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Honey bear insert questions

Post in 'Fisher Stove Information, Parts, History and More' started by willybadass, Nov 24, 2011.

  1. willybadass New Member

    joined: Nov 22, 2011
    7 posts
    Hello, what a great helpful and informative site!
    I have a honey bear insert from reading my guess is that it was made in at early 80 ?
    Is there a paint that matches the original color or do I have to change the color ?
    I am looking for a adapter plate to convert from the rectangle 5 2/8" x 10 3/8" to 6" round, is 6" this the correct size for this stove? my chimney is 11" x 11"
    Is this stove worthy of using or should I look for a newer model ?
    Thanks Bill

    Attached Files:

    willybadass, Nov 24, 2011
    #1

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  2. coaly Fisher Moderator

    joined: Dec 22, 2007
    1,028 posts
    NE PA
    Welcome to the Forum, Yes, early 80's.
    They were available in Stove Bright Metallic Brown or Satin Black.

    Your active handle on the right needs some adjusting against the wedge to tighten down even with the left handle as pictured below.

    Your rectangular vent is equivalent to an 8 inch round flue. Area of your vent is Approx. 50 square inches. L X W. (8 inch round is 50.24 sq. inches. pi X r2) That's what it should be all the way up. Your 11 X 11 is 121 square inches, However rising flue gas doesn't use the corners much, it spirals using the center. So figure you have about 95 square inches of usable space in your flue. This is still twice the size of what it should be. It would take a lot of wasted heat to keep your chimney hot. It needs a liner. (and special made adapter) Before you think about an 8 inch liner, most all more efficient newer stoves require 6 inch. So you're putting a lot out for an 8 inch liner that you'll probably wish you had a 6 for a newer stove if and when you go that route.....
    Have I tried a Honey Bear Insert reduced down to a 6" flue? No, but I'd like to ! By code, you can't reduce it, but many Grandma and Grandpa 8 inch stoves are working well with 6 inch. They were designed with 8 inch due to burning with doors open, and screen in place. It may foul the glass in yours, but probably make it a better heater. Square inch firebox area of a Papa is larger than yours, and have a 6 inch. However they are single door, not designed to run open as a fireplace. Big box, little vent is how the first Papa model gets so much heat out of them. Choking it down is also why they never passed an EPA test.
    Yours was made to go into a fireplace with an 8 inch flue.

    I would personally get a 6 inch liner. You're going to need it anyway, and try it. You might like it.

    It only takes a couple brass hinge pins to make my day. Thanks !

    Attached Files:

    coaly, Nov 25, 2011
    #2

  3. willybadass New Member

    joined: Nov 22, 2011
    7 posts
    Thanks for the info!
    I found the paint at Mclendons hardware. Now for the exhaust pipe. I will go with the 6". Especially if I upgrade to another stove in the future.
    Now I will look for a chimney liner, there seems to be many out there, my chimney is rather short 7' from the top of the firplace to the top of the chimney, will I need to extend the chimney to get a few more feet or can I buy some bulk chimney liner to fit my needs?
    Thanks agian, Bill
    willybadass, Nov 26, 2011
    #3

  4. coaly Fisher Moderator

    joined: Dec 22, 2007
    1,028 posts
    NE PA
    As long as you're 3 feet above roof line, and 2 feet above anything within 10 feet horizontally as shown below.
    If the chimney isn't that high, you should extend it, and not simply extend the liner out of the chimney where air will cool it quickly and condense at the top making a mess of creosote where the pipe is chilled.
    When you paint the doors, paint right over the polished brass, and when dry, wipe the paint off the polished areas with mineral spirits. It comes right off before firing. Polish with metal polish for brass, then fire to cure paint. They will look as good as new.
    BTW, use a small poker or bent rod that fits through the hole in the air adjuster slider when hot to adjust it. The original tool is shown below on the ash fender of the brown Honey Bear Pedestal.

    Attached Files:

    coaly, Nov 26, 2011
    #4

  5. CamFan Member

    joined: Aug 21, 2011
    138 posts
    North East Georgia
    Where are you from? the ashpan on the stove looks like ones we used to stamp out. I do not know if it was to Fisher specs or not. I never liked it. Notches were cut in the front corners and it was formed in a die made to stamp them. then the corners were welded up and ground back down. I never thought they looked right when they were finished.
    CamFan, Nov 27, 2011
    #5

  6. willybadass New Member

    joined: Nov 22, 2011
    7 posts
    Seattle, Wa. Yes there are notches in the front corners. Fisher nockoff ? How important is the ashpan?
    willybadass, Nov 27, 2011
    #6

