I posted this in a previous thread but didn't get the publicity do here it is and hope it sounds good because I'm. Finally settled on it! Here is my current idea. I finally got my fiancé to stray from the insert only idea. I would like to get the nc30 and take advantage of my military discount. I am thinking that I will still do an 8" insulated liner and block off plate. Yes I know the nc30 uses a 6" but this is temporary. We have a lot of near future projects coming up and budget conscious decision for stove needs to happen for now. But I would like to do 8" on a 20 ft chimney and tuck the nc30 halfway into the fireplace. After a few years and other projects settle I will move the nc30 to the basement and hook her up to my 2nd flue. Then my liner is already set and ready for large beautiful insert! Please tell me this sounds like a sound idea given the current constraints . I know for sure the nc30 and a proper install/block plate is going to be a vast improvement over my current beat up mistreated (previous owner) insert that is currently installed as a direct connect
Flaws in my plan?
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HotCoals
Minister of Fire
Now I have people telling me to not do 8" that on a 25-30 ft chimney a 6" liner is good for almost any setup. Guys are telling me to just put an adapter on top of larger stove when the time comes to swap them out. 6" liner kit is about 400$ cheaper which of course is not a bad thing
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
Pretty sure mines 25 ft didn't measure all that great but maybe a touch over u still think a 6" liner will be fine exterior chimney when I go to put a large insert that calls for 8"? As easy as putt 8" to 6" on top of stove to use existing 6" liner? If so u made my day and I'm purchasing an englander nc30 tomm morning!
Edit
Is the increase in price for insulation really worth it? As far as heat output is there anything to gain from wrapping the ss liner?
Edit
Is the increase in price for insulation really worth it? As far as heat output is there anything to gain from wrapping the ss liner?
HotCoals
Minister of Fire
If after the 30 you end up with a bigger stove with a bigger door you would appreciate the bigger pipe..just sayin'.
I doubt BK saying 8" on the king is just so the consumer can spend more money on pipe. I bet they lose some sales over it actually.
CenterTree
Minister of Fire
I believe you will see a warmer running flue with the insulation. Which is translated into LESS creosote build up due to less condensation (cooling of gases). Well worth the extra cost while installing a liner!
brenndatomu
Minister of Fire
^^^ + 1! ^^^
Edit: oops, didn't refresh the thread after dinner. +1 on Fossils reply about goin 6", and yeah, insulate the liner.
Edit: oops, didn't refresh the thread after dinner. +1 on Fossils reply about goin 6", and yeah, insulate the liner.
Looked at a lot the past few months and for the $ I can't find anything that beats it . I'm pumped for an increase in performance and getting farther away from filling my evil propane tank the better! Hope this englander can handle 24/7 burning
someone had to come in making it complicated for me
. I'm an over analyzer but I have to compromise. I figure 6" would still do fine on a stove that recommends an 8" peak performance probably not but enough to notice ? Hope not . But 6" saves me money and seems the most versatile even with the larger stoves
HotCoals
Minister of Fire
Looked at a lot the past few months and for the $ I can't find anything that beats it . I'm pumped for an increase in performance and getting farther away from filling my evil propane tank the better! Hope this englander can handle 24/7 burning
someone had to come in making it complicated for me
Well,sounds like you talked yourself into it.
If you don't mind some smoke coming in the house when you reload you will probably be ok.
I don't know if there any other side effects. Maybe more prone to back puffing..I dunno.
Really think 6" would effect a large insert at 25 ft height? What if I ran 8" and used the englander nc30 like my original plan? Appreciate you taking the time but now you have me u sure again. Or if the difference is tiny I will stick with the 6"
Stick with the plan...6"insulated liner. You don't know what you'll do in the future, plus with a nice tall chimney, you should have good draft even if you do a 8" to 6" reduction. (that should actually work better for you than a 6" to 8" increase). But you're not installing an imaginary future stove, you're installing a real today stove...do it right.
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
6" will actually draft stronger than the 8".
You have a 6" outlet in the 30, go with 6" liner.
If you go to a stove with an 8" outlet, you may still be able to use the 6", some here are doing just that.
