OWB Question

I have a friend who has a propane fired boiler in her house and would like to switch to an OWB. I know nothing about OWB's so told her I'd ask you all.

What would be her best choice to switch?

Well, as far as hooking up an OWB to a propane heated boiler, they all would do it so that doesn't really matter. There are several good units out there to choose from. First off, does she have close neighbors or live in the middle of nowhere? Does make a difference.....smoke issue. The "gasser" OWB's use less wood than a conventional boiler, but take more time to prep wood for them to burn "correctly". The old conventional type will burn whatever wood you can get in the door. It is always better to burn the driest wood possible in either. As far as brands......Portage and Main seem to be liked by most of their owners, as well as Central Boiler, which is what I have. If "I" was going with a Gasser, I would probably buy the Portage and Main, which was almost my choice but I like to be able to throw large logs, cut offs, "uglies", giant knotty pieces.......and general clean up wood from my property so I have a Central Boiler 6048.......and LOVE it.
There are a couple of other sites that are more specific to the OWB crowd than here, so a little "Googling" will get you more answers to your question. I don't know if they would appreciate me posting links or not so...shoot me a PM if you would like them.
One thing for sure........on this site you will be "drilled" on why an OWB is junk and her only choice should be a 25k investment with an indoor gasser with several thousand gallons of storage

But you can buy outdoor gassifiers as well.

Umm...that would be stated in my response......

"One thing for sure........on this site you will be "drilled" on why an OWB is junk and her only choice should be a 25k investment with an indoor gasser with several thousand gallons of storage "
I haven't noticed that. It's not like an outdoor gassifer will be cheap either. I think they like gassifiers.

Some states have lists of approved owb's, like mine, NYS. I never realized that Portage and Main was Piney Mfg, which has a model, the Optimizer 250, on the list.
http://www.dec.ny.gov/chemical/73694.html . They have other rules too, about chimney height, distance from houses, etc. Anyway, and I'm not a boiler owner, if you were looking for a clean owb, that list might help.

Does she want to keep the propane boiler? If she has room, you might want to consider a pellet boiler, I installed one in a remote building, tying it into my oil boiler. However, if I had the room and easy access I would have considered just taking out the oil boiler and putting the pellet boiler. The pellet boiler works great, and I haven't bothered with adding storage.

I know several people that have the regular Heatmor OWB.

They seem to be happy with them. They have the 400 model. I think it holds around 50 cubic feet of wood. The only problem they claim is the hoses for the water cooled door can fail.

gg

$25,000? A "real" average is likely closer to half that but why split hairs? Ohh the evil OWB haters on this site. OWB owners are certainly being unfairly discriminated against. I smell future litigation, widespread protest, revolution. Perhaps even an "Occupy EPA" movement? Camp outside the capital building and burn deer carcasses and tires in protest. You have rights. Don't let "Big Wood" push you around. I think we should start calling gasser owners "one percenters" just so we can stay lock-step with current trends.


I hope someone laughs at that. It is Friday!

So it begins !!

wendall,
varna gave you a few names of some of the better manufacturers, and I'd add Empyre to his list. I owned a Pro Series 100 for one season and it was an awesome little machine(I bought it used). It was a bit undersized for my application, so I upgraded to a P&M 250. I think I'd urge her to purchase a gasser if she does go that route, but she needs to know that there is bi-weekly/monthly maintenance involved to insure optimum operation and efficiency, as well gathering well seasoned wood.
The pellet boiler suggestion by katman is a very good one if she isn't one for regular maintenance. I will probably go that route in another 15-20 years myself.

varna....... I.....ummm.....well, never mind. I'll be the observer this time around

YES IT DOES. Let me grab a cold soda

And a bag of popcorn....

First off, make sure that you look at the local, state and regional regulations regarding OWBs. Many states and regions restrict their use. For example, WA state has a ban on all OWBs, period. In Oregon you now have to get an EPA certified one (not just OWBs, it applies to all wood burning appliances). Almost all cities have some restrictions on OWBs.