  7. CamFan Member

    joined: Aug 21, 2011
    138 posts
    North East Georgia
    It must have been the way Fisher spec's showed. so I would not worry about a knock off. It is not going to be a good day weather wise so I may go look through some drawings today to see what is there. I know someone who is waiting for that. :)
    CamFan, Nov 27, 2011
    #7

  8. willybadass New Member

    joined: Nov 22, 2011
    7 posts
    I have a question about the dampner. Do you keep it installed? if so how does the adapter and then chimney liner fit and seal after it is installed?
    I see that the free standing stoves have the dampner linkage internal, but the inserts have the linkage on the outside.
    Also you mentioned that my active handle is not adjusted to match the left. How do you go about adjusting the handle? Bend the locking arm?
    Thanks again, Bill
    willybadass, Nov 28, 2011
    #8

  9. CamFan Member

    joined: Aug 21, 2011
    138 posts
    North East Georgia


    I do not know about the adapter that Coaly is talking about so I will not go there.

    Now with the handle adjustment. Before bending the lock be sure the gasket is in place. If not install it and that may be all that is needed. If you have to adjust the lock it is prefered to heat the elbow and slide a pipe over the lock inside and bend it A LITTLE and then check it. Keep on until you have it right. Like I said only bend it a small amount at a time. Good luck I tried to post a picture but I have to do something different here I am not used to at other forums so I hope this works for you.
    CamFan, Nov 28, 2011
    #9

  10. coaly Fisher Moderator

    joined: Dec 22, 2007
    1,028 posts
    NE PA
    The stoves have no damper in them or linkage. They use a manual damper in the pipe. Only Inserts have built in dampers.

    Here's an Insert connector. Some suppliers call them Adapters, or Boots. They are also available in cast iron to bolt to the top. But they are more difficult with your linkage rod. If you want to use the cast heavy one, steel strips the thickness of your damper rod can be installed flat on the Insert top to raise the boot, allowing the rod to come out under the boot. Otherwise simply notch the sheet metal type for the rod. Try to keep it as tight as possible on the rod, but a 100% seal to the rod isn't necessary. The same as the fit of a manual damper rod in a pipe.
    I found these pictured at chimneydepot.com, and use them since they are close to me in PA.

    Once connected you can open the damper, and clean from the top, removing debris from the stove when done. Prior to liners, the Insert would need to be removed to clean behind it. You will hear installers refer to that as a "slammer installation" meaning the insert was pushed back into the hearth and allowed to draft up the chimney as designed. Quick and easy. The minimum install should be a 4 foot flexable adapter connected to the Insert. This creates a cleaning problem since you have one size flue, reduced down to the pipe above the Insert to clean with two sizes brushes without damaging the pipe from the top.
    Here's an informative site with install pictured; http://www.chimneycleaners.com/FAQs/12

    Attached Files:

    coaly, Nov 28, 2011
    #10

  11. willybadass New Member

    joined: Nov 22, 2011
    7 posts
    I have been reading the forum and I do not see the awnsers to my questions, so here it goes.
    How do I mount the adapter plate to the top of the stove? (I just ordered a stainless model)Should I install studs so I can remove the bracket easier when needed or just a drill screw install?

    Second question is what type liner should I use? my chimney is fairly straight after you get through the dampner. I see 6" stainless pipe at the hardware store, this seems to be thick and strong, or should I just install a flex chimney liner? my chimney is only 7' tall above the fireplace (should the pipe whatever type I use be insulated?)
    These are my last questions before I install my stove! The chimney sweep comes out this weekend and hopefully I can fire up the stove!
    Thanks, Bill
    willybadass, Dec 1, 2011
    #11

  12. CamFan Member

    joined: Aug 21, 2011
    138 posts
    North East Georgia
    Let me start with I am not a NFI certified wood stove installer. Second everything revolves around local building codes and insurance requirements. Third installed per the manufactors instructions generally takes care of the building codes.

    I would assume if you use the studs to mount the bracket you are planning on shimming it as Coaly sugggested to allow for the damper rod. He also mentioned about getting it mounted as tight as possible like a inline pipe damper. I would install it in this fashion. Bolting it only to the outer shield not to the top of the firebox. If you marked the stove and drilled the holes installed a bolt and a nut it may shim it enough to allow for the damper rod. (optional way to install is weld the bolt to the top) You then could seal it with stove gasket glued to the top so when you bolted the adapter down it would compress the gasket. Probably a round larger gasket will will be the best choice.

    Second the stainless flex would be the way to go. A positive connection which means no joints from the stove to out side of the chimney is required. it should come with all the hardware required to mount it, cap, pipe support, a termination plate for the top of the chimney. You biggest issue will be getting a reline kit short enough not to have as much waste. When it comes to your safety or the need to install to prevent a house fire. Your need to go to a reputable Wood stove shop and not a hardware stove that sells them a couple months a year. I also think Coaly addressed chimney requirements earlier. But what it boils down to is each situation is different that is why you should go to a "Wood Stove Shop" to help guide you to a correct install for you.

