The grill should go in gently. You have to match up the clips on the grill with the holes made for it and it should go in easily. I open the door to get the grill out. someone here might have a solution otherwise call Jotul usa at 1-207-797-5912 and ask for a technician. Good luck. See page 13 of your installation manual.
Jotul c550 Rockland tips thread
- Thread starter rockreid
- Start date
-
Active since 1995, Hearth.com is THE place on the internet for free information and advice about wood stoves, pellet stoves and other energy saving equipment.
We strive to provide opinions, articles, discussions and history related to Hearth Products and in a more general sense, energy issues.
We promote the EFFICIENT, RESPONSIBLE, CLEAN and SAFE use of all fuels, whether renewable or fossil.
FISHBONZ
New Member
Great Thread Folks! I must appologize in advance if my issues have been discussed already. I promise I stared reading this thread from the very beginning and realized it would take me untill tomorrow to get through it. So rather than falling asleep at the computer I will risk embarrassment as just shoot some questions out there.
1. If I smell the fire outside, does that mean smoke? I used to have a free-standing Harmon Stove in my old home and it would burn so clean there would be no smoke and no smell. With this Jotul, I can't seem to get the smoke to go completely away and the smell is very noticeable. Luckly I have awesome neighbors and they tell me they love the smell. I'm just afraid they will get tired of it. Also, I want to be efficient witht the fuel and not pollute the envirnment....too much. Is it a matter of getting it hotter?
2. How does the secondary burn work in this unit? How can I tell by looking at it.
Thanks for the information
1. If I smell the fire outside, does that mean smoke? I used to have a free-standing Harmon Stove in my old home and it would burn so clean there would be no smoke and no smell. With this Jotul, I can't seem to get the smoke to go completely away and the smell is very noticeable. Luckly I have awesome neighbors and they tell me they love the smell. I'm just afraid they will get tired of it. Also, I want to be efficient witht the fuel and not pollute the envirnment....too much. Is it a matter of getting it hotter?
2. How does the secondary burn work in this unit? How can I tell by looking at it.
Thanks for the information
FISHBONZ
New Member
Another question.
If there is flame in the firebox, does that mean smoke? Do I want flame or not? Other than it looking cool that is
If there is flame in the firebox, does that mean smoke? Do I want flame or not? Other than it looking cool that is
FISHBONZ said:
1. I can smell smoke though none is coming from my chimney. Not a strong smell but it is there - sometimes and sometimes not. Neighbors say they love it too so I don't worry as much as I did at first. Sometimes the smell will be more of a metallic smell.....
Sometimes I too get smoke even tough stove top temp. is in the 600's. It is clear and when I questioned it in another thread someone said if it was white it was probably steam due to outside temp. I don't worry about it anymore either. It usually goes away after awhile.
2. When my insert is burning with a full load I will bet rolling flames on top of the logs when it is above 500*. Sometimes I will get flames shooting out of the air tubes too.
Hope this helps you some.
FISHBONZ said:
Flame in firebox doesn't mean smoke unless I have just reloaded.
I always have flames. If they disappear because I have cut the air back too soon I will get smoke until I give it more air.
Only time I don't have flames is when load has hit the coaling stage. No smoke then as all the carbon** has been burned out of the wood which is what makes the smoke. (**I think that is what does it. Read something like that here somewhere but I am not good at details.....it could be that all the other gasses have burned out except for the carbon....oh well, the important thing is that at the coaling stage I get no smoke....)
EJL923
Minister of Fire
EJL923
Minister of Fire
Whats the longest continuous time everyone has run the blowers for? The insert is pretty much useless without them, so does everyone just let them go if they are burning 24/7?
For the past week I have been burning 24/7. As long as I have coals I don't want stove to cool off completely. I run the fans on manual all the time. FYI last year during the ice storm we lost power for three and a half days, NO FAN. I opened the stove door and placed a three sided screen on the mantel. Still got plenty of heat.
Thanks Labrador. Could you please tell me if the bottom of your grill rests on the stove surround (or if you have a gap in between)? I am having a hard time to figure out what it is supposed to look like.labrador said:
I have a question about cleaning (please forgive if it sounds stupid): does the insert need to be pulled out to have the chimney cleaned? The manual talks about "cleaning the insert": what does that mean and how often should it be done? Thanks again for your help!
Woodnewbie, I believe there is a thread that discusses cleaning the 550. I have cleaned mine form the roof down WITHOUT moving the stove at all. All of the stuff in the steel liner will drop to the baffle plates and you can vacuum out above the plates. I had to fashion a plastic tube 1" and attached it to the vacuum. There may be an easier way to do this. Some owners remove the baffle plates I think.