Aside from that, we were very happy with my ex's classic Central Boiler (CB) system that I designed and installed. It is still in operation after 6 years of steady use. She lives in a rural area of the Coast Range in Oregon. The boiler was a retrofit for an electric hydronic floor heating system, and an electric/solar hot water system. Total cost was under $10,000, and the payback was last year (after 5 years of use). The benefits were also having a LOT warmer house in winter, so the real payback was probably after 3 years of use (if you compared the price of electric heat set to the temperatures we set the house at with the OWB). She has 100+ acres of trees, so the firewood was free. One drawback of a classic earlier style OWB is that they eat a lot of wood. We burned 8 to 10 cords a year in a mild winter climate area. However, the house is large and has tons of windows and skylights leaking heat like a sieve.

New EPA certified OWBs are going to run more money. They are basically cleaner burning outdoor wood gassifiers with a smaller boiler and water storage system as compared to a Tarn or Greenwood indoor gassifier system that requires a large water storage tank. CB has duel fuel OWBs, by the way, and you could install a newer EPA OWB that has a propane backup burner in it. Not to defeat the purpose of the OWB, but a rather large drawback to an OWB is that you have to load them with wood every day, typically twice a day, in order for them to work. If you have a backup propane heating system, you can go on vacation in the winter and keep the house from freezing.

I looked into many OWB companies before selecting Central Boiler. Many OWB companies have come and gone, and many have cheap or poorly designed systems. CB has good designed systems, they build them with good steel and good welds, and they last a long time. They make good on their warantees, and they have been around for a long time. They also have excellent technical support, and they speak English on the phone. They helped me design the system and size the flat plate Hx's correctly. I would say that the sizes were perfect for the application. If anything, I would say that the OWB was larger than what we needed, but that was the smallest one that they sold at that time. They still sell the classic systems, and in my book they are well built, they work well, and they hold up over time. They are also simple open/non-pressurized systems, and as such they are safe. I had several overfiring situations as a result of a faulty contol unit. During the few times that the system boiled over, it just did that. It boiled over and all the heat went with the steam out the vent, and that was it. No meltdown, no exploding pressure tanks, no flame outs, no damage or burned anything. I just topped the system up with water and restarted the boiler and it ran fine. I replaced the control unit under warantee, and they gave me another gallon of corrosion resitant stuff to add to the boiler water. All for free, all under warantee. CB sells the best corrosion resistant water addative that I could find as well. I would put one in my house here, but the new laws prevent me from installing a classic system in Oregon.

Oh, and no, they do not smoke much. No more smoke than what I get from my older pre EPA wood stove here, anyway. That befuddled me for a year after turning on the OWB. Where was all the smoke that was supposed to pour out of the OWB that the 'ALL OWB's ARE PURE EVIL' people rant and rave about in an endless steam? It was just not there. Burning 24/7, I could smell smoke now and then if the wind was right and I was outside. However, there was never any smoke or smell of smoke inside the house, ever. Most of the time there was no sign of smoke from the stack either. There was a brief puff of smoke when the damper opened for all of about a minute, and then that wafted away. In off mode and burn mode, narry any smoke was visible from the stack. But the legal system chooses to believe that all OWBs are evil, and so my first sentence in this post.

Thanks for most of the replies. I will pass them on.

GARN don't look back !

I think OWBs have their place. My recently-widowed mother uses one on her tree farm and while it smokes a fair amount (Heatmor burning very dry wood), it's minimal maintenance and all she has to do is keep it filled with wood to keep her old farmhouse nice and warm, emptying the ashes occasionally. There aren't any neighbors for about half a mile in any direction, she's basically in the middle of a forest, and she has an unlimited amount of free, dry wood (as long as I keep cutting it for her). I run a downdraft gasifier and while I love it, I'm glad she doesn't have to mess around with keeping a rig like that operating efficiently. It's a lot more work and experience than she's able to muster. If it sprung a leak today, I'd recommend that she replace it with something similar. Me, on the other hand, I'd get another gasifier.

Where I grew up there is a lot of old talyorway's and pre catilitic Mahoning's with six foot chimneys they just sit and smolder all day long.

Thanks, Eric and I'm certainly saddened by the news of the passing of your father. His book was certainly important when I began gathering wood.

Thanks, wendell. The book is selling pretty well after all these years, judging from the regular royalty checks, which keep increasing (obviously, we're not talking vast sums, here). I believe that now most of the sales are electronic, so really, the sky's the limit.