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Greenfire Furnaces....Good Purchase?

Post in 'The Boiler Room - Wood Boilers and Furnaces' started by PEI1, Jul 21, 2008.

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  1. newbie976

    newbie976 New Member

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    Is there anybody on this form who owns a Greenfire and is happy with it? I've read some post from Sparke and he seemd very happy ith his purchase... Someone please help!... I need a boiler that is CSA and or Epa stamped to heat my house. I have looked on the net for awhile now and really liked the EKO 60 but it wasn't certified. I don't really want to spend anymore than $7000 on the boiler it self. I live only an hour and a half from Calis maine so I could go pick one up. I need help I think I am making this decsion too hard.

    B.S

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  2. BrownianHeatingTech

    BrownianHeatingTech Minister of Fire

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    No, it's not just a coincidence. The manufacturer was making the Adobe boilers as a subcontractor to the Adobe company. We was screwed over by them when they pocketed the money and ran, just like many others were. He continued making the boilers for sale, and I think added a few things.

    For what it's worth, I've looked over a few of them, and it does seem to be a well-made product. I have no experience with actually installing them, or with any customers who have used them, but the build quality looks nice and there are no blatant flaws in the design.

    Joe
  3. BrownianHeatingTech

    BrownianHeatingTech Minister of Fire

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    "Cheap" and "stamped" don't tend to go together. I don't believe that the Greenfire is stamped, but I could be mistaken.

    I'd suggest Econoburn or Tarm, personally. Either one should be readily available to you.

    Joe
  4. Mainewood

    Mainewood Member

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    Joe, are You saying the former manufactuer for Adobe is building Green Horizon boilers?
  5. webbie

    webbie Seasoned Moderator Staff Member

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    It is my suggestion that people buy boilers from a company that employs engineers who have extensive experience in the design of hydronic systems and pressure vessels. To not do so is to throw away about 150 years of progress, this being the reason for the original Hartford Steam Boiler Insurance Company.

    I certainly wish success upon any venture, but at the same time understand that there is a BIG difference between a firebox with some pipes in it and a properly engineered and constructed boiler.

    A home heating boiler can be a 25+ year plus (or longer) investment. Will parts and service and warranty support be available, etc. etc. etc.?

    Honestly, I thought the day of stoves being made in the local welding shop was largely over.
    http://www.flogris.org/exhibitions/HSB_online/abouthsb.html
    -------------
    "The Hartford Steam Boiler Inspection and Insurance Company is a global provider of specialty insurance products, inspection services and engineering consulting. Its roots as a Connecticut corporation date to the 1850s when a group of Hartford engineers expressed concern at the disastrous consequences of steam boiler explosions, a frequent occurrence of that day. In the wake of the 1865 explosion of the Mississippi River steamer Sultana, the worst boiler explosion in American history with a loss of 1,238 lives, they formed a company that would both inspect and insure steam boilers. Founded in 1866, Hartford Steam Boiler is one of the pioneering American businesses devoted to industrial safety."
    ------------

    There are various approvals and standards which can apply to wood fired boilers....make certain that any boiler you consider has at least some of them.
  6. BrownianHeatingTech

    BrownianHeatingTech Minister of Fire

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    Greenfire boilers.

    I'm not personally familiar with "Green Horizon," but there are so many manufacturers coming out of the woodwork these days...

    Joe
  7. PEI1

    PEI1 New Member

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    hey Joe,

    Green Horizon is the marketing firm that has the exclusive rights to sell and market the old Greenfire Wood Furnaces under the new Green Horizon Boiler name.........there is no more Greenfire only Green Horizons.

    and yes Mainwood, from what I understand SJV Trailers owner "Mark" was a subcontractor building the Adobe system, but was screwed over like the rest of the customers..........it is my understanding that he has taken the Seton design and made some "Improvements" and is now manufacturing them for Green Horizons.........I believe the CEO for green horizons has even made some investment to make them CSA approved for Canadian distribution.....but don't quote me on that.

