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Quadrafire Castile Experiment

Post in 'The Pellet Mill - Pellet and Multifuel Stoves' started by tjnamtiw, Nov 28, 2010.

  1. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    You are probably right seeing that there is no airflow through the last tube without springs and a 'moderate amount' with springs in the other tubes. If a spring was in there,..................... Hmmmm, maybe I'll move one over there just to see what happens. I shut it down for the night in the family room. The Castile is a lot easier to play with than the Sante Fe with that aggravating grill on the front. I'd just as soon leave it off since it restricts the flow, but the 'boss' says 'No way, Jose'......

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  2. B-Mod

    B-Mod Member

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    Boss? I have one of those at work, none at home, lol. (Crap here she comes again)

    I will get you those pics tomorrow when I shut the stove down. I did a cleaning on it today, and was then in a rush to get the stove back on to keep it toasty in here, only a high of 10 degrees here......
  3. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    No problem. Tomorrow's going to be 50!!!!!! Heat pump time again but below freezing every night for the next week so I'll use about a bag a day between the two stoves.
  4. thz123

    thz123 Member

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    Using springs in tubes 5 & 6, new meat thermometer, glove on hand, touching no metal. Castile running on medium. Using an all oak pellet (Fuel King pellets from Waterloo, Iowa). My name for them is "Rocket Fuel"! (Fuel King Pellets have been out of business for 2 years now, I happened to find 2 tons this year.)

    springs no springs
    210 200 degrees

    Using Indeck Brand Pellets, Ladysmith Wisconsin (I really don't like these - smoldering ash build up in firepot, a lot)
    springs no springs
    200 190 degrees

    It feels to me that the air is restricted a bit, except when running on low.
    My home made trubulator restricted air flow too.
    Thats my 2 cents worth.
  5. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    Nice start,thz123. It 'feels' like the air is restricted but my readings above show it is actually faster. I think, as b-mod said, it's because the air is swirling and maybe spreading out kinda like taking the choke out of a shotgun. I'll be interested when you put the rest of the springs in to see the readings. Too bad about the turbulator. I don't think we've given up on that one yet.

    I took the spring out of tube 2 and put it in the empty tube 10 to see what happens. It WAS 4.5 mph and with the spring, it went up to 5.0 mph, so there was a little improvement there.
  6. smalltown

    smalltown Minister of Fire

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    My only wish for the Castile Quad would be for the convection fan operation to be quieter. I was wondering after you install the springs is there any change in the noise level.

    P.S. I am not sure if all the noise is the actual combustion fan assembly running or the way Quad pushes the air through the tubes or a combination. Just imagine how great these stoves would be if we could quiet down these noises.
  7. jackiec

    jackiec Member

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    The number one reason I chose SantaFe/Castile Insert was because I found them to be the most quiet operating insert on the market. It could be that they are smaller than most others. I wonder if something is wrong with yours?
  8. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    I haven't noticed any increase in noise level with the springs inserted. Has anyone else? The Castile's cast front end sure doesn't help the issue since it partially blocks the passage of air. In fact, if I'm not 'forced to make it look pretty'......., I leave the door open to get better airflow.
  9. smalltown

    smalltown Minister of Fire

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    jackiec No nothing wrong here: no bearing noises etc. It's just the blowing of air noise I think. They are just so quiet before the convection blower kicks in that's all.
  10. YooperD2

    YooperD2 Member

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    On my Santa Fe the noise level stayed the same after I installed the springs. I also find these stoves are somewhat loud, like most forced air stoves.
  11. thz123

    thz123 Member

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    No added noise with the springs in. I also leave my cast door open for more heat, when the grand kids arn't around. I have a set of springs that are OD 1.25", that I will sell to someone at my cost plus shipping.
  12. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    Hope you can sell them for a reasonable % of what they cost you. Shipping should be minimal since they are already cut to length. They would fit in the small Priority Mail box, I think.
  13. G00k

    G00k Member

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    THZ123,

    How much you want for them? Shipping to Parkton, Maryland?


    And Merry Christmas to all y'all!


    G00k
  14. thz123

    thz123 Member

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    I paid $18 shipped to my house. I believe they will fit in the USPS priority box, and thats I think $4.95 to you. So a total of $22.95. Thats a deal because you won't have to cut them or turn the ends in, which I did with these using a torch. I have 8 of them cut to 9". Let me know. Its snowing here and the satilite may go out, we have a winter storm expecting 8+" . So if I don't get back to you quickly thats why.
  15. skidozer

    skidozer Member

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    I just found gold, I was in the back storage room at work and found some old turbulators.
    They are stainless about 3/4" wide and 8 feet long they were going to be thrown out today.
    going to measure the tube length and give them a try. I wish I had more spare time I have data loggers for up to 80 channels of thermocouples.
  16. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    Oh man, you lucky b^&^rd! The data logger would be the ticket for great information. Can't wait to see what you find out. Keep us posted, please.

    Things are still clicking along here. I just did the B-Mod mod :cheese: to my Castile to keep the blower on high no matter what the feed rate is. It worked good over nite and didn't use nearly as many pellets to keep the room at temp even though the temp outside is COLD and windy.
  17. skidozer

    skidozer Member

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    where do I find info on the B-MOD?

