newb on these boilers. lately the FUEL has been popping up. the other day as it was warming up, i had it up to 165 and then the fan shuts off and FUEL shows up. then i can't get it off there. the only way i can get it to reset is by going through the settings until i get to "PROD" and hitting the ok button again and going back to factory settings. Everything seems to be working fine, but i'm just getting the fuel deal even though i'm up to temp and the chamber is full of wood. any thoughts? and be gentle cause i don't know much about this stuff...yet. Thanks!
FUEL Keeps coming on...
- Thread starter Gilby
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Gasifier
Minister of Fire
Sounds like you need to tweak the Fb and the Fd settings. I am assuming you have an RK-2001ua control. Do a search on here for RK-2001 and you will find a boatload of help.
what are your Fb and Fd settings? They sound like they need to be increased and since it doesn't sound like you have storage it should not hurt a thing. Check you pump start setting too?
taxidermist
Minister of Fire
Gilby, give us some more info like storage no storage. Where your settings are like pump launch temp ect. and we should be able to get ya running smooth.
Rob
Rob
stee6043
Minister of Fire
My settings are factory. Like I said in the op, once the FUEL comes on, I can't get it off. I thought I used to be able to hit the stop button and have it clear, but that isn't working so I just reset it to factory settings when it does appear. I'm not positive what they should be set at because I don't know much about this whole beast!!
In regards to starting my boiler - if its out or cold - I pile a bunch of kindling and smaller pieces of wood on a good bed of newspaper. I can usually get it started fairly well, but it takes 30 minutes or more to get my water temp up to 170 or so. If I shut both furnaces off, it'll heat up quicker, but then my house cools off. The problem I've ran into, is if I ever let it burn out, I have a heck of a time getting it heated up again because my house is trying to warm up, thus sending back cold water. When my house is up to temp, the boiler runs a ton better.
My other concern is the boiler this weekend had a tendency to creep up on its own. It generally hangs out around 172 and when my furnaces turn on it'll get down to 163 or so and will fluctuate back and forth. But twice it krept up to 190. Once it hit 190, the pumps shut down. So my water temp is at 190+, both furnace fans are blowing (cold air), and my water pipes are ice cold. If I hit the start button, the pumps kick on and the pipes get instantly hot and my furnaces then blow warm. That's all fine and well, except if I'm not home and the boiler continues to get hotter and hotter all the while my house gets colder and colder. Why do those pumps shut down when the temp creeps up there??
Thanks again for all the help guys. Appreciate it.
In regards to starting my boiler - if its out or cold - I pile a bunch of kindling and smaller pieces of wood on a good bed of newspaper. I can usually get it started fairly well, but it takes 30 minutes or more to get my water temp up to 170 or so. If I shut both furnaces off, it'll heat up quicker, but then my house cools off. The problem I've ran into, is if I ever let it burn out, I have a heck of a time getting it heated up again because my house is trying to warm up, thus sending back cold water. When my house is up to temp, the boiler runs a ton better.
My other concern is the boiler this weekend had a tendency to creep up on its own. It generally hangs out around 172 and when my furnaces turn on it'll get down to 163 or so and will fluctuate back and forth. But twice it krept up to 190. Once it hit 190, the pumps shut down. So my water temp is at 190+, both furnace fans are blowing (cold air), and my water pipes are ice cold. If I hit the start button, the pumps kick on and the pipes get instantly hot and my furnaces then blow warm. That's all fine and well, except if I'm not home and the boiler continues to get hotter and hotter all the while my house gets colder and colder. Why do those pumps shut down when the temp creeps up there??
Thanks again for all the help guys. Appreciate it.
Oh...
I currently do not have storage. House is 4700 sq ft. Have an electric furnace on one side of the house...gas furnace on the other. Have fans running on both through hot water coils. When my house is cold, I have a hard time keeping the boiler up to temp. Once the house is warm, it generally runs very efficiently (with the exception of it getting too warm and shutting down the pumps).
I currently do not have storage. House is 4700 sq ft. Have an electric furnace on one side of the house...gas furnace on the other. Have fans running on both through hot water coils. When my house is cold, I have a hard time keeping the boiler up to temp. Once the house is warm, it generally runs very efficiently (with the exception of it getting too warm and shutting down the pumps).
Hunderliggur
Minister of Fire
Assuming you have the RK-2001 Controller (you probably do), the key items are:
Circulator Pump launch temperature (what takes the hot water from the boiler to your HX's): P144 I set mine to 170 meaning the circulator will run when the boiler temp is >= 170F.
Circulator Pump launch hysteresis (how much it drops before it stops): Ph4 I set mine to 5 meaning the circulator will turn off when the boiler temp is <=165
These settings mean that 165+ water is circulated to your HX when the boiler is producing heat. I would set the controller temperature dial to 175F+ if you have no storage. That way, the blower (that causes the wood to burn) will shut down until the boiler temp drops to 170F. The circulator will still be running since it reached 170F.
