Ok, I'm almost done splitting today, so I'm taking a break. For the last week, my RH has been well below 20% during the day, with nice breezes and good sun.( current is 74 °F in the shade, w/ a RH of 7%). Since Pine is back as a topic, thought I'd ask how long mine should sit before being considered seasoned? 90% is dead standing for min. 2yrs. Stack has grown to 46'long, 7'deep, by average of 5' tall. Almost done- short stack to finish off. More next week. And for the "Pic's or it didn't happen" crowd, PM me your #, and I'll send you a crappy cell-phone picture, 'cause I can't post pics. here, yet. JB :coolgrin:
Low RH, and seasoning time of dead-standing?
- Thread starter Beetle-Kill
- Start date
-
Active since 1995, Hearth.com is THE place on the internet for free information and advice about wood stoves, pellet stoves and other energy saving equipment.
We strive to provide opinions, articles, discussions and history related to Hearth Products and in a more general sense, energy issues.
We promote the EFFICIENT, RESPONSIBLE, CLEAN and SAFE use of all fuels, whether renewable or fossil.
- Status
Beetle-Kill said:
Not sure on the seasoning time but don't take a break! :coolgrin:
zap
Good job beatle-kill.
Zap, you're killing me. My competitive streak is alive and well. When my in-laws, friends, and whomever else ask-"Don't you have enough by now?", I think to myself, Zap is still cutting, what do these people know?! Seriously, I'll be done here next week. Then the splitter goes to my buddy's place, and we work on the monster pile. I will have the 46' row done by Tues., but for now, it's beer-thirty.
Hello beetle-kill...I cut split and stacked alot of various kinds of hard wood and eastern white pine this past winter and spring. I plan to burn it this winter. Have done it this way for a good many years and havn't had any problems. Clean my chimney fall and spring and once in the middle of the winter during a warm spell...usually in january. I use a smoke dragon type stove and will use that type till it's against the law...then I will buy a more modern stove. Actually if you know how to fire it the smoke dragon type stoves do well. Oldmainer
Oldmainer, sounds like this ain't your first rodeo. Nice to hear from the "seasoned" hands. Thanks for your input. Don't take this post too seriously, as I do this on occasion just to get a "Huh,...what is He thinking?" response. I really Do have a rather large stack out front, but the way Colorado's weather is, I know there isn't any decent way to assume drying times. As to your smoke-dragon, I burned a Timberline last year with great results(I didn't freeze). I modified mine for secondary-air, and it worked nicely.( Thanks Pen and Wes999 for the input). Out till tomorrow. JB
I don't know about your pine BK, but it's easy to find standing dead pine around here that is pretty much ready to burn when you cut it down. The first few rounds near the ground will be up around 30% MC, but the rounds closer to the top are often in the 15%-20% MC range. That's why I don't have to fret about storing up years and years worth of wood, as long as I get my winters worth of wood cut before snow flies I'm set for the winter. I just stack the wetter wood in a separate stack and leave it till the last, and if I don't use it this winter it will be nice and dry for next winter.
I know this flies in the face of conventional wisdom here in this forum, but most in this forum live in much damper weather conditions, and most are cutting green (live) trees, and hardwood. I have only cut one live tree in my life that was cut for fire wood.
I assume, like me, you are cutting standing dead pine that died from pine beetle, have you measured the MC of the trees you are cutting?
I know this flies in the face of conventional wisdom here in this forum, but most in this forum live in much damper weather conditions, and most are cutting green (live) trees, and hardwood. I have only cut one live tree in my life that was cut for fire wood.
I assume, like me, you are cutting standing dead pine that died from pine beetle, have you measured the MC of the trees you are cutting?
Just when you think you're out, they pull you back in. Carbon, I think you and I are facing the same circumstances. The "bug" has laid waste around here. I bucked some green pine earlier this year, but it's at the end of the stacks, so good for next year. I moved a few cord from last year to a different location, so I consider them only for emergencies(broken leg, beheading, etc.,etc.) Most everything I've split in the last week has had a nice "ting" sound, when tossed into a pile. I think the Chinook winds will help even more. I Am getting to the point of being 3 years ahead, but like you said, I really don't need to be. I'm in cutting/splitting mode right now, and I'm gonna ride that wave until it peters out. Wood processing really can take a huge chunk of your time, especially with our short summers.(BTW- I'll put my Pine up against yours, anytime!) :cheese:
Hi Beetle Kill:
Grand County, 8550 feet, 2 to 3 yr dead standing lodge pole pine: If it doesn't smell wet, they are WRBs (Wood: Ready to Burn). When they "pop" when the splitter wedge hits 'em, burn em. If it's been raining a lot, or if they've been lying on the ground for more than a week, I split them and wait till they don't smell wet. Usually within a month with the beetle kill, because they've been "de sapped" by the bugs, and re-dry quickly. It's a tragedy, but great for fast seasoning wood.