    Good luck it will be worth the expense and trouble.
    CamFan, Dec 1, 2011
    #12

  13. mellow Minister of Fire

    joined: Jan 19, 2008
    1,755 posts
    Salisbury, MD
    I had the cast iron version, I drilled and tapped for the screws to hold the adapter down, I had to fab up a piece of sheet metal to put down on the stove first so I could hang the boot off the back a bit so it was centered over the exhaust, I used Mill Pac to seal everything up. I attached it to a 6" flex liner.
    mellow, Dec 1, 2011
    #13

  14. coaly Fisher Moderator

    joined: Dec 22, 2007
    1,028 posts
    NE PA
    I'm not a certified installer either, but I am a certified Fisher nut. I would screw or bolt it on, whatever is easiest for you to thread the collar with, or reach in and put the bolts through from the inside with nuts outside. I'm thinking about four 1/4 - 20 X 1 inch bolts with nuts and washers on the outside..... It will probably never need to be removed since when you remove the liner from the top of it, you can reach right in. A chimney brush should go right down to the top of the Insert, so once the Insert is in place, that's it.

    We wouldn't know the details on your chimney, if you can get a straight pipe down it or would need a flex liner. Probably flex since most have a smoke shelf or bends to get around. If you can attach a screen or sheet metal block off plate at the bottom and run the liner through it, I would pour loose insulation around the liner from the top until filled. (a few pre-mix vermiculite types available, perlite is much cheaper and doesn't absorb moisture) http://www.perlite.net/
    It is a type of rock, sometimes used crushed, but expands when heated. The type you get is already expanded like pop corn. It doesn't change. Just make sure you have a good fit to the liner and it can't leak out of your bottom plate. The higher you can mount the block off plate the better to allow a longer flexible piece of liner to connect to the boot and shove the insert the rest of the way in.
    coaly, Dec 1, 2011
    #14

  15. mdocod New Member

    joined: Nov 11, 2011
    49 posts
    Black Forest, CO
    We fabricated/welded our "adapter" to 6" on to our honey bear.
    mdocod, Dec 1, 2011
    #15

  16. willybadass New Member

    joined: Nov 22, 2011
    7 posts
    Ok, that sounds easy enough place adapter in correct spot drill through stove bolt on adapter with nuts on the outside!
    Now for the liner.. I have been reading this forum and I am still not clear on what brand is the best.
    Maybe someone can tell me if this liner that is being advertised on CL is any good?
    http://www.stoves-pipes.com/Magnaflex-Inch-Stainless-Steel-Chimney-L-p/06stmcs015.htm
    If this is decent I will go buy it.
    Thanks, Bill
    willybadass, Dec 2, 2011
    #16

  17. CamFan Member

    joined: Aug 21, 2011
    138 posts
    North East Georgia
    Bill,
    I am fairly new here too and the purpose to me is to help with how to do something questions or about old wood stoves and mainly Fishers. My wife and I have a wood stove shop and I could have tried to sell you a flex kit but I am not here to sell. So I thought the question was how to do it and suggestions were made. It looks like the the kit you have listed is fine. It has the parts I talked about. Adapter, rain cap, termingation plate and pipe. The price looks good. Look for reviews on the company about shipping issues and all the bases should be covered. Good luck with the install. I would save the remaining pipe in case you have to extend the chimney in the future. You will know right away how the draft is. If we had problems with a company I would have shared that information.
    CamFan, Dec 2, 2011
    #17

  18. willybadass New Member

    joined: Nov 22, 2011
    7 posts
    Update: I purchased the rectangle to round adapter and a 6" SS chimney liner. I started buning wood! Yaaa!
    I feel good about the install, I will post pictures after I take a few!
    So far I can burn with the doors open, no smoke problems.
    I need to look at the owners manual as far as using the dampner and air intake adjustments. Does anyone know where I can get a manual for my stove?
    A honey bear insert? I see a few listed for the other Fisher models.
    My next goal is to install a blower, I see I will have to make one so I will look for a quiet fan that fits my needs.
    Thanks again for all the good advise, it sure made the install go smooth!
    Bill
    willybadass, Dec 9, 2011
    #18

  19. coaly Fisher Moderator

    joined: Dec 22, 2007
    1,028 posts
    NE PA
    That's one of the few manuals I don't have. I'm sure sooner or later, someone with a Honey Bear Insert will have one and be willing to scan it into a pdf file for us.
    Thanks to Tim in Canada, last week I was able to obtain a Canadian Teddy Bear Owners Manual.

    FISHER STOVES. AN IDEA CANADA IS WARMING UP TO
    coaly, Dec 9, 2011
    #19

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