if it was ok to have flame in the screen - concerned it would cause damage.

Is the question related to burn time or flame impingement concern?
 
I thought the original post was questioning if it was ok to have flame in the screen - concerned it would cause damage.

Is the question related to burn time or flame impingement concern?
Well, OP is opening the air to get the flame back out of the scoop and into the stove, and is thinking that will shorten burn time. Flame inside the screen is nothing to worry about, though.
Seems like if you cut the air a large amount at once, this is more likely to happen because there's still a lot of smoke in the box and the cat is hot. If you cut the air very gradually and the cat cools, flame doesn't seem to jump up into the scoop as often.
 
I always cut the air down in stages over 30 to 45 minutes. Eventually the stove goes into a cat. burn after a while I notice flickering and find fire inside the screen.My concern is damage to the cat. and trying to get the longer overnight burn. When I see flame in the screen with no other flame should I just leave it alone or open the air to get the flame away from the cat. I'm starting to wonder if I should choke it down even further to slow the air flow more and that may stop the issue before it starts. I run my stove slightly less than one typically when set.
 
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I always cut the air down in stages over 30 to 45 minutes. Eventually the stove goes into a cat. burn
As an aside, maybe I'm not reading this right but it sounds like you aren't following the method outlined in the manual, that is, to get the stove up to temp with the bypass open, then close the bypass. When you do this, the cat should start glowing within about 15-30 seconds, not "eventually," as you describe it....

after a while I notice flickering and find fire inside the screen.My concern is damage to the cat. and trying to get the longer overnight burn. When I see flame in the screen with no other flame should I just leave it alone or open the air to get the flame away from the cat. I'm starting to wonder if I should choke it down even further to slow the air flow more and that may stop the issue before it starts. I run my stove slightly less than one typically when set.
As fire_man says above, he had the same questions, and was assured that secondary burning under the cat didn't constitute 'flame impingement.' Others who spoke directly with the folks at Woodstock were told that in tests, "we had a very hard time creating flame impingement." I don't know if you have the steel cat or not but they are less inclined to damage from flame impingement than the ceramic cat. Any cat can be 'de-laminated' by excessive heat though.
Most of the flame inside the screen seems to be right inside the screen, not under the cat, at a lower air setting anyway. With more air, the flame can be under the cat and the cat will be glowing more brightly, but according to the temp reports from those that have installed digital probes, these cat temps are still not excessive.

You say you are having trouble getting overnight burns; Once the cat is lit, what do you set the air on when you want the stove to cruise? Do you just leave the air there for the rest of the burn? What kind of stove top temps do you have throughout the burn?
But yeah, in NC you may be able to run the stove with very low air settings and still get enough heat in most cases. Then you very seldom get the flame inside the scoop. You will get an overnight burn easily....depending on how long you sleep. ;lol That stove will go 16 hrs. on low and still have some coals in it.
 
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I've been trying to get long overnight burns in my fireview. Many times I get flame inside the screen and have to clear the flame. This leads me to run the stove with a little flame and shortens my burn cycle. Any advise on long cat. burns without getting flames in the screen.

We have the same "issue" in our Keystone. We spoke to Woodstock about it and they said it was nothing to worry about...won't cause any damage.

I no longer adjust the air to get rid of the flame and it usually burns itself out in a couple minutes. When the flame is inside the scoop, we usually get a flame "explosion" in the firebox after a few minutes and then all the flames disappear to a glowing cat.
 
So I decided to play with the stove tonight. I used to have problems with back puffing. Learned to turn the air down a little more. Then came the fire inside the scoop. Turned the air down a little to see what would happen. Low and behold I watched the flame in the scoop diminish then disappear. I was just nervous about taking the air down to somewhere between 3/4 and 1/2. After see backwoodssavage turned his to 3/4 I gave this a try. My oak and hickory are right now finally giving me that long overnight burn.
 
I was just nervous about taking the air down to somewhere between 3/4 and 1/2.
If I didn't need a lot of heat, I could cut the air to zero on both of the Woodstocks. Never a problem with backpuffing on my 16' flue.
 
Well, the "screen" you're referring to is there simply to cause air turbulence in front of the cat. It's perfectly acceptable to have flame roaring all over it. Often times flames will roar back out the screen as smoke is burned by the cat. People call this secondary flame. My Fireview is almost 13 years old, and I've had parts of that screen glowing red . If you think about it, the screen is within inches of an extremely hot catalytic combustor and directly above a roaring fire. Basically, there's nothing to worry about...the screen isn't going to be damaged and if it were it's a very easy part to replace. When I first got my stove I would push that thing so hard that I warped the cast plate that the screen attaches to. That cost me 40 bucks and just swaps out with two bolts. Woodstock told me they sell a lot of those plates! I had the screen out at the same time and it was fine. My thing is...they're wood stoves designed to hold very hot fires and flames. Put your mind at ease and just enjoy a nice fire. You're not going to hurt anything. I agree with others, experiment with air settings. You'll learn what the stove needs for air flow combined with given temps outside. A word about combustors....just because it's not glowing doesn't mean it's not re-burning smoke. Many times I've engaged my combustor, had roaring flames and a few secondaries but looked up through the screen to see nothing but black. A quick look at the chimney reveals no smoke and just heat signature...and if it's cold enough a tiny amount of steam that dissipates within a few feet.
 
I didn't realize I could take it to zero. I always thought it would stall. I'll try dropping it further soon.
 
I didn't realize I could take it to zero. I always thought it would stall. I'll try dropping it further soon.

I would not recommend that but you can if you want. For sure once you got a good fire established you cold but if you will not be around to tend the stove, once the fire gets through about 50-60% of the burn cycle, the heat output will be very, very low. With ours, I have burned at about .5 sometimes when it is really cold outdoors but found out that if we went to bed and left it that way, usually when I get up during the night (for other reasons), I would find the stove top temperature to be down around 400. Had I left the draft there, the house would have been too cool for our liking. Personally, I like waking up to a warm house rather than a cold or even cool house. If the house temperature gets down to 76 here, there is something wrong. We keep it warmer than that.
 
I didn't realize I could take it to zero. I always thought it would stall. . .
It depends on your draft/chimney. A shorter chimney on a warmish day with low barometric pressure may well stall. From what I've seen, The few Fv owners who routinely run below 0.5 air setting have exceptionally strong draft. ~ 90% of owners report the sweet spot between 0.5 - 1.25. My approach is to get the air down to 1, then nudge it slightly up or down, usually down, to maintain nice secondary flames.
 
When I first got my stove I would push that thing so hard that I warped the cast plate that the screen attaches to. . .Woodstock told me they sell a lot of those plates. . .
Just a heads-up:
The cast iron plate has been updated to a stainless steel plate and inconel screen.

https://store.woodstove.com/product.php?productid=16703&cat=259&page=1

http://www.woodstove.com/images/editorial_support/FireviewPDF-Instructions/modified combustor scoop installation.pdf
 
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