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How many cord in a HH?

Post in 'The Wood Shed' started by LLigetfa, Dec 25, 2008.

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  1. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa Minister of Fire

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    Ja, I know... it's like asking how long is a piece of string.

    I'm thinking of building a few Holtz Hauzens with the centers just loose tossed. Everyone knows that on a straight (rectangular) stack, 128 cu ft is a cord but in a circle, it would have to be based on the inside circumference. Add to that, that the circle generally gets smaller as you go up and then further complicate it by loose tossing the center with a crown on top and it's anyone's guess.

    In searching around, a loose tossed cord is said to be somewhere between 180 and 220 cu ft. It seems nobody can agree on a number, probably because the size and lengths of the splits are a factor as is the size of the container they are tossed into. 200 is probably a good number to go on.

    A 10 foot circle is obviously 120 inches, so based on 20 inch wood, the inside dimension is 100 inches which would have an inside circumference of 26.2 feet, so a foot tall perimeter would be around 43.7 cu ft. The loose tossed area inside would be 54.5 cu ft per foot of height.

    Based on the above, a 9 foot tall perimeter stack with plumb vertical sides would be around 3 cord. The loose stacked area inside would be 490.5 cu ft or somewhere around 2.5 cord. Now a HH almost always diminishes like a beehive, so how much to discount?

    Resorting to SWAG, I think maybe 4 cord in a 10 foot HH.

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  2. Chief Ryan

    Chief Ryan New Member

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  3. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa Minister of Fire

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    I read that article and think it overly optimistic. Even if you pack the center vertically as tight as you can, you won't have gravity on your side so there will me more air space that a traditional stack. There are the other points I mentioned as well, the diminishing radius and the crowned top. Also, the perimeter stacked in a circle won't be as dense either. Think about a fan that is unfurled that has a smaller inside circumference. Unless you build it entirely with wedge shape splits, it will have more air than a traditional stack.
    [​IMG]
  4. ansehnlich1

    ansehnlich1 Minister of Fire

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    Use the formula for volume of a cylinder and you'll come close to the cubic feet in a holz. I've had several of them and they pack tighter than one would think. Not a whole bunch of air space in the outer circles, the wood packs in there pretty tight.

    Volume of a Cylinder
    A cylinder with radius r units and height h units has a volume of V cubic units given by

    voume=pi times radius-squared times height.

    so if your holz is 10 feet wide at base, and 7 feet high, you'll have

    3.142 x 25 x 7 = 549.85 cubic feet, divided by 128 = 4.29 cord.

    All calculations are approximate :):):)
  5. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa Minister of Fire

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    Ja, I can do the math too. They say figures don't lie but liars always figure.

    If you sold firewood and used those figures, you could build a free HH for your customer out of the profits you'd get cheating them out of cords.
  6. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa Minister of Fire

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    Oh, another thing I took exception to in that article is the assertion that wood stacked vertically, end upon end, will shrink 20%. Everyone knows wood doesn't shrink along its length so waddup widdat? I won't even start in on the season in three months bit.
  7. Bigg_Redd

    Bigg_Redd Minister of Fire

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    The best way to know how much is in one of them fancy-pants stacks is to know how much wood you have before you fancy-pants stack it.

    Eh?
  8. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa Minister of Fire

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    Maybe I should get the MythBusters to do an episode on HH. They would probably set one on fire just to test the so called "chimney effect".

    Now, I know exactly how much wood my wood guy can carry on his truck since it comes in 8 foot lengths, tightly packed. I've verified that the 12 cord on the truck won't fit in my woodshed once bucked, split, and dried out in the sun all summer. Probably not at 20% shrinkage when I pack it in but some, none the less.

    Oh, and this 20% shrinkage bit... I think is another myth. The most I've seen is 10%. Log home builders factor 4 inches on 8 feet, mind you with partially seasoned logs.

    I'm still contemplating building HHs with the next 12 cord I get as my interim drying stacks before they go in the shed. I don't know how much fussing would be needed to keep the stacks even, what with wedge shape gaps messing with the lay. I see they start them with an inward slope which I presume diminishes quickly as you go up. In pictures I see the odd piece crossways to correct for the lay and it looks like less fussing than traditional crosspiled ends. They do look like a PITA though to build them 10 feet tall. I build 9 foot tall stacks in my woodshed and use a scaffold on wheels but that's with a concrete slab. Anyway... if I do decide to build HHs, once done, I will have my answer as to the question "How many cord in a HH?".

    The more I think about HHs the less appealing it is. I might just go with traditional rectangular stacks but drive 8 foot steel T-bar fenceposts two feet into the ground to save crosspiling the ends and then roll out some EPDM rubber on top to keep the rain off. That's 30 cu ft per lineal foot if 3 rows deep , so 50 - 60 feet in length. Run them North/South and keep them in the open where I can mow around them for good airflow.
  9. savageactor7

    savageactor7 Minister of Fire

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    psssst..... (LLigetfa don't waste your time.) Merry Christmas brother.
  10. Bigg_Redd

    Bigg_Redd Minister of Fire

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    But, but, but all the cool kids are making those hosehead-holzens
  11. adrpga498

    adrpga498 Minister of Fire

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    When I broke down my 7 foot holz and restacked closer to the house for dead of winter use it had 1 and 1/3 cord. I stacked 4 rows (face cord) each under my deck for ease of reload during rough weather. This was one of my averaged size HH with modest taper towards the top.
  12. LLigetfa

    LLigetfa Minister of Fire

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    Ja, I know... a yuppie craze... it's like those Pepsi commercials where they yearn to re-live a younger age... what was I thinking? I'm too old to be a yuppie.

    Slam in a few T-bar posts (already have the post driver), lay down some 5 foot lengths of sacrifice Poplar on the ground, lay up the wood without reaching or climbing ladders, and throw a cover on it.
  13. rphurley

    rphurley Feeling the Heat

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    Amen Brother!
  14. Gooserider

    Gooserider Mod Emeritus

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    I must admit I fail to see how an X' diameter circular pile of a given height could have more wood than an X' x X' square set of stacks the same height...

    I used cross-stacked ends to make my overflow piles last year (the stuff I didn't have room for in the woodshed) - IMHO it was a real PITA to make them, and I couldn't go that high on the piles. This year I used the pipe and rope (same as T-posts) method to make my stacks. I ended up with 4 full rows (x 18" = 72" = 7') each about 11' long (a function of my pallet sizes) and stacked from about 4.5' high on the ends to 6'+ in the center - call it 5' on average - or 7'x11'x5'=385 cuft or a hair over 3 cords. (This will fill my woodshed about 1/2 way, or most of what I'll be burning this winter)

    Thus far it's the fastest, lowest volume stacking method I've found - the only thing I need to do is keep a rough eye on my stack level so that I can keep things straight by which way I place the more tapered rounds...

    I will admit I have my doubts about the claimed fast drying properties of an HH, and while they may have aesthetic advantages over a normal stack, I don't see that they have that much of an advantage for most people.

    Gooserider
  15. Bigg_Redd

    Bigg_Redd Minister of Fire

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    Barbaric!
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