    PEI1
  8. NNYorker

    NNYorker Member

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    I can see where all these people inquiring about Greenfire/Greenhorizon are coming from because I was one of them a year and a half ago. I was looking for a reasonable alternative to heat my home. My neighbor had/has an Aqua-Therm that burns plenty of wood; I wasn't interested in that.
    I wanted something that burned less wood and was easy on my wallet. I did my research and I purchased an Adobe Boiler from Phillip Dougherty. From that day on to the present time I was screwed. By who? Of course, Phillip Dougherty. Way back to my first post on this site, I had a couple of questions for Phil. He had no answers or passed the buck to Mark @ SJV Trailers. I finally pieced together that this "knowledgeable seller/installer" Phil was useless.
    Mark was/is the only person who has helped Adobe Boiler owners in the past and present. Mark is not to blame for the Adobe Boiler disaster. Phillip Dougherty was forewarned of potential problems/issues with his specific instructions on how the boiler would be built. Did he heed such warnings? Of course not! Phillip Dougherty is an insurance salesman, remember? He played the odds like a bean counter would--with so few a warranty claims how could anything go wrong. Phil cheaped the boiler out to make maximum profit for himself. Which brings me full circle to--If he would have gone the extra couple hundred dollars and skinned the unit in stainless I would have probably never visited/stumbled upon this site. IF he would have contacted me and put forth the least little bit of effort to resolve my rotting skin problem,if,if,if......
    This boiler is obviously not an EKO or Tarm. It has a definite learning curve like all boilers. My main beef with this thing is the damn cheapness that Phillip Dougherty placed on enclosing this thing in. So I spend 5-700 bucks rebuilding it thanks to the snake oil salesman Phil. His defrauding people goes way beyond my $4,700 purchase. I have personally spoken to someone still in the home wood heating business who was taken/conned /defrauded of a sum very close to SIX FIGURES. I'm sure everyone can figure out who Phil has ripped off close to home by previous posts.
    I have experimented with my boiler this summer and heated my pool with it. I'm sure that the unit Mark builds is of a MUCH higher quality than what I currently own. These boilers are similar but Mark has made some necessary changes for the better as I have found through my trial and error. Mark has gone above and beyond for me and other Adobe owners. I have nothing but positive things to say about Mark and the way he treats people.
    I know this thread started out as a good buy/quality thing but I just had to let eveyone know the type of person I have dealt with------the exact opposite of Phillip Dougherty. Try getting in touch with Phil at www.enterpriseboiler.com I'm sure you'll be impressed.
  9. akal60

    akal60 Member

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    Loc:
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    Greenfire is no longer on the web. the url has gone dark. I hope this is just a server problem and not bad news for us greenfire owners.
  10. Titus

    Titus New Member

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    Site is dark because of deal with Green Horizons. SJV Trailers has them doing all sales/marketing. Marks a builder, not a salesman. Too many inquiries coming in to SJV that he had to refer to GH.

    (IMHO this was a mistake. I think they'd better off owning the whole process. Just advertising and posting here could help develop enough business to keep them hopping. Middleman & middleman markup are likely to depress sales.)

    I'm from Fort Kent originally, so I know Mark and the outfit. I'll make a call this weekend and make sure everything's still OK.

    http://www.greenhorizonboilers.com/

    (I have no financial entanglements with either outfit.)
  11. applewood

    applewood New Member

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    Loc:
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    Just to add to things for the Canadian guys... I was considering bringing my unit across into Ontario from NY but was told there was also a 7% duty, which erased most of the price difference and so I bought mine local to have the local dealer support.
  12. webbie

    webbie Seasoned Moderator Staff Member

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    I'm still leery about anyone buying stuff like this - but a man and his money are (often) easily parted......

    Sites that come and go, companies that are in business a short time, bad past experiences.......a home heating system is a 20+ year investment.

    I guess I have said my piece.......but I wish people would just send me all their spare money.....I will use it better than some of these creeps (Adobe, etc.)
  13. akal60

    akal60 Member

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    sounds like some people are negative on Greenfire, all the posts that I have read here led me to believe that they were a good design that was very economical on wood. Seton has a good reputation in Alaska there are many up in Fairbanks that use his stoves and boilers.I don't think Mark is a poor dealer or bad builder. he always was ready to help any way he could. calling people foolish is not too nice either.I came here looking for first hand knowledge on boilers, most have been very helpful, but name calling isn't good for any forum.
  14. PEI1

    PEI1 New Member

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    It is nice to see so many are/were interested in the Greenfire design as I am.....i think at the end of the day that, it is not a question on how the design is manufactured or even a question on how good the service is going to be as I think Mark at SJV trailers is making a product that can compete and I believe he is a man of honor....but I do think that the problem facing many is trying to get into some form of gasification boiler that will not financially ruin them.........do I think that the Greenfire is the best gasifier out there.......debatable......are there other products that have been around forever.......definitely.......but for me it is trying to balance the ability to get a gasifier for a cost that I will be able to sleep with.........the $8000+ that GreenHorizon Boilers is asking for the entry level stove, to me, is not reasonable, especially when I know that Mark is selling them for much less.......he has to be making money as i doubt that he is giving them away, so my issue is with GreenHorizons for essentially gouging the customers.......not fair!!......but I guess that is the way the old business wheel works.....as I said in a previous post on this thread......THAT SUCKS!!

    PEI1
  15. 2.beans

    2.beans Minister of Fire

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    being a seton owner and looking for a boiler for a friend of mine i called fred seton and asked him about the greenfire when they were still around. the greenfire price was so cheap i didnt think it would be worth it to buy freds build it yourself plans. so going on freds word assuming hes an honest man he told me that the greenfires are cheaper because they use cheaper refractory cement and also all the interior insulations are of lesser quality. also they are a direct copy of a seton and didnt pay any royalties to fred seton. in my eyes it looks like stealing. i had also talked to the trailer building guy (adobe building guy) and he didnt seem to know an awful lot about operating the boiler. he told me the biggest complaint out of the hundreds he sold was they make to much heat so you need really green wood. he didnt know how to make them run cooler. me owning a seton did, i figured id let him figure it out himself (draft). so with that said i was surprised to see that he was making different size units with btu ratings that fred seton doesnt offer. we bought freds plans.
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