Heat Transfer Fan - Advice, Ideas and questions

[atom631]

I have PE Summit Insert in a 1500 sq' Ranch. My only issue is getting the heat down to my master bedroom/bath. Ive tried many different things and while some of them have worked (such as putting a fan on the floor in the hallway facing towards the Summit) its been marginal improvements at best. The temp difference from the great room where the summit is to my master bed/bath is almost a 15 degree swing. Its actually shocking and makes the room feel colder than it even is.

If you look at the floor plan below, you will see that in my great room, the wall opposite the Summit actually shares a wall with my Master Bathroom. My master bathroom is not cathedral though. I was thinking that a heat transfer fan could actually solve my problem. So in the kitchen area, the fan or vent would need to be on the wall above the cabinets and then in the bathroom it would need to be on the ceiling.

So here are my questions:

1.) Based on how heat rises, etc...would this even work having to push/pull the heat down into the bathroom? My thoughts are that I would actually install the opening in the kitchen area just above the cabinets and then straight down into the bathroom to minimize the distance the air would travel in the unfinished attic area. Or should I install the the fan/vent in the kitchen area as high as possible where the hottest air will be?

2.) If this would work, am I better off having the fan on the kitchen side, pushing the air into the bathroom? OR, have the fan in the bathroom pulling the air from the kitchen?

3.) Can you recommend a good fan that would work in this application? My thoughts are that it would need to connect to a 6" or 8" round, insulated flex duct and then I would just use a standard wall or ceiling vent for the other side. I would then probably wrap the flex duct with additional insulation (or even box it out in the attic) to ensure the air stays as warm as possible. Also, I would want the fan hard-wired and I will install a switch for on/off and speed control. Some sort of thermostatic option might be cool too where I can set a desired temp and the fan kicks on automatically. I would imagine though the fan would then need to be installed on the kitchen side if that were to work. So not sure if that would be do-able, if Im better off pulling the air .

4.) any other recommendations or ideas for solving this issue?

Thanks for the help

 

[blades]

Ceiling fan in cathedral area, it is much simpler to move cold air than hot. Split ranch like you have is difficult to get the stove heat to the bedrooms.If you could pull the cold air down a duct and then back up in the great room that would help but the reality is that those bedrooms are going to be 10 deg. cooler or so. Note Stoves are area heaters - to provide even heat through would require a furnace. I have a split ranch also best I can do is a fan on floor by hall entrance blowing towards stove. Not worth the time and effort to do anything else. If it gets too cold another blanket is my answer.

 

[atom631]

I do have the ceiling fans going if the stove is running. That definitely helps.

Are you saying that this idea is just not going to work at all? My great room is around 75 degrees. I would imagine another 5' up from that where the fan would be has to at least be another 2-3 degrees hotter even with the ceiling fans running. Even if it only raised the temp in my master bathroom a few degrees, it would be worth it to me.

 

[rwhite]

How do the other 2 bedrooms do for heat? I think the only way to solve it is to maybe to install a ceiling duct in the far right corner of the bedroom with an inline fan that dumps out over the stove area. That or at the end of the hall way may work. Basically a dedicated inline duct system that draw the colder air and dumps it near the stove so you can create a vacuum in bedrooms or hallway. Do you have any other source of heat? If you have a furnace you may try (for testing sake) to close off all the positive ducts in the bedrooms and just run the circulation fan to see if it creates the vacuum your trying to get.

 

[begreen]

Something might help. Even with the ceiling fans the air temp up high near the peak is likely 5-10 degrees hotter.

What's above and below the master bedroom? Attic and basement or crawlspace? Also, how are the ceiling fans running - down, or up (reversed) or one up and one down?

 

[atom631]

I snapped some pics to give you a better idea of what im working with.

this pic is with my back to the wall where i want to put the fan. I am looking towards my Summit


opposite direct, this is my back towards the summit and facing the wall where i want to put the fan. i was thinking right above the kitchen cabinets dead center above the sink. i thought that a little lower would reduce the amount of duct i would need to have in the attic space.


this pic is inside the master bath. this is where i would put the other side of the fan/duct. above this ceiling is attic space (at one point i believe the bathroom was cathedral as well. when i went up in attic, this little area is all sheetrocked and finished.)


this is the hallway and kitchen. above those cabinets is where the fan will go. last door on the right is my master bedroom. on the left (where you cant see) are the two other bedrooms, the heat seems to make its way down there no problem. its really just the master bed and bath. when you make the right into the bedroom, there is a wall straight ahead and you have to make a quick left and then you are actually in the bedroom. i think this is the problem. ive tried putting a fan on the floor facing the hallway... hasnt helped.

 

[atom631]

here is the entry way into the master bedroom, so you get an idea of what i meant with the wall right there


inside the master bedroom, looking at the master bathroom


on the opposite side of the far wall inside the master bath is the kitchen. that is the shared wall. vent or fan would be in the ceiling right at the end of the wall (just past the hi-hat).


PS - Dont judge the colors!! we didnt pick them! They are terrible, but we havent gotten around to repainting yet

 

[HSBull]

Same situation here.....a floor heater and ceiling fan in the master keeps the bedroom within 5 degrees.......just make sure the fan is in the wi terms mode

 

[begreen]

Is this all on a slab or is there a crawlspace or basement below?

 

[atom631]

Is this all on a slab or is there a crawlspace or basement below?

Basement below

 

[atom631]

Same situation here.....a floor heater and ceiling fan in the master keeps the bedroom within 5 degrees.......just make sure the fan is in the wi terms mode

What do you mean by a floor heater?

I do have a ceiling fan in the master bedroom but never turned it on. I figured if it's cold in there, then there isn't any hot air to move around.

The ceiling fans in the great room are both always on and in a clockwise (winter) spin.

 

[HSBull]

I stand corrected. ....floor fan....but I tested the air flow with the ceiling fan on, and it was significant. ..the combination works well for me

 

[begreen]

Basement below

For more even heating consider then running an insulated duct through the basement with the return in the MBR and the output in the stove room. This will set up negative pressure in the bedroom which will pull warm air through the house. 6" insulated duct with a quiet inline, remote bathroom fan will do the job. I like Panasonic fans for this purpose.
http://www.amazon.com/Panasonic-FV-20NLF1-WhisperLine-In-Line-6-Inch/dp/B000EDUIX2

 

[atom631]

so you're saying one vent would be on the floor of my bedroom. i would run the duct in the basement to where the stove is and put another vent on the floor there. somewhere in the middle that in-line fan is installed and it pulls the cold air from the bedroom and dumps it into the floor of my living room near the stove. this will force the air to be pulled into the bedroom due to negative pressure?

that would be a bit of work for me and would require me to saw out a nice portion of my wood flooring. also, the basement under my master bedroom is finished, so that might be a challenge.

i was thinking something like this above the cabinets and poping right down into the bathroom ceiling. except that one doesnt use a 6"/8" round duct. so it would probably need a tin duct - something like they use for in-wall CAC installations. that seems like more of a PIA, but i do like that it looks like a regular CAC vent and not a fan. SO something along these lines woudl be a waste of my time and will not move the hot air into the bathroom?

 

[begreen]

Yes, that's correct if the goal is to move the heat to the bedroom and not just the bath. The register does not need to be large, an 8 x 10 would do fine. Put it along a wall or behind an end table. Adding a Y to also take air from Bedroom 2 would further improve circulation. This would require adequate clearance under the door to pass air, or a vent in the doors, or that the doors be left ajar.