P.S. - Just ordered my liner from FiresideChimneySupply, price was good, free shipping and I saw a 10% off coupon on the web....we'll see.
Harman 52i Install; Let me Get This Right
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NHcpa
Minister of Fire
Perhaps not clear from prior posts, the chimney will have a 4" exhaust tube from the stove to the crown (top/exit of the chimney). The exhaust tube is non insulated and the chimney (with clay tile) is closed/sealed at the crown and damper. The Harman manual states that an OAK tube can be run up the chimney to within 4' of the crown. This confuses me because if I am sealed at both ends, there is no fresh air... so the answer is or assumption, there is fresh air to draw - presumably from the crown cap. Again, presumably, the thought process to seal both ends is to "heat" the chimney pathway for the exhaust tube to better draw. I would think if the exhaust tube was insulted, then perhaps you could have the top crown plate vented as I have seen on various threads to give air to the OAK intake. Regardless, my stove installer is sealing both ends, using a non insulated exhaust tube, and I will not have outside air.
If you don't have some sort of vent up top, there's no way to terminate the intake inside the chimney. I guess you could run up and out the side of the chimney, however many inches code says to be above the snow fall....this will keep your chimney space warm, and the oak still short. My only issue with that would be the effect of the prevailing winds on that side of the chimney. Its either going to be + or -, to what effect this would have I don't know.
If I didn't do mine up into chimney space with intake, I would of had to run 40' all said and done down through cleanout, over, and to the back of the house. I can't imagine how big my line would have been by the end to still be efficient?
While I was on the roof I didn't remember to take pictures of the vent part. I have 1/2 screen bent over the flu (it's been there to keep animals out was there before I moved in). I cut a hole big enough for the liner to fit through and laid two pieces of steel channel on either side of the liner, flat side down (in the shape of a "U"). I used a small amount of liquid nail to adhere the channel to the screen/flu. My fly measures 13"x13" outside. My cap measures 14.5"x14.5" inside. This gives me 1.5" intake all the way around the base of the cap. My channel is only 1.25" off the flu, so this allowed there to be a nice size gap for intake air all around the cap, just like in the Harman manual. Hope all that makes sense; I'm only posting all this stuff trying to help others as I have been helped on this site.
dradam1
Member
MANY THANKS TO lbcynya, without his thread here;
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/how-your-harman-works-what-your-manual-doesnt-tell-you.91030/
without it, it would have taken me a lot longer to figure out how this thing works. I had the unit up and running in 5 minutes, and set in 10 (I might of played for a couple days, lol)
In conclusion.......
The Harman instructions are really bad. I pride myself on being able to mechanically take stuff apart/put stuff together. Because I've never done a pellet stove insert/liner/cap, etc I wanted to make sure I did it right. I don't think I've ever come across a set of instructions so azz backwards. The connectors supplied on the unit did NOT plug right into the room air sensor. I had to cut, and splice these with the appropriate ones. And there were two side rails that allow the hopper to slide into the cage; both of which were put on backwards, and neither ever mentioned in the manual. The only thing I can figure; guy at the Harman factory's first day?....no big deal, we've all had those.
I'm not sure if I would go with the Mojolica Brown option if I had to do it again. It's gorgeous, but I didn't realize how easy it would chip. I chipped one small spot when removing the door to move the unit inside. It was like +7 degrees that day and super windy, so I'm hoping that chip happened because it was relatively fresh paint, and because it was so cold outside. Since then, no chips, but only time will tell. I have four boys, so I'm paranoid all the time that they'll throw, kick, bite, smack....a chip off at any minute. Harman included a little container of matching paint which did fill in the gap really well, can't even see it, but I don't want to be painting it every other week either...
I'm not really satisfied with the intake on top of the cage (actual intake goes 4' into flu and terminates). I used what was left of my liner to tie onto the intake, but needed a 3"-4" reducer to move up to the liner size of 4". I think when I pull it after the season I'll change that a bit. Get something that's a better fit.
I did find a slightly used APC #BE750G for $30, so in case the power goes out it can power down without getting smoke in the house. (although I wonder if the natural draft would have taken care of that??, oh well, better safe than sorry...)
I just did my first clean yesterday. I will say the holes in the burn pot were a little pain to get to, but for my first clean I expected some obstacles to overcome. I can only get more efficient cleaning with time.