Regards,
Dexter
Grand County, 8550 feet, 2 to 3 yr dead standing lodge pole pine: If it doesn't smell wet, they are WRBs (Wood: Ready to Burn). When they "pop" when the splitter wedge hits 'em, burn em. If it's been raining a lot, or if they've been lying on the ground for more than a week, I split them and wait till they don't smell wet. Usually within a month with the beetle kill, because they've been "de sapped" by the bugs, and re-dry quickly. It's a tragedy, but great for fast seasoning wood.
Regards,
Dexter
"De-sapped", that's the perfect description.
To quote from Wikipedia "Pine beetles carry blue stain fungi which, if established, will block the tree resin response. Within about two weeks of a beetle attack, the trees starve to death as the phloem layer is damaged enough to cut off the flow of water and nutrients"
The Lodgepole pine trees I look for when seeking firewood are ones that are still standing, been dead for several years, much of the old dead needles have fallen off, and have long vertical splits already developed in the trees. As Dexter eludes to, the trees that are laying down are not as ideal as the ones that remain standing, even if they are not lying directly on the ground. I think this is because the vertical standing trees shed water better and dry quicker being more exposed to the wind. I find the ones that are laying down, even if they are supported off the ground by other fallen trees, tend to hold more moisture, and will begin to get punky after just a few years, whereas the vertical standing trees seem to last indefinitely (decades) before they start showing any signs of getting punky.
In contrast, I often also cut some standing dead Douglas fir for firewood, but the fir trees are rarely as dry as the beetle killed pines because they don't die in the same way by having the water flow cut off, consequently even after the fir tree has been dead for many many years, and the needles have long since fallen off, there still seems to be a large amount of sap still present in the trunk.
(BTW, my signature was mainly directed at Easterner who don't have access to good pine like Lodgepole pine. If they did there wouldn't be so many of them down on pine.) ;-)
To quote from Wikipedia "Pine beetles carry blue stain fungi which, if established, will block the tree resin response. Within about two weeks of a beetle attack, the trees starve to death as the phloem layer is damaged enough to cut off the flow of water and nutrients"
The Lodgepole pine trees I look for when seeking firewood are ones that are still standing, been dead for several years, much of the old dead needles have fallen off, and have long vertical splits already developed in the trees. As Dexter eludes to, the trees that are laying down are not as ideal as the ones that remain standing, even if they are not lying directly on the ground. I think this is because the vertical standing trees shed water better and dry quicker being more exposed to the wind. I find the ones that are laying down, even if they are supported off the ground by other fallen trees, tend to hold more moisture, and will begin to get punky after just a few years, whereas the vertical standing trees seem to last indefinitely (decades) before they start showing any signs of getting punky.
In contrast, I often also cut some standing dead Douglas fir for firewood, but the fir trees are rarely as dry as the beetle killed pines because they don't die in the same way by having the water flow cut off, consequently even after the fir tree has been dead for many many years, and the needles have long since fallen off, there still seems to be a large amount of sap still present in the trunk.
(BTW, my signature was mainly directed at Easterner who don't have access to good pine like Lodgepole pine. If they did there wouldn't be so many of them down on pine.) ;-)
Beetle-Kill said:
The Lord works in mysterious ways. He gives the best drying conditions to the folks who need it least. Pine dries so fast it's breathtaking. At <20% RH (and I had to check Weather Underground to believe that...Wow!), it should happen almost in front of your eyes.
Stranding dead, split and stacked, extremely low RH, windy location? Stick a fork in 'er... she's already done. :lol:
FWIW, freshly cut cherry stacked in my basement with fans on it, at 85-90ºF and RH about 20%, dries to the 15% range on the inside in three weeks or so. Makes for some frosty basement windows in Jan-Feb.
Generally, I don't have the opportunity to burn deciduous trees that often. Usually it's scrounged from around Boulder CO residential areas after a very early or very late wet snow has broken them. (The only hardwood that's worth it around here is red oak, ash, and locust -- and the locust is nothing near the fine-burning species found back east).
But, when compared to pine, I have found that the split hardwood, in our climate, seasons more quickly than split ordinary pine. When it's cut green, or dies for reasons other than beetle infestation, the gooey sap of the pine seems to retard water evaporation. 'Just my impression. Maybe I'm totally wrong?
Dexter
But, when compared to pine, I have found that the split hardwood, in our climate, seasons more quickly than split ordinary pine. When it's cut green, or dies for reasons other than beetle infestation, the gooey sap of the pine seems to retard water evaporation. 'Just my impression. Maybe I'm totally wrong?