I hope you have return temp protection on the boiler (Danfoss or equal). The return into the boiler should be >= 140F.
You can Google search for the manual (I have an Orlan Paxo 40 with the RK-2001UA controller). PM me if you need me to send a copy of mine, or try a google search for your boiler manual.
Good luck!
Circulator Pump launch temperature (what takes the hot water from the boiler to your HX's): P144 I set mine to 170 meaning the circulator will run when the boiler temp is >= 170F.
Circulator Pump launch hysteresis (how much it drops before it stops): Ph4 I set mine to 5 meaning the circulator will turn off when the boiler temp is <=165
These settings mean that 165+ water is circulated to your HX when the boiler is producing heat. I would set the controller temperature dial to 175F+ if you have no storage. That way, the blower (that causes the wood to burn) will shut down until the boiler temp drops to 170F. The circulator will still be running since it reached 170F.
I hope you have return temp protection on the boiler (Danfoss or equal). The return into the boiler should be >= 140F.
You can Google search for the manual (I have an Orlan Paxo 40 with the RK-2001UA controller). PM me if you need me to send a copy of mine, or try a google search for your boiler manual.
Good luck!
WOW! I think the fuel bill to heat that much house would be close to my mortgage payment!
Gilby said:
taxidermist
Minister of Fire
Thanks for the info. Without being in my garage looking at this...it's hard to follow...but I'll print it out and check it when I get home.
On the Ph4 - what happens if the circulator turns off at less than 165...but my house isn't up to temp? That means there is no water circulating thus the furnace fans blowing cold air on cold coils and not heating my house??? Or am I way off??
Per my plumber friend, there is no return temp protection. I generally have a pretty big gap between return temp and boiler temp...which I know isn't a good thing. Any suggestions on WHAT to buy and from whom??
Sorry for the dumb questions. Trying to figure this thing out consistently. It ran well last night and was still at 165 at 5:30 this morning when I left the house. I threw two logs on and came back an hour and a half later to the same 165 and a warm house. First time that has happened, but I really feel like I am going through wood fast.
And yes...if I had to pay for the electric and propane heat on this house, I'd be broke as a joke. Hence me asking questions trying to figure this boiler out
taxidermist
Minister of Fire
Here is what you need in a 140*F http://www.newhorizoncorp.com/PDF/DanfossVTC_Datasheet.pdf
Here is what I would set it at and try it.
temp dial to 180
pump launch P 170
ph 5 which means the pump will shut off at 165*
fd 60 means if your boiler does not get up to your set temp on the dial in 60 min the boiler shuts down and says fuel
I am guessing here because i have storage i run mine a little different.
Rob
Here is what I would set it at and try it.
temp dial to 180
pump launch P 170
ph 5 which means the pump will shut off at 165*
fd 60 means if your boiler does not get up to your set temp on the dial in 60 min the boiler shuts down and says fuel
I am guessing here because i have storage i run mine a little different.
Rob
Hunderliggur
Minister of Fire
When the pump shuts down since the temp is < P144 - P4 (less than 165), the boiler is not producing heat anyway. Continuing to circulate the water when no producing heat will not help warm the house.. The boiler will be much less than 165 if you keep running the circulator and the house blowers. The firebox burns better in my opinion, and from others, with the hotter 170F firebox. Setting the temp dial at 180F means you will not waste wood heating water when the house HX cannot use it (180F at the house HX is plenty hot). We'll talk you in to storage next season! I'm loving mine.
You really do need (must have) the return temp protection. Without it you are putting unnecessary stress on your boiler and a less than optimal operation. I got my 140F Danfoss from Mark at AHONA, you can get them from several sources. Make sure you plumb it with the bypass control valve (ball valve) so you can adjust the flows.
Drier wood is better. Once you have return temp protection (140F return water) and a better understanding of how it is working, you can adjust a few more things like fan speed to get a little more efficiency from your burns. Don't bother with that right now, just work on the basics.
You really do need (must have) the return temp protection. Without it you are putting unnecessary stress on your boiler and a less than optimal operation. I got my 140F Danfoss from Mark at AHONA, you can get them from several sources. Make sure you plumb it with the bypass control valve (ball valve) so you can adjust the flows.
Drier wood is better. Once you have return temp protection (140F return water) and a better understanding of how it is working, you can adjust a few more things like fan speed to get a little more efficiency from your burns. Don't bother with that right now, just work on the basics.
Like many have said the default settings suck. On at 165-170 and off at 160-165 is what I would suggest. Maybe 180 with the dial setting which will slow the fans as you approach that temp and stop when you reach it. With storage this could be set higher but 180 will allow for some "creep". The danfoss $195 is a must, get the 1 1/4" at least. New horizon or coZyheat or pex supply should all have it. Sounds likee your buddy can help you install it. Too much $ invested here to not have it. I have both my Fd and Fb set for 2h and have not had a FUEL shutdown since. I think the pump settings made the most difference. A stack temp/timer is next on my list
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