Final Thoughts;
I love it. Warms the house using half the amount of pellets as my 15 year old Earth Stove. And when I say it burns every last part of every single pellet I mean it. I've burned quite a bit so far (almost non stop for the past week; feed rate 4.25, room temp set to 76 or so), and still have yet to empty the ash pan. (Just for reference - Energex pellets from http://kingdombiofuel.com/)
The fire itself is stunning. We've (family) spent a couple nights just sitting in front of the fire. It really brings life to the living room. My house was built in 1964, and I'm updating the inefficiencies all the time, but the boys room was always slightly chilly before....not at all now. The house itself is 1500sq' with an unfinished basement. This thing warms the whole house, and it seems with little to no effort at all. As you can see in the pictures, it sits directly next to the TV with no trouble. I'll admit that I have a fairly nice surround sound, and I do turn the blower down to the fans if were watching the TV, but completely bearable. All in all, only time will tell if this was a good purchase. Anything new always has it's appeal, so I don't know where I'll stand a year from now. I could have spent the money on a new boiler or something, but as of now, pellets are cheaper than oil/gas, and that's even with the price that I can get oil/gas at, so that's says a lot.
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/how-your-harman-works-what-your-manual-doesnt-tell-you.91030/
without it, it would have taken me a lot longer to figure out how this thing works. I had the unit up and running in 5 minutes, and set in 10 (I might of played for a couple days, lol)
In conclusion.......
The Harman instructions are really bad. I pride myself on being able to mechanically take stuff apart/put stuff together. Because I've never done a pellet stove insert/liner/cap, etc I wanted to make sure I did it right. I don't think I've ever come across a set of instructions so azz backwards. The connectors supplied on the unit did NOT plug right into the room air sensor. I had to cut, and splice these with the appropriate ones. And there were two side rails that allow the hopper to slide into the cage; both of which were put on backwards, and neither ever mentioned in the manual. The only thing I can figure; guy at the Harman factory's first day?....no big deal, we've all had those.
I'm not sure if I would go with the Mojolica Brown option if I had to do it again. It's gorgeous, but I didn't realize how easy it would chip. I chipped one small spot when removing the door to move the unit inside. It was like +7 degrees that day and super windy, so I'm hoping that chip happened because it was relatively fresh paint, and because it was so cold outside. Since then, no chips, but only time will tell. I have four boys, so I'm paranoid all the time that they'll throw, kick, bite, smack....a chip off at any minute. Harman included a little container of matching paint which did fill in the gap really well, can't even see it, but I don't want to be painting it every other week either...
I'm not really satisfied with the intake on top of the cage (actual intake goes 4' into flu and terminates). I used what was left of my liner to tie onto the intake, but needed a 3"-4" reducer to move up to the liner size of 4". I think when I pull it after the season I'll change that a bit. Get something that's a better fit.
I did find a slightly used APC #BE750G for $30, so in case the power goes out it can power down without getting smoke in the house. (although I wonder if the natural draft would have taken care of that??, oh well, better safe than sorry...)
I just did my first clean yesterday. I will say the holes in the burn pot were a little pain to get to, but for my first clean I expected some obstacles to overcome. I can only get more efficient cleaning with time.
Final Thoughts;
I love it. Warms the house using half the amount of pellets as my 15 year old Earth Stove. And when I say it burns every last part of every single pellet I mean it. I've burned quite a bit so far (almost non stop for the past week; feed rate 4.25, room temp set to 76 or so), and still have yet to empty the ash pan. (Just for reference - Energex pellets from http://kingdombiofuel.com/)
The fire itself is stunning. We've (family) spent a couple nights just sitting in front of the fire. It really brings life to the living room. My house was built in 1964, and I'm updating the inefficiencies all the time, but the boys room was always slightly chilly before....not at all now. The house itself is 1500sq' with an unfinished basement. This thing warms the whole house, and it seems with little to no effort at all. As you can see in the pictures, it sits directly next to the TV with no trouble. I'll admit that I have a fairly nice surround sound, and I do turn the blower down to the fans if were watching the TV, but completely bearable. All in all, only time will tell if this was a good purchase. Anything new always has it's appeal, so I don't know where I'll stand a year from now. I could have spent the money on a new boiler or something, but as of now, pellets are cheaper than oil/gas, and that's even with the price that I can get oil/gas at, so that's says a lot.
This is what I am going to use to terminate both the exhaust and fresh
air intake. On the bottom of the chimney cap there is a 3" and 4"
stub to connect each pipe.
The stove looks great. I finally ordered
mine last week so I'll be picking your
brain for some install pointers. What type if liner did you end up using?
deercamp - I looked at that setup. A little too expensive for me. I got mine from FiresideChimneySupply. For 20' of smooth wall liner, cap, and connector it was like $380 shipped. I didn't see the point running the intake all the way to the top.