Dexter
Hey Carbon, what do you mean Easteners don't burn Pine? They have fire-pits , illegal bonfires, and fire-pits etc., correct? All it's good for? WE know better! BTW, love the Sig., wish it were mine. Hey Dexter, I hear you on the "Pop", I yelled at my Dad for getting sideways of a split last week. When they go, they can really Pop! To let you know, I'm just on the other side of Berthoud Pass.
Hey Zap. Closeness of fires to me? I have a burn pit about 8' away from my stacks, not in use until the weather (winds) calm down a bit. Inside, I'm re-building the hearth, so that might take a few weeks(I hope not, 'cause I'll probably get my first snow in 3 weeks). Wildfires- haven't heard of any, but haven't had the TV on for a few days, nor seen any smoke. Am I missing something? Or... am I recieving some "chit"? That I like! :cheese:
Thanks for the update. That fire looks a wee bit north and east of me, so I'm good. I'm checking the news right now. The winds around here will be the biggest factor. Not sure when they'll abate, but has made my work easier to deal with the last week(splitting and stacking). Our RH is very low, so that will play a factor. But I admit to being jaded on wildfires. Around here, 1 acre gets front page news. I have a history(my younger days) of fighting wildland fires in Calif. Unless it hit 10K acres, didn't even get the blood pumping at that time. :roll:
I do have to say they're alot of remote homesteads and cabins in those areas. I hope they don't play hero, and count on their garden hoses to keep the beast at bay. That would be bad.
I cut not too far from Beetle Kill -- near a small town called Tabernash. But I live about 4 miles east of Boulder, and you can see the flames from here tonight. There is some beetle kill pine on the east side, but the west side of the Continental Divide has worse beetle kill.
Maybe this should go in the "Gear" section, for specialized fire fighting gear: The slurry bombers tonight appeared to include a P2V-4. These post Korea vintage piston powered aircraft are equipped with 2 Wright Turbo Compound 18 cylinder engines. For any motorheads out there: They are 3350 cu. in. each (that's about 55 liters), and can produce over 3,700 H.P. for take-off. Per Engine. The last flight over our house was at dusk, and you could see blue flames coming out of the stacks (which I remember from my childhood with DC-6s, and DC-7s). The sound they make is beautiful -- I mean, STUNNINGLY beautiful.
That's about the only thing I like about the fires.
Dexter
Maybe this should go in the "Gear" section, for specialized fire fighting gear: The slurry bombers tonight appeared to include a P2V-4. These post Korea vintage piston powered aircraft are equipped with 2 Wright Turbo Compound 18 cylinder engines. For any motorheads out there: They are 3350 cu. in. each (that's about 55 liters), and can produce over 3,700 H.P. for take-off. Per Engine. The last flight over our house was at dusk, and you could see blue flames coming out of the stacks (which I remember from my childhood with DC-6s, and DC-7s). The sound they make is beautiful -- I mean, STUNNINGLY beautiful.
That's about the only thing I like about the fires.
Dexter
Hey Dexter, PB4Y-J's, does that sound right? I'm going off of 20+ years memory on that one, but it seems correct. Air base manager @ Hollister, Ca. - Tabernash, I know it well. If you have a Skid-steer with a winch, I know where to get a lot of wood, limbed and down, free for the takin'. Glad you're not in the path, sounds like they want to draw the lines at the roads, so much for what's inside them, huh?
Yeah Beetle, it's a bad fire. 'Looks to march northward today.
I'm not certain which P2V is in use. It does appear to have the intermittant-use jets added outboard of the piston engines, but they seem not to be using them this time, even climbing out. I think they're carrying a light fuel load since they're so close to the fire. Not using the jets might shorten the turn around time, which was just over 30 minutes last night, from dump to dump! That's quick.
We have a mess of dead-standing we are clearing off of a family joint-held property. My brother and I particularly like to work the lumber in the Autumn. I'm 57 and he's 63, but it makes us feel like kids; we've been doing it since we were kids, but we had to hunt for dead trees in those days. 'Not so, anymore.
Dexter
I'm not certain which P2V is in use. It does appear to have the intermittant-use jets added outboard of the piston engines, but they seem not to be using them this time, even climbing out. I think they're carrying a light fuel load since they're so close to the fire. Not using the jets might shorten the turn around time, which was just over 30 minutes last night, from dump to dump! That's quick.
We have a mess of dead-standing we are clearing off of a family joint-held property. My brother and I particularly like to work the lumber in the Autumn. I'm 57 and he's 63, but it makes us feel like kids; we've been doing it since we were kids, but we had to hunt for dead trees in those days. 'Not so, anymore.
Dexter
- Status
Similar threads
