Lost heat - what a waste!

[SmokeyTheBear]

BDPVT How does the fact that most pellet stoves use a 35-1 fuel to air ratio as opposed to the 10-1 fuel to air ratio on the Europa factor into the equation? I had Claude explain it to me (part of which was patented info he asked me not to share) I wanted your thoughts. Also, he said I could pass on your response to him and if you were close to one of his trade secrets, he may just email you directly and discuss it further.

most pellet stoves 35-1 ratio" is vague. i like your disclosures & wish other stoves would also.
ask franks what happens if i simply put a light dimmer on my exhaust blower to cut down the 35-1 ratio?

I can even answer that one, however the reason that the 10 to 1 air works for the Europa and results in a clean burn is the key and if you go digging you might discover how that comes about.

You do that with your stove and the pellets will pile up and end up in the ash pan.

 

[Fsappo]

Common sense would tell me if you are pushing 3.5 times more air out the pipe it would take more heat with it and be less eff. PM me if I'm to close too a trade secret and I'll delete the post.

I guess your explaining it like Claude explained it to me. Don't worry about deleting the post. I think the lower air ratio is only part of the equation. It appears that a combustion chamber and technique needs to be designed to support the burning with less air.

 

[Fsappo]

BDPVT How does the fact that most pellet stoves use a 35-1 fuel to air ratio as opposed to the 10-1 fuel to air ratio on the Europa factor into the equation? I had Claude explain it to me (part of which was patented info he asked me not to share) I wanted your thoughts. Also, he said I could pass on your response to him and if you were close to one of his trade secrets, he may just email you directly and discuss it further.

most pellet stoves 35-1 ratio" is vague. i like your disclosures & wish other stoves would also.
ask franks what happens if i simply put a light dimmer on my exhaust blower to cut down the 35-1 ratio?

I really dont know what would happen. In a typical pellet stove, I would guess that the pellets just wouldnt burn completely and you would have a really dirty smokey fire.

 

[Fsappo]

BDPVT How does the fact that most pellet stoves use a 35-1 fuel to air ratio as opposed to the 10-1 fuel to air ratio on the Europa factor into the equation? I had Claude explain it to me (part of which was patented info he asked me not to share) I wanted your thoughts. Also, he said I could pass on your response to him and if you were close to one of his trade secrets, he may just email you directly and discuss it further.

most pellet stoves 35-1 ratio" is vague. i like your disclosures & wish other stoves would also.
ask franks what happens if i simply put a light dimmer on my exhaust blower to cut down the 35-1 ratio?

I know it's vague but I'm sure the fuel to air ratio on other stoves can be found online someplace.

 

[mooselake]

It may be a bit naive but it seems that the real efficiency question is how do btus into the house relate to btus into the appliance. BTUs into the firebox are only part of the answer, it would seem.

With a two pound/hr burn of 8500 btu/lb pellets, and a stove the has an electrical load of 200W, the hourly total into the stove is 17,680 btu. Therefor a 95% efficient furnace would put 16796 BTUs towards keeping the room warm. At 80% only 14144 keeps the wife warm.

Any idea on how many btus go into the room rather than into heat that partly goes up the chimney?

Thanks!

 

[Trickyrick]

I can give you an estimate of my stove.

Last Dec (2008) I used 7,542,000 BTUs to heat my home with electric heat only at 100% efficient. I heated my home to 64 degrees at night and while at work and 68 while home and weekends.

This is where a little apples and oranges come into play..

This Dec (2009) I used 2,590,000 BTUs of electricity to heat my home (gone christmas week and 3 days with the stove out for repairs) The hous was heated to an average temp all day of 73

I used another 9,600,000 BTUs of pellets to het the house.

If as a worst case I subtract the electric heat this year from last that leaves me about 5,000,000 BTUs not I

Sooo I needed 5million BTUs and U burned 9.6million btus of pellets so worst case is 52% TOTAL efficency.

I know my house and know hat a 5 degree difference is about 1.1million BTUs based on the calculations. and looking at the mean heating temps of each month etc etc...

The closest number I can pull is 5/8.5 or 59% efficient.....

If there is a 70% total overall efficient system I will be very very surprised.

That includes everything and EVERYONE will be different because the construction of their house is different and their instal is different.

I do not care what stove you are going to get. the heat exchanger efficieny is what holds everyone back but there also isn't too much you can do based on the limits of the materials we burn and the space we have to build it in.

 

[Fsappo]

It may be a bit naive but it seems that the real efficiency question is how do btus into the house relate to btus into the appliance. BTUs into the firebox are only part of the answer, it would seem.

With a two pound/hr burn of 8500 btu/lb pellets, and a stove the has an electrical load of 200W, the hourly total into the stove is 17,680 btu. Therefor a 95% efficient furnace would put 16796 BTUs towards keeping the room warm. At 80% only 14144 keeps the wife warm.

Any idea on how many btus go into the room rather than into heat that partly goes up the chimney?

Thanks!

I think thats what the chart I posted above is saying. A typical pellet stove puts 48% into the room and 52% out the chimney more or less. The post after yours somewhat supports this with his rough math. There should be a standardized way to measure actual heat into the room compared to pounds of fuel used. Thats why I want to run the side by side test. I just lack the space and resources to do so. We need someone to step up to the plate here! I already know Claude will donate a stove to the cause.

 

[mascoma]

I think thats what the chart I posted above is saying. A typical pellet stove puts 48% into the room and 52% out the chimney more or less. The post after yours somewhat supports this with his rough math. There should be a standardized way to measure actual heat into the room compared to pounds of fuel used. Thats why I want to run the side by side test. I just lack the space and resources to do so. We need someone to step up to the plate here! I already know Claude will donate a stove to the cause.

I'm on pace to burn 7ton pellets thru my Harman for the second year in a row, and about 100 gallons of oil.
You can ship the Europa to my place, I'll run it for the 2010-2011 season and see how it stacks up.

 

[Fsappo]

I think thats what the chart I posted above is saying. A typical pellet stove puts 48% into the room and 52% out the chimney more or less. The post after yours somewhat supports this with his rough math. There should be a standardized way to measure actual heat into the room compared to pounds of fuel used. Thats why I want to run the side by side test. I just lack the space and resources to do so. We need someone to step up to the plate here! I already know Claude will donate a stove to the cause.

I'm on pace to burn 7ton pellets thru my Harman for the second year in a row, and about 100 gallons of oil.
You can ship the Europa to my place, I'll run it for the 2010-2011 season and see how it stacks up.

There may have to be some paperwork involved, etc. Wouldnt that be a good test though? We would have to see what Claude says. One downside is we wait until spring of 2011 for results. I think the same could be accomplished in one month with the right set up.