I had a sweep who cleaned from the bottom without moving the stove. Also I have taken out the secondary tubes and baffles to clean (very easy and fast). I just bought the Sooteater and plan to clean from the bottom this weekend. No need to pull out the stove. The only issue I have is you can't get a good look up the SS liner.
Okay, I am reading through this thread but I am getting frustrated with the stove even with all of the good information.
Let's start from square 1.
I have good dry wood. I borrowed a moisture meater and selected a large sampling of the most dry wood, I used a moisture and all of it was below 20%.
My problem is that I am not getting the fire hot enough. The top of stove is reading in the low 300s and no secondary burn.
What is the proper step 2 that I need to take.
I stacked the wood and did a top down light and it worked well. But the heat never came up much above 300 as measured on the top of the stove with an IR thermometer. What did I do wrong? The next time I am going to make the V at the bottom of the wood stack as illustrated in another thread to get more air circulating.
Also when do you close and lock the door after ignition?
When to you choke down the primary?
When should I normally see a secondary burn?
Thank you for any help.
Carl
Let's start from square 1.
I have good dry wood. I borrowed a moisture meater and selected a large sampling of the most dry wood, I used a moisture and all of it was below 20%.
My problem is that I am not getting the fire hot enough. The top of stove is reading in the low 300s and no secondary burn.
What is the proper step 2 that I need to take.
I stacked the wood and did a top down light and it worked well. But the heat never came up much above 300 as measured on the top of the stove with an IR thermometer. What did I do wrong? The next time I am going to make the V at the bottom of the wood stack as illustrated in another thread to get more air circulating.
Also when do you close and lock the door after ignition?
When to you choke down the primary?
When should I normally see a secondary burn?
Thank you for any help.
Carl
Rudyjr
Feeling the Heat
Carl, Look for a member of this forum that goes by the name Cleanburnin, Brent O'Conner. He has instructions in his signature for starting a good base fire. He helped me out last winter with my new stove. If you do not start with a decent base fire you will be hard pressed to really get the stove up to temperature. Also from my experience a lower block off plate helps a great deal. These new EPA stoves take some getting used to.
I am going to build my next base fire exactly this way but use newspaper knots instead of cedar bark.
Here is my update:
Hello WoodNewbie, I have not performed that measurement by cutting a "aged" piece of wood and taking the moisture measurement.
Here is the good news. I came home, and raked the coals flat. Added two small splits and opened the primary wide open. I left door just ajar a bit and let her rip to get the fire going. I then closed but did nto seal the door and let the fire continue to build and finally I sealed the door. I got a high heat reading of 560 degrees but no secondary burn and when I reloaded I cruised in the mid to low 400s. I think a light went on about a coal bed but I am still not quite there yet.
When it was hot, I was amazed at how much better the heat throw was. The stove is in a 15x20 room that open to a stairway leading up and the temp in the stairway hit 82 degrees. With the thermostat set at 65 the upstairs was a warm 75 and the room adjoining the stove stayed around 70 with the heat having to move through a door way.
A definite improvement.
the downside was my wife was not pleased that I came home from work and "fussed with a stove all night." All temps were with my IR thermometer, a Raytek aka Fluke pyrometer.
I am going to keep trying for that magical 600-700 range.
Cheers
Carl
Here is my update:
Hello WoodNewbie, I have not performed that measurement by cutting a "aged" piece of wood and taking the moisture measurement.
Here is the good news. I came home, and raked the coals flat. Added two small splits and opened the primary wide open. I left door just ajar a bit and let her rip to get the fire going. I then closed but did nto seal the door and let the fire continue to build and finally I sealed the door. I got a high heat reading of 560 degrees but no secondary burn and when I reloaded I cruised in the mid to low 400s. I think a light went on about a coal bed but I am still not quite there yet.
When it was hot, I was amazed at how much better the heat throw was. The stove is in a 15x20 room that open to a stairway leading up and the temp in the stairway hit 82 degrees. With the thermostat set at 65 the upstairs was a warm 75 and the room adjoining the stove stayed around 70 with the heat having to move through a door way.
A definite improvement.
the downside was my wife was not pleased that I came home from work and "fussed with a stove all night." All temps were with my IR thermometer, a Raytek aka Fluke pyrometer.
I am going to keep trying for that magical 600-700 range.
