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Is stucco non-combustable?

Post in 'DIY and General non-hearth advice' started by Black Jaque Janaviac, Jan 20, 2012.

  1. Lumber-Jack

    Lumber-Jack Minister of Fire

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    I posted on your other thread, but I see Fossil is getting an itchy delete finger. LOL
    I've been a stucco contractor for 20 years, I'll try and help you out if that's what you want to do. However I don't want to start typing a post and get it deleted.

    If you could post a picture of the wall you intent to stucco that would be helpfull.

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  2. fossil

    fossil Accidental Moderator Staff Member

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    I'll try to merge the other thread with this one...that'll cure my finger itch for now. %-P
  3. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Feeling the Heat

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    sorry Fossil. I guess I came to this forum with the question whether stucco and/or drywall mud was suitable for non-combustable clearance. Once that question was answered to my satisfaction, I thought the How-tos of stucco would be most appropriate in the DIY section.

    Thanks for merging the two.
  4. fossil

    fossil Accidental Moderator Staff Member

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    My pleasure.
  5. Lumber-Jack

    Lumber-Jack Minister of Fire

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    One thing I'll say is, foam covering your walls is not cheap, and I think you'd have problems nailing metal lath through the foam and getting it to secure to the cement blocks. Gluing the foam to the block wall and using cloth mesh and acrylic primer is the way I would do it, but again, not cheap. You did say you wanted some inexpencive solution didn't you?
  6. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Feeling the Heat

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    Carbon,

    Thanks. Yes - inexpensive. I don't mind extra labor - it's just when something requires extra skill and/or knowlege that my home-improvement projects go south rapidly.

    I suppose firring strips and batting would be cheaper than foam if you're doing it yourself and labor is no cost? Or is there a better solution to insulating a basement wall?

    I spent all day yesterday chiselling paint off the cinder block directly behind the hearth pad. This will be the uninsulated section of wall. Under the paint there was some sort of yellow powdery stuff. I wire-brushed that as best I could, then scrubbed the wall with soapy water and a plastic bristle brush. The water seemed to soak into the block. Today I plan to prep with bonding agent and parge. I am hoping to finish it kind of like that Tuscan plaster mentioned before.
  7. Lumber-Jack

    Lumber-Jack Minister of Fire

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    Sounds like you are on the right track Jaque, that's why I wanted to see a picture to see if you had paint or something on the wall that would prevent stucco from sticking properly. The bonding agent is also a good idea, what exactly are you using?
  8. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Feeling the Heat

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    The bonding agent is Quikrete's commercial grade Concrete Bonding Adhesive.

    Before pictures are in this thread:

    http://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/88948/

    And in this thread:

    http://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/79535/

    The mortar looks pretty good. Just need to let it dry then off to the hardware store to get paint. I'm hoping they can suggest some colors 'cuz I'm not the one to pick 'em out. I've got a spare ceramic tile that I used for the hearth pad that I can bring in and pick some colors to match/compliment that. When I lived in Eau Claire there was a hardware store that had a large sign over the paint section which stated: "Husbands must have signed permission slip to choose paint colors without wife present."
  9. Lumber-Jack

    Lumber-Jack Minister of Fire

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    I don't know about that sign, I don't put a lot of stock in my wife's ability to pick colors, let me tell you a couple stories.
    My wife spent two months looking through interior design magazines and looking at paint samples picking out paint for our kitchen and dinning rooms, she finally settled on a 3 color combo, but when we started painting the walls with these colors we got about half way through painting the biggest wall she looked at the color, once it was on the wall, and decided she didn't like it and wanted to stop painting right then and there, and go re-tint the paint. It took all I could do to convince her we had to at least finish painting that one wall before we could go re-tinting any paint. In the end she kept the 3 colors, but she didn't like them,,, even though it was her choice and she had two months to come up with it.