Worst case, you get an 8" if and when you ever get a stove with an 8" outlet.
Better to go smaller diameter than needed than larger.
You have a 6" outlet in the 30, go with 6" liner.
If you go to a stove with an 8" outlet, you may still be able to use the 6", some here are doing just that.
Worst case, you get an 8" if and when you ever get a stove with an 8" outlet.
Better to go smaller diameter than needed than larger.
all of the large inserts I have been looking at call for a 6" pipe so that's what I would use. PE summit, BK princess, and Avalon Olympic are some of the largest inserts out there and they all cal for a 6" liner.
HotCoals
Minister of Fire
Well if he ends up using a insert with a 6" flue I guess there is no discussion.
I still say if any future stove has a 8" outlet that is what should be used for the pipe also.
He maybe content with the 30 and never switch.
I still say if any future stove has a 8" outlet that is what should be used for the pipe also.
He maybe content with the 30 and never switch.
Hope, but inserts we are most interested in is the buck 91/94 of course it is 8" ..... Trying to avoid redoing but we will see
HotCoals
Minister of Fire
Well they put the 8" on there for a reason or 3.
But good luck with whatever you decide. Cheers!
Listen..if you end up with the Buck on a 6 and lets say you're not happy with burn times or back puffing or smoke coming into the room at reload,what's the first thought that is going to pop in your head?
With the stove being tucked back about 1/2 way into fireplace opening would you still use an insert liner kit? I would imagine it would be the same as installing an insert with the top exhaust of stove being in the same place. Dumb question but just want to make sure. And what is the difference between a terra cotta top plate and a deluxe terra outta top plate? Ordering frome liner depot
Hogwildz
Minister of Fire
Yes, if you are stuffing a stove inside a fireplace, you will want to reline the chimney as you would with an insert.
I am going to be blunt. Take certain info from some folks here with a grain of salt.
If your going with a stove with 6" outlet, get 6" liner, if your going for a stove with 8" outlet, go 8" liner. Don't waste time guessing on a liner for a stove your might get, forgoing one for a stove you are getting.
Any the comments about a 6" back puffing due to the stove calling for an 8" is complete bullshat. A smaller diameter pipe is going to draft stronger than the larger pipe more times than not. The other way around may very well will create back puffing and smoke issues. That said, I still stand behind whatever stove you know your getting, get the proper size for that stove.
I am going to be blunt. Take certain info from some folks here with a grain of salt.
If your going with a stove with 6" outlet, get 6" liner, if your going for a stove with 8" outlet, go 8" liner. Don't waste time guessing on a liner for a stove your might get, forgoing one for a stove you are getting.
Any the comments about a 6" back puffing due to the stove calling for an 8" is complete bullshat. A smaller diameter pipe is going to draft stronger than the larger pipe more times than not. The other way around may very well will create back puffing and smoke issues. That said, I still stand behind whatever stove you know your getting, get the proper size for that stove.
Back puffing is a usual symptom of of a too large and uninsulated flue and/or cold flue that can 't be heated fast enough. It can also be caused by insufficient combustion air to appliance. Basement installs are notorious for these problems due to the length and negative pressure problems, although negative pressure can happen at any level /length of flue. External down drafts from trees, adjacent buildings, topography also come into play on occasion. But to blame it on a particular size flue/ stove combination is off base
tcassavaugh
Minister of Fire
I would really like to get a bkk but I already have a 6" pipe in place and advice in here has been not to neck down to 6" for proper operation. my brother has an old mother earth that he necked down, it looks a lot like a bkk, but his run is only about 10-12 feet straight up.
brenndatomu
Minister of Fire
IF! IF! IF!
If in one hand and sh*t in the the other, see which one fills up first!
First thought?...Shoulda left that nc30 in here!
Chances are alot better of that maybe-someday-buck working OK on a 6" than the soon to be nc 30 working worth a crap on a 8"! Get a 6" and don't look back!
And Hogz is right, the 6" will have the stronger draft of the two...Smaller diameter = higher draft velocities = warmer chimney = stronger draft!
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