Cheers
Carl
EJL923
Minister of Fire
I don't know what everyone's burn times have been, but I decided to take some action. I've had the stove for a little over two months, and i finally called my stove guy to check things out to see why i haven't been getting usable heat longer than 4-5 hours. Just from browsing this site, i already pretty much knew what the solutions might be. However, i figured i would follow the chain and have the stove guy take care of things so they don't blame me for ruining anything. My stove guy started telling me about the EPA stoves ad how they let in too much air in. I also knew that everyone's house and draft is different. I know i have too much draft, so limiting air intake would be key. The guy suggested grinding down the air intake slide, which i agreed because i wanted to do that anyway. Some might say this takes away from what an EPA stove was made for, but that's not true in my case and probably a lot of others. Do a search on the "florida bungalow syndrome" for wood stoves and read the article, you will agree with everything it says. In short, it talks about how stoves are designed around a short chimney and warmer temps. In my case, a taller chimney and colder temps.
Anyway...the results.
The air intake now slides all the way closed. Dont forget, you still have the zipper air and secondary air coming into the stove. I have gone up to 7-8 hour burn times. Still no smoke coming from the chimney. I did make a scientific snaffooo. I made two adjustments at the same time so i dont know what made the bigger difference. The zipper air has two 0.180" holes and i blocked one with a 10-32 screw thinking that lowering just the primary air wouldnt be enough. I went out for errands yesterday for 7 hours. Previously i would come home to a cold stove with little if any hot coals. This time, i came home to a glowing orange bed of coals, ready to easily light a new load. I was pleasantly surprised. Same thing when i woke up this morning. There was still some wood "charcoaling" in the back of my stove this morning, so i am going to take out that screw and see what happens.
In short...
Read that article and realize some stoves have to be adjusted to your conditions. I was ready to give up on babysitting this stove, now i think im just beginning. Hope this helps everyone, and i will let you know how removing that screw worked out.
Anyway...the results.
The air intake now slides all the way closed. Dont forget, you still have the zipper air and secondary air coming into the stove. I have gone up to 7-8 hour burn times. Still no smoke coming from the chimney. I did make a scientific snaffooo. I made two adjustments at the same time so i dont know what made the bigger difference. The zipper air has two 0.180" holes and i blocked one with a 10-32 screw thinking that lowering just the primary air wouldnt be enough. I went out for errands yesterday for 7 hours. Previously i would come home to a cold stove with little if any hot coals. This time, i came home to a glowing orange bed of coals, ready to easily light a new load. I was pleasantly surprised. Same thing when i woke up this morning. There was still some wood "charcoaling" in the back of my stove this morning, so i am going to take out that screw and see what happens.
In short...
Read that article and realize some stoves have to be adjusted to your conditions. I was ready to give up on babysitting this stove, now i think im just beginning. Hope this helps everyone, and i will let you know how removing that screw worked out.
Great post EJL923 and congratulations on your work. I am still a newbie and really appreciate all of the informaton everyone posts. I am on my second season with a Jotul 550 and also get 4-5 hr burns. This year I installed a Jotul 450 in our second fireplace and get 10-12 hr burns so I know it's not the wood. Both installations are the same (6 inch full insulated liner, blockoff plate, etc.) except the 550 has a 23' liner and the 450 has 13'. I started taking the front off of the 550 tonight to look at why it get's so much air and I took a break to get caught up on this forum and saw your post.
Do you have any pictures of your modifications? I do not understand what you ground down. My slide when closed covers all of the air inlet holes except the one on the far left. It looks like that inlet was designed to always allow air to enter. I was thinking about trying to block that inlet.
Also, what and where are the zipper holes that you are referring to?
Finally, where does the secondary air enter?
Thanks everyone,
Scott
Do you have any pictures of your modifications? I do not understand what you ground down. My slide when closed covers all of the air inlet holes except the one on the far left. It looks like that inlet was designed to always allow air to enter. I was thinking about trying to block that inlet.
Also, what and where are the zipper holes that you are referring to?
Finally, where does the secondary air enter?
Thanks everyone,
Scott
EJL923
Minister of Fire
I dont have any pictures of the mods unfortunately. The cast iron slider (primary air) is what you grind. If you take that off (from inside the stove, 3 bolts), you will see what the slider stops against. You grind that as needed to close off the entire top row. I believe on mine, only the middle hole was slightly open, now they all close when I slide to the left.
