Replacing damper in traditional fireplace

[jharkin]

Hi Folks.... Question for the chimney experts on a traditional open fireplace.


So here is the deal, my MIL just retired and bought a new condo down the road from us to be near her grandchildren. This condo is a mid-80s build and has a traditional full masonry chimney and open fireplace. The previous owner had the fireplace tiled in and put in a pellet stove with the pellet flue pipe running up the chimney (never heard of that?). I had suggested to her that during the home inspection she have this looked at closely and check the install permits. Doesnt seem to be any record of permits but the seller did produce an inspection report from the installing chimney company.. Hmmm fishy as in my town any install requires a final inspection by the FD not the installer.

Anyway thats irrelevant as my MIL does not want the pellet stove and had it ripped out and wants to use the open fireplace. (she has no interest at all in heating this is just ambiance). After she had a contractor rip it out I was able to get over there and take a look. See the photos below.

- First off it looks like they did a crappy job cleaning it out before the pellet install, the smoke chamber particularly is a mess. But I can sort that out with the sooteater and a lot of brushing.

- It looks like the damper plate was removed to make space for the pipe. In fact I think it was removed a long time ago as there is a bracket for one of those chimney cap type dampers. The bracket that would hold the damper operating rod is broken off, but appears I can unscrew the remainder and put in a new one.
Questions :
Can you guys see an reason I cant just get a new damper plate and control handle assembly?
Do shops like Woodsmans carry there parts?

- Its probably impossible to tell from the pictures but the condition of the masonry seems generally decent. It looks like one of the firebricks between the lintel and the front edge of the iron damper housing spalled but its not completely fallen out. The rest of the firebox brick looks good and looking up the flue iwth a strong flashlight the clay tiles look intact all the way up as best I can tell. I'll probably suggest to her to have it evaluated by a sweep for piece of mind but I also know when we bought our place and I did that the sweep only looked up with a flashlight - nothing I cant do myself- so Id value you guys input here onthings to look out for.

 

[jharkin]

 

[webby3650]

You would be better off installing a lock-top damper. It is best in the long run.
You will also have trouble finding that damper plate and the hardware for it. It's just more trouble than its worth considering a lock-top is much more efficient and readily available.

 

[jharkin]

You would be better off installing a lock-top damper. It is best in the long run.
You will also have trouble finding that damper plate and the hardware for it. It's just more trouble than its worth considering a lock-top is much more efficient and readily available.

The contractor who ripped out the pellet stove for her recommended the same. Concern she has is right now there is a strong creosote smell in the condo from the wide open flue - would that be an ongoing issue with the top lock?

 

[webby3650]

Doubt it.
The lock top wil prevent the downdraft that is creating the smell. You could cap it off temporarily to see if stops.

 

[bholler]

i agree go with a top sealer between that and having it properly cleaned the smell should go away. I would recommend having the flue scanned with a camera for piece of mind

 

[jharkin]

Thanks all, I passed the advice along to my MIL and she is of course insisting that it doesn't need to be cleaned because the seller "told her it was inspected before sale"

I tried to explain that is obviously a lie as I can see with my own eyes its dirty... but you know how it goes talking to mother in laws

 

[Heatsource]

Thanks all, I passed the advice along to my MIL and she is of course insisting that it doesn't need to be cleaned because the seller "told her it was inspected before sale"

I tried to explain that is obviously a lie as I can see with my own eyes its dirty... but you know how it goes talking to mother in laws

yeah but look at how clean the tiles look in pic 3, almost look shiny new except for a little section...(maybe glazed creosote/ but doubt it..)

 

[webby3650]

yeah but look at how clean the tiles look in pic 3, almost look shiny new except for a little section...(maybe glazed creosote/ but doubt it..)

I often see fireplace flues that are pretty clean but the smoke chamber will be nasty. Often they are not parged and stuff just stacks up on those rough surfaces. I also see many times a sweep will not bother cleaning the smoke chamber or behind the damper. I'm not surprised to see it.

 

[bholler]

I often see fireplace flues that are pretty clean but the smoke chamber will be nasty. Often they are not parged and stuff just stacks up on those rough surfaces. I also see many times a sweep will not bother cleaning the smoke chamber or behind the damper. I'm not surprised to see it.

I absolutely agree with all of that and would add that it does not look like there is a cap either and many times rain will wash down the flue but will not do so in the smoke chamber.

 

[jharkin]

Yes, the tiles are pretty clean but the smoke chamber is nasty. I could see lots of glazed creosote in there.... Which is why I suspected they didn't do much of clean before installing the pellet pipe.

 

[madison]

http://www.woodlanddirect.com/Chimney/Top-Sealing-Chimney-Dampers/Seal-Tight-Chimney-Top-Damper

 

[Ashful]

Damn, Jeremy... If you had spoken up sooner, I'd have had a topper for 8" ID flue, that I could've sent you!

The chimney top flues do work nice. I only removed mine to replace with stainless mesh after the squirrel incident of early 2012.

Get MIL used to the idea that she'll want that flue swept EVERY year, for purposes of inspection and reducing summer odor. That will get her in the right mindset for having someone come out and look at it this year. Maybe they can do the top damper install with the inspection.

 

[Heatsource]

I often see fireplace flues that are pretty clean but the smoke chamber will be nasty. Often they are not parged and stuff just stacks up on those rough surfaces. I also see many times a sweep will not bother cleaning the smoke chamber or behind the damper. I'm not surprised to see it.

I know alot of guys dont bother cleaning the smoke shelf and they say the vertical walls of the chimney are where an intense chimney fire happens/ or that the top of the shelf doesn't get hot enough to light a chimney fire
i say they are just being lazy

 

[webby3650]

I know alot of guys dont bother cleaning the smoke shelf and they say the vertical walls of the chimney are where an intense chimney fire happens/ or that the top of the shelf doesn't get hot enough to light a chimney fire
i say they are just being lazy

Regardless, they were hired to clