New User, Need Advice Please.

[buildersteve02]

Hello All,

This is my first post as i just joined. I am just getting into wood burning and have a question. Were having a Quadrafire 3100I installed this wednesday in our old masonary fireplace. I am wondering about a bottom block off plate, i talked to the dealer who said they normally do not install them because there is a block off plate at the top where the stainless liner exits the chimney and is capped off. He also said that when they plate at the bottom that it is not an actual plate but some type of non combustible or fireproof insulation in/around the damper to block it off. Is this okay/normal, or has anyone heard of this method and does it work okay? I also have the option to have an insulation blanket wrapped around the liner and was wondering if this was needed, the chimney is an outdoor chimney and it draws very well. Also how much wood is typically needed to burn during the winter months? Right now I have about 6 face cords of hickork, oak, and cherry mixed. I would appreciate any feedback from anyone, Thanks.

 

[fossil]

Howdy steve, and welcome to the forum. I'm not an insert guy, and I'm sure many with better knowledge/experience than I will chime in, but from what I've been able to glean from my participation here, a lower blockoff plate is an excellent idea. Do you want to heat the living space, or do you want to burn wood to heat the chimney? Not that drastic, of course, but you get my drift. Insulating the liner may or may not be required, but even if it's not, it seems like a good idea to me, if the insulation will fit around the liner in your chimney. The flue gases going up the liner have already been lost to you as a source of heat in the room. The cooler those gases become as they rise up toward the cap, the more likely you are to have creosote condensation in there (not a good thing). Insulating the liner will tend to minimize that problem. At least that's the way I understand it. Again, welcome. Rick

 

[Shane]

The best way for a block off plate is an actual sheetmetal one at the bottom. This is the "gold standard", the other method of stuffing insulation around the liner is acceptable in some jurisdictions, but the insulation can sag etc. and the seal can fail. The plate at the top is the worst of the three scenarios as your going to be constantly losing heat up that chimney. The masonry will absorb and disipate to the outside heat that could have went into your home. Now for the liner insulation... is it required? Depends on the listing of the liner. Look at the installation instructions for the liner, almost all are downloadable. It will say very clearly what the requirements are to be in compliance with the listing. The only liner I can think of that can be installed without insulation is Olympic foreverflex. I admit I've been out of the stove business for a year now so things do change. Whether or not it's required I'd recommend it on an outside chimney.

 

[buildersteve02]

Thank You for both of your replys. We just redid our hearth so it is up to code (previous one didnt extend far enough for insert) and we have some micore board left over from that, would it be possible to use the micore board for a block off plate?

 

[Shane]

Possible, but could be more headache than purchasing 20 bucks in sheet metal and doing it that way. Craig has a good tutorial for making a sheet metal blockoff plate.
https://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/articles/making_a_block_off_plate/

 

[stanleyjohn]

My installer used fireproof insulation to seal the bottom fireplace damper sides!Cheap and easy to do.Its up tp you how to do it!but i would have the bottom sealed as well as the top.

 

[RedRanger]

The best way for a block off plate is an actual sheetmetal one at the bottom. This is the "gold standard", the other method of stuffing insulation around the liner is acceptable in some jurisdictions, but the insulation can sag etc. and the seal can fail. The plate at the top is the worst of the three scenarios as your going to be constantly losing heat up that chimney. The masonry will absorb and disipate to the outside heat that could have went into your home. Now for the liner insulation... is it required? Depends on the listing of the liner. Look at the installation instructions for the liner, almost all are downloadable. It will say very clearly what the requirements are to be in compliance with the listing. The only liner I can think of that can be installed without insulation is Olympic foreverflex. I admit I've been out of the stove business for a year now so things do change. Whether or not it's required I'd recommend it on an outside chimney.

Now this is an example where it should be left up to the qualified installer. eg: our`s only has the block off plate at the top of the outside chimney, and no insulation. With the new insert we are almost cooked out of the rec-room in a matter of only 3 hours(temps by that time have reached 80+) and this is with the doorway fan trying it`s best to pump that hot air to the next level. Usually after 3 hours a window is opened slightly.

I will qualify by saying that we live in a moderate climate. the pacific north west where it doesn`t often go below -5C. Having stated the above, the last thing I would want is a lower block off plate. I like to burn hot and clean, and with an outside chimney, I do indeed want some heat to go there to cut down on the cresote. :coolgrin:

 

[eba1225]

Steve,

Most insert manufactures recommend a block off plate. I having just installed my insert last year did install a plate.

I presume that it has a dual purpose, 1 - provides an additional level of sealing of the chimney, 2 - provides added insulation from the chill of the chimney.

Granted they don't sound like much but I feel better knowing that I am sealing as much a possible.

Erik

 

[BrotherBart]

Most insert manufactures recommend a block off plate. I having just installed my insert last year did install a plate.

Erik, who are some of the insert manufacturers that recommend a block off plate with a full liner installed?

 

[eba1225]

I know that my Lopi has a statement that it is recommended to have the block off plate even if there is a full liner installation. Believe me I would not have spent the time doing it if it wasn't recommended, what a P.I.T.A. it was to do.

Erik

 

[Jags]

BuilderSteve - A block off plate could always be added later if you found that you needed one.

If Jags were installing this in his house: because you stated that it is an outside chimney, I would insulate the liner to help maintain high enough exhaust temps to thwart off the dreaded creosote monster. With that I would probably install the block off plate on the bottom as well. No use sending heat up the chimney to get sucked outside, but it would depend on your heat load as Sonny was pointing out.