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Green Irony

Post in 'The Green Room' started by webbie, Jun 13, 2008.

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  1. jebatty

    jebatty Minister of Fire

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    That's what the lemmings said as they rushed towards the cliff -- it's all a crock.

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  2. webbie

    webbie Seasoned Moderator Staff Member

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    Same thing the people being flooded out now and from Katrina are saying......maybe natural? Maybe not....who really cares unless it is YOU that is being flooded out? After all, we can't really see them.....just another news story.

    According to those in the scientific community, GW is not even a theory any more. Of course, the exact cause and effects are still being studied.

    In a country where more people believe in the Devil than in Evolution, anything is possible.....heck, I give up!
  3. jebatty

    jebatty Minister of Fire

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    Could it be a bit ironic that in not drilling now for possible oil, and using other available foreign oil, we are better positioning ourselves for the future when oil will be far more valuable? and of course, stimulating alternative energy sources that no on denies we need? In our life we often have not accessed available savings to meet a current want, and got by on alternatives, the benefit being that the savings were there when something really important came up, and also that we modified our life style for the better.
  4. Redox

    Redox Minister of Fire

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    I like that thinking. Save those valuable deposits for when oil is $8/gal, like the rest of the world is currently...

    Chris
  5. Adios Pantalones

    Adios Pantalones Minister of Fire

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    "According to those in the scientific community, GW is not even a theory any more."

    I think that you mean "hypothesis". It could never go beyond "theory".

    A theory is a hypothesis that is tested. It generally has several "moving parts"- it's not a simple relationship that can be easily described in mathmatical terms (a proven law). Evolution, for instance, is well accepted but is a theory. Parts may change as new evidence is uncovered, but the underlying principle theory (change over time) is the same.

    Man-made global warming is very disputed back and forth. One side says "it's proven". The other says "it's unproveable" because of the records of climate change before industrialization.
  6. Adios Pantalones

    Adios Pantalones Minister of Fire

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    "That’s what the lemmings said as they rushed towards the cliff—it’s all a crock. "

    LOL- well, since lemmings don't actually jump off cliffs and swim to their deaths as we've been led to believe... this statement is sort of ironic, ya?
  7. TMonter

    TMonter Minister of Fire

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    Actually on a per energy input basis, electric cars have almost 0 advantage on gasoline cars. On a per dollar basis they are cheaper to drive but that is because of the scale of electric generating plants.
  8. TMonter

    TMonter Minister of Fire

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    AGW effects on climate are also very disputed amongst the scientific community, not to mention that no one has come up with a reasonable model that can be used from one year to the next to predict changes in climate.

    It's not a theory, it's a fact. However the same can not be said for the cause of the warming. The whole alarmist crowd doesn't seem to want to pay attention to the actual science.
  9. mainemac

    mainemac Member

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    1) global warming

    http://dotearth.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/06/23/nasas-hansen-humans-still-loading-climate-dice/

    It appears that James Hansen has been testifying about this stuff for longer than I realized.
    I was not aware that this was known so far back.

    That being said, I always wonder why is it we we are able to accept and act on acid rain but not global warming.
    There really is no controversy that GW exists or that we are the cause of this.

    I remember there were 'experts' from the tobacco industry that swore that there was no cause effect to lung cancer and smoking...............
    It seems there are now 'experts' from the oil/coal fossil fuel industry who feel there is no cause effect from CO2 and melting glaciers in CO MT Europe Asia etc.

    2) Evolution

    With regard to evolution just because there is "theory of" before a word does not mean it is not a fact.
    Einstein came up with the theory of relativity and it was proven a few years later to be true. Evolution has been proven over and over again not
    just in botany and fossil record but also in molecular genetics.
    Of course when you come to the hospital you can choose to be treated with Penicillin even though your pneumonia was caused by a bacteria that mutated evolving
    into a penicillin resistant bacteria if you like!

    Tom
  10. jebatty

    jebatty Minister of Fire

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    Lemmings - as most myths have some basis in fact, Wikipedia states:

    "On occasion, and particularly in the case of the Norway lemmings in Scandinavia, large migrating groups will reach a cliff overlooking the ocean. They will stop until the urge to press on causes them to jump off the cliff and start swimming, sometimes to exhaustion and death. Lemmings are also often pushed into the sea as more and more lemmings arrive at the shore."
  11. Adios Pantalones

    Adios Pantalones Minister of Fire

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    "It’s not a theory, it’s a fact. However the same can not be said for the cause of the warming. "

    When you talk to a scientist, "theory" means something very different than what you think it does. It doesn't mean "hypothesis", as you seem to suggest.

    On lemmings- yes, I had "herd" that, but calling people lemmings is a tad off base in purpose, IMO: http://www.snopes.com/disney/films/lemmings.asp
    Disney herded them off a cliff to make the popular film that gave the impression that they commit "suicide", or follow others to their deaths purposely. That some die accidentally during mishap in migration is certainly possible, but calling others "lemmings" because they follow blindly to catastrophy is a bit of blind belief in Disney stories (Yes- I'm on a mission to dispel the myth) :)
    I think the ones in front get to the edge, and a bit of "Festival Seating" hysteria ensues. Wacky rodents- LOL
  12. Redox

    Redox Minister of Fire

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    Kinda like a European soccer match...

    Chris
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