    Im going to cut one up at lunch time and see how they fit.
  18. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    B-Mod's a regular on here. He has an older Sante Fe. I posted this on another thread that explains what I did. >>>

    Yesterday I finally got around to making the small modification that B-Mod has been talking about in several posts. That is, he rewired the stove (Sante Fe) so that there was always 110 volts going to the #1 snap disk, which controls the convection blower. One complaint I have with the stoves is that on low (especially) and medium feed rates, the blower is just too darn slow and a lot of heat isn’t getting transfered to the tubing. Now, with the convection blower on high, I am blowing a lot of air strongly out no matter what the feed rate is. I am able to heat the same room on medium that I was on high. Another side effect is that on medium the combustion blower slows down and gives the combustion air more time to transfer heat to the tubing rather than blowing it out the exhaust. With the air moving faster inside the tubes (with my installed spring mod), I am, I believe, sucking more heat out of the tubes and creating a larger delta T across the tube/combustion air interface and more heat transfer.
    All of this will have to be measured when I get a chance.

    For those like Foos, who are having problems cutting back on the feed rate, this presents a solution. Since I’m on medium, my feed rate is reduced to a more reasonable level. For Foos, this might bring his feed rate down to where he has a ‘normal’ flame height and no build up of pellets.

    Since on my Castile insert and the Sante Fe the only 110 volt feed wire that is fused is the one going to snap disk #3, this is where I had to get my power. The gauge of the wire going to the snap disc and the wire originally feeding snap disk #1 is the same. I found the FEED side of the wire going to snap #3 and made up a harness that would plug into that feed wire after disconnecting it from the snap disk. The other end is a Y that connects back to snap disk #3 and to the FEED side of snap disk #1. The wire I removed from snap disk #1 is tapped off and left to hang in the stove. By tapping the power BEFORE the snap disk #3, I am not altering the function of or bypassing its very important function of shutting down the stove in the event of a drop chute fire.
    DexterDay likes this.
  19. G00k

    G00k Member

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    You DID take pictures of it, didn't you? This sounds like a logic mod to make. I hope it does everything you want it to. Keep us posted, please.
  20. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    You have a Castile too so you know where snap disc #3 is. %-P No way in heck can I get a picture of that! I should have taken pictures of the springs in the tubes. Did you do that mod? I also relocated snap disc #1 from low on the side to the top front corner of the side so it senses the 110 degrees quicker and turns on the fan. I'll have to take pictures of those two things and post.
  21. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    Here are pictures of my Castile with my springs in the heater tubes and with one view where I pulled the spring part way out so you can see what it looks like. Also you can see how I bent the end for a better grip with a pair of pliers. That way I can twist them into the tubes. You can see if you look closely that the ends of the tubes are tapered and don't quite touch the first part of the spring.
    The last picture shows a side view of the firebox. You can see that I moved and replaced snap disc #1 with an adjustable version as suggested by B-Mod. Also you can see that I have run a 110 volt line directly to it rather than the variable voltage line that is seen taped off.

    Attached Files:

  22. skidozer

    skidozer Member

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    I got the turbulators installed last night.
    I did not get a chance to do any scientific measurements with the snow we got, I was out on snow removal duties.

    The most notible thing I noticed is it is now much warmer in the perimiters of the room.
    I have the stove in a 20 by 24 room with a short cathideral ceiling. I have a window on the far side of the room with a indoor outdoor thermometer, I used to see about a 4 0r 5 deg diff between that reading(its by a window) and one I have in the center of the room. Last night it was cold 12f and that therm was only 1 deg different.

    The room also seemed to come to temp a bit quicker than before from 60 to 68.

    I took a couple pics like the ones above of the springs, I will try to post them later.
  23. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    Well, that sure sounds encouraging!!! It has got to be a step in the right direction. Can't wait for some more data.
  24. thz123

    thz123 Member

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    Hey tjnamtiw, I would like to complete B-mods modification, based on your description, however I am not electrically inclined and I didn't follow your explaination about how to wire it so the fan is on high constantly. Can you help with a easier description? Maybe a better picture?Thanks again for all your help, Tom
  25. tjnamtiw

    tjnamtiw Minister of Fire

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    If you're not electrically inclined, then you probably don't have crimpers for wire terminators, a voltmeter or the parts either. I am trying to be nice :red: but maybe you shouldn't do it..... If you have a friend who has the tools, get him to make up a Y harness from 20 gauge wire for you with a female spade connector at each end and about 24" long. Out of one end also crimp in a short length of wire about 6" long and put a male spade terminal on it.
    Now you've got to reach around behind the stove and (OH, UNPLUG THE STOVE!!!!!!) find snap disc #3 and pull off both connectors. Bring them around front so you can measure the voltage. Plug the stove back in but don't turn it on that it calls for heat. Connect one end of the voltmeter to the frame of the stove anywhere and with the other voltmeter lead find out which of the snap disc #3 terminals has 110 volts. Label it with a piece of tape. Plug the male spade lug on your new wiring harness you made up into that female end. Then take the female end on your new harness that is near the male end you just used and attach it to snap disc #3. Plug the other connector of the original leads onto the other terminal of the snap disc.
    Now go to snap disc #1 and do the same thing to find out which wire has 110 volts going to it. Since this one is a normally open contact, you can just probe the two sides of the snap disc. Unplug the stove and remove the wire that had the 110 volts and tape it up securely. You won't use it. Connect the other end of the new wiring harness that is 24" from the other end to the open terminal on snap disc #1. You're done. Plug it back in and hope it doesn't smoke!!!!!

    I'm no lawyer but I have to say that you do this ALL AT YOUR OWN RISK! I CANNOT CONTROL WHAT YOU DO OR HOW YOU DO IT! %-P

    Now you see why a picture would not tell the story.

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