The zipper air is another non-adjustable leak into your stove. If you look at the front/center/bottom of your stove, you will see that rectangluar shape in the cast iron. If you take a mirror and look back at the front bottom from inside the stove, you will see two holes, about Ø3/16" in diameter. This is air brought in to help burn your coals down. I felt that it ate through the wood too fast, so i blocked one. The inlet for this is tucked up inside where the blowers are, behind the heat shield. Secondary air enters through the back of the stove, on the bottom. In fact, your zipper air will probably make a bigger effect than your primary air on burn time. Take a 10-24 or 10-32 screw and throw one into one of the holes.
How much heat does your 450 throw compared to your 550?
The zipper air is another non-adjustable leak into your stove. If you look at the front/center/bottom of your stove, you will see that rectangluar shape in the cast iron. If you take a mirror and look back at the front bottom from inside the stove, you will see two holes, about Ø3/16" in diameter. This is air brought in to help burn your coals down. I felt that it ate through the wood too fast, so i blocked one. The inlet for this is tucked up inside where the blowers are, behind the heat shield. Secondary air enters through the back of the stove, on the bottom. In fact, your zipper air will probably make a bigger effect than your primary air on burn time. Take a 10-24 or 10-32 screw and throw one into one of the holes.
How much heat does your 450 throw compared to your 550?
I tapped out both of the zipper air vents and put in one screw but I had to use a 12x24 screw. The holes on mine were larger than a 10. tapped out the second hole in case I do not like the results with only one screw
I replaced the slider assembly without making any changes. I have attempted to attach some pictures so you can see that my slider does not block off all of the primary air intake vents because of the length of the slider. All of the vents that are covered by the slider can be closed so I do not have anything to grind. Is your slider shortened like mine or did it go the full length? Depending on how the zipper air vent test goes, I may extend the slider so that all of the air vents are under it's control.
Finally, I thought it was odd that the left opening on the face frame is always open and only is covered with the decorative piece. No wonder so much air gets into the firebox.
I replaced the slider assembly without making any changes. I have attempted to attach some pictures so you can see that my slider does not block off all of the primary air intake vents because of the length of the slider. All of the vents that are covered by the slider can be closed so I do not have anything to grind. Is your slider shortened like mine or did it go the full length? Depending on how the zipper air vent test goes, I may extend the slider so that all of the air vents are under it's control.
Finally, I thought it was odd that the left opening on the face frame is always open and only is covered with the decorative piece. No wonder so much air gets into the firebox.
Attachments
I forgot to comment on the 450 vs 550. I really do not have anything negative to say about the 450. It is so easy to control the burn that in two days of using it, I was better at using the 450 than the 550 which I had used for more than a year. I think the 450 puts out so much heat that the Jotul could have put a bigger blower motor in it and also a lot of heat comes out of it withough using the blower too unlike the 550 whcih you get practically no heat without the blower. Overall the 550 puts out somewhat more heat but I easily go through three times the wood and controlling the burn is a real pain compared to the 450. If I would do it again, I would not buy the 550 again.
If the modifications I started making to our 550 help with the burn times I may change my mind but the 550 has a long way to go to get the 10-12 hour brn times I am getting with our 450.
If the modifications I started making to our 550 help with the burn times I may change my mind but the 550 has a long way to go to get the 10-12 hour brn times I am getting with our 450.
Hi everyone - I'm so glad I stumbled upon this site and particulary this thread -- I hope its still going. I'm getting my Jotul 550 installed this Friday and can't wait. We decided on the Jotul after also looking at the Lopi Declaration. We wanted flush mount and the Jotul in the end seemed to be the better choice. After reading this thread, I feel so much more comfortable already. I used a lot of what I learned here to "quiz" my potential installers and in the end I think I made much better choice. Here's hoping to a great install, a great stove, and drink by the fire this weekend!
I read alot of people talking about the temp of the stove insert..........Where do you have a thermometer that gives you these temp readings. I just had my insert installed at the end of April.. We had a couple of chilly nights immediately following my install so I started to prime the stove so it will be ready for the fall. But Im still confused about this temp thing. Do you have to buy a special thermom. and where do you put it.
I would appreciate any help.
I would appreciate any help.
EJL923
Minister of Fire
Most of the 550 owners place the thermometer inside where the blower air exits, on top of the main stove plate. Its not very easily seen at first, but after a while you can just look at where the needle is and know the temp without having to match it up with an actual number. Another thing you can do is at first have two thermometers, one inside the blower area, and one on the face, then note the correlation between the two. I would leave it inside the air exit, where it is out of sight and doesnt take away from the flush face look. After all that being said, the only way you would have to worry about the temp on this stove is if you left the air wide open during the whole burn, in which you should have been watching it and turned down the air in the first place. I have very good draft, almost too much, and still i only worry about temps if i forget about turning down the air.
Similar threads