I'm no pro, so just a heads up, take my advice with a grain of salt.
I'm no pro, so just a heads up, take my advice with a grain of salt.
Nice install... Makes me wish I held out for the P52i.
Front hearth protection looks a little anemic though, I think you need at least 6" from the glass to the edge of the hearth pad (maybe it's ok, just judging from the scale of the pictures) . Would suck to burn holes on the carpet if embers find their way out while you're scraping the pot or popping out the ash pan...
Front hearth protection looks a little anemic though, I think you need at least 6" from the glass to the edge of the hearth pad (maybe it's ok, just judging from the scale of the pictures) . Would suck to burn holes on the carpet if embers find their way out while you're scraping the pot or popping out the ash pan...
Your no pro look at my first picture that I posted. I am surprised that it didn't have my phone number on it. Yes that chimney cap is not that cheap it's in the $200 plus range.
I was told from Harman that if I only ran the fresh air pipe up past the block off plate and not all the way to the top that people have been having a noise problem with a loud rumbling noise from
the stove sucking in the fresh air down the lenght of the chimney. Have you noticed any such noise and how far did you run your fresh air liner up past the block off plate?
With all the money that I saved from not getting the Majolica brown I can now afford that chimney cap LOL.
I was told from Harman that if I only ran the fresh air pipe up past the block off plate and not all the way to the top that people have been having a noise problem with a loud rumbling noise from
the stove sucking in the fresh air down the lenght of the chimney. Have you noticed any such noise and how far did you run your fresh air liner up past the block off plate?
With all the money that I saved from not getting the Majolica brown I can now afford that chimney cap LOL.
Funny you mention rumbling. I myself hear a very minor rumbling, almost like a train or small earthquake very far away. My intake goes about 4' into space above block off plate. It is extremely subtle. No one in the family has mentioned it. I just figured it was the funky adapter I used for 3"-4". I want to climb up on the roof while its running to investigate. The rumbling is not constant, and to be honest, I haven't heard it since Monday or Tuesday. Part of me figured it was just breaking in.
CBM - Thanks for the compliment.
Your right. I went back and forth about this for a while. Its not something that I like, but its 6" from glass believe it or not. Whenever I open the door, I crack it and wait for combustion blower to stop (takes about .5 seconds). The carpet is pretty old, and there's hardwood floors under that, but I really don't want to have the kids destroy hardwood. If I have any issues, I'll add a bigger hearth.
Your right. I went back and forth about this for a while. Its not something that I like, but its 6" from glass believe it or not. Whenever I open the door, I crack it and wait for combustion blower to stop (takes about .5 seconds). The carpet is pretty old, and there's hardwood floors under that, but I really don't want to have the kids destroy hardwood. If I have any issues, I'll add a bigger hearth.
Ctcarl
Feeling the Heat
Thanks guys. I figured if I was going to spend all that money, might as well shoot for the moon. I'm not by any means wealthy, and still sort of nervous about the long term investment, but for today, I feel good about it.
So... loving the stove, however, I get this subtle rumbling noise (distant train?) when it's rolling full blast. A friend of mine works at the local dealer, he said they are replacing a piece on the back of the units before they are even installed to fix this. Does anyone know what that might be?
NHcpa
Minister of Fire
I too have commented of a low rumble since my 52I install last March. I think It is the exhaust blower as I can still hear it when the blower fan shuts off. Your insert looks great also!
Thanks for the compliment. My friend said it had something to do with the air intake, so if by exhaust blower/combustion blower than yes. I'm not sure, I text him earlier about details or part number, but haven't heard back...
OK guys, stoves been running for 2 seasons now. Works great! So far I've had to replace the combustion blower (under warranty) bad bearings, but other than that lots of heat.
I've tried searching but I have a rumble, flutter, vibration noise when running (intermittent, like 35-40% of the time). The best thing I can relate it to would be a car with only 1 window down driving down the highway. That flutter in your ears. It is intermittent, but when it happens the flame moves to the sound....looks like a flutter.
Anyone have any insight?
I've tried searching but I have a rumble, flutter, vibration noise when running (intermittent, like 35-40% of the time). The best thing I can relate it to would be a car with only 1 window down driving down the highway. That flutter in your ears. It is intermittent, but when it happens the flame moves to the sound....looks like a flutter.
Anyone have any insight?
Peterfield
Minister of Fire
That's the famous Harman freight train. Don't know why it happens but several posts from users who experience it. I also had to replace the combustion blower under warranty.
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