    On another occasion after doing some reno work in the bedroom (a new walk-in closet and new window), I had to paint the walls, so I took a couple old cans of different color paint and mixed them together so I would have enough to do the whole room. One was green and the other yellow and I ended up with greeny yellow color (duh). Well when she came home from work and looked at the color of the bedroom she hated it. I told her I just used what we had, and that the next time it needed re-painting she could get whatever color she wanted. She agreed, but wasn't happy. Also I wanted to put curtains across the opening to the walk-in closet instead of doors, she didn't care for that idea either. Then, a couple days later, she was flipping though one of her interior design mags, and saw a picture of a modern bedroom they were featuring and it had curtains on the walk-in closet, and wouldn't you know it, the bedroom color was an exact match to the greeny/yellow I had mixed up. Needless to say, we now have the curtains and she loves the bedroom color. ;-)

    BTW I looked at the before picture in your second link and noticed something hanging above the mantle and the paraphernalia to the left hanging on the hooks, so I thought I'd show you a picture of what I have hanging above my door leading into my stove room.

    Attached Files:

  10. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Feeling the Heat

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    Hey I like that lintel decoration! I hope there's no dust collecting on that one. I have a number of 'em and they're all shooters.

    I will be moving my thunderstick before I get the stove in place. I doubt that constant exposure to such dry heat would be good for it.

    The one in my picture is my deer gun. Put two fawns in the freezer this year with it. One taken on a very rainy day and another taken while I "snuck" up on it. Both were coups that I was after for a number of years. I don't necessarily get to hunt in areas were big bucks are accessible so I try to make the antlerless hunting a bit of a challenge. To hunt all day in drizzle and rain with a flintlock then have it go off just like that is a satisfying experience. Although I must admit on another rainy day of the season I ended the day with a fail to fire - wasn't aiming at quarry though, just emptying the gun for the day.
  11. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Feeling the Heat

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    Oh, by the way, how long does the mortar need to dry before painting?
  12. Lumber-Jack

    Lumber-Jack Minister of Fire

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    I'm afraid it is mostly a dust collector now, although it got a lot of use in the past. We use to be caretakers on some property that belonged to a sportsman's association that included gun ranges, clubhouse and what not. They use to host a couple black powder shoots every year and after watching them have so much fun I decided to get my own Muzzle-loader.
    Often when we had company over they would see it hanging on the wall and ask if it really shoots, to which I would reply "sure does, you want to give it a try?". Almost everyone would take me up on the offer since very few people had ever had the opportunity to shoot a real old style flint lock before. I'd let them go through the whole routine loading the powder and packing the load themselves, and I'd always make sure they had an excess of powder in pan so they would get a good smoke show. ;-) Everyone always had a lot of fun.
    When we started care-taking there the club was mostly run by black powder shooters who were (for the most part) a bunch of great old guys, but after 14 years a lot of them passed away or petered out and a group of other people (non black powder) dipsticks started to run the club and it was time to move on.

    As for painting the mortar, if it is pure cement based mortar (no acrylic additives) it would be good to mist it with water and give it a couple days to cure at least. You want cement product to cure rather than dry. cement needs water to cure. Sometimes cement products can "dry" before they get a chance to cure properly, that's why it's good to mist them to aid the curing process. Then you really want to seal it well before applying your finish paint color, you could probably use your bonding agent as a sealer, and/or use a quality acylic paint sealer.
  13. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Feeling the Heat

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    I misted it shortly after it set, but this morning it was looking fairly dry. Is it too late to mist again?
  14. Lumber-Jack

    Lumber-Jack Minister of Fire

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    Keep misting it, the idea is to keep it moist during the curing (hydration) process.
    They say cement continues curing for years. If you were pouring a concrete wall you'd want to let it sit for a month or more, but for practical purposes with a thin parge like that a couple days should be good. Just make sure you seal it up good before painting it.

    How about posting another picture of what you got so far.
  15. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Feeling the Heat

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    You're killing me! You know I've got the stove sitting right next to the hearth pad in the basement, it's snowing out. I've got about 3 cords of oak outside. And I've gotta wait DAYS to paint? AAAARGH! I feel like a kid on December 22nd!

    OK so once it dries I can re-wet it and still benefit. Went home for lunch and misted it, and turned the fan off. I'll post pix tonight.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    That's too bad about the smokepole. Although they seem like rather crude weapons they're not. They may be primitive and simple but a good flintlock is definitely NOT crude. When you can punch hole after hole into a 1.5" group at 100 yards that's dang good. How did that one shoot for you?
  16. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Feeling the Heat

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    Here are some pictures of the project. The one with the dark surface is freshly parged. The one that is lighter is after the mortar has dried some. I think I will set up the woodstove and let the mortar cure for a month then try my best to paint behind it while avoiding getting paint all over the stove. And I'll continue misting the mortar for a week or so.

    Is latex paint the best way to get the color I want (Tuscan plaster look)? Based on how well the previous paint holds I think it's safe to say there would be no moisture problems. Was that yellow powdery stuff a sealer? I can't imagine it sealed water away from the paint very well. It seemed to merely fill the pores of the concrete so the paint wouldn't soak in so deep.

    Also is the bonding agent in photo good to cover the mortar before painting or should I use something else? Or just paint on the bare mortar?

    Attached Files:

  17. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Feeling the Heat

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    and picture of the drying parge and the bond agent.

    Attached Files:

  18. Jags

    Jags Moderate Moderator Staff Member

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    You may want to look at American clay. It is also inert, so it wont burn. It will trowel on like the cement you troweled (kinda).
    http://americanclay.com/landingpage/
  19. Lumber-Jack

    Lumber-Jack Minister of Fire

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    I'm not familiar with that product (quikrete), but experience tells me that most of those products are basically the same generic acrylic based bonders diluted to different ratios. I always use this product Weldbond becuase it is the most reliable and one of the most concentrated products out there and can be used in all sorts of different applications. It makes a great wood glue, and bonding agent for cement products, and I know painters who have told me they have used it for primer sealer before painting. That's why I was suggesting if you have enough left you could use it as a sealer on your cement plaster wall before painting, although it looks you have a small container there and since you already used some you may not have enough left to get a really good seal coat and probably should use some proper paint primer coat as well. If you just paint it without sealing it properly the finish coat of paint will look patchy, just like your parge looks now, with some of the brick mortar lines coming through.
    All I would do now is seal up the wall first with that quickrete diluted with water (just to use it up, unless you have another use for it), then a proper acrylic paint sealer, then paint whatever color you fancy.
    That American clay product that Jags suggest would probably be a better way to give you that Tuscan plaster look you are going for, but I guarantee it will cost you more to do properly than what I'm suggesting, and will end up taking you longer to get the job finished. It all depends on how much time and money you want to throw at this project.
    There are ways to achive those subtle color tones similar to Tuscon plaster using painting techniques as well, by using a rag or sponge to rub the wall with a slightly darker, or lighter, paint or stain after the wall has been painted. This works well with a textured wall like you have.
  20. Black Jaque Janaviac

    Black Jaque Janaviac Feeling the Heat

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    I'm pretty content with the texture I've got. I think my biggest priority will be to get the light base-coat down to fill the micro-pores so it doesn't have that soaked-in look. I'm not dealing with a large coverage area so I will probably use up the rest of that Quikrete bonder and maybe get some more it was only 5 or 6 bucks. Then I'll raid the paint cabinet for any leftover white latex paints. Then I'll go over that with my light-tinted basecoat. Then if that has a sufficiently "satin" look I'll go over it with a darker glaze.

    I'm aware that the biggest risk would be if the parge is still too porous when I apply the dark glaze I won't be able to wipe it off the high spots.

    Thanks, you've been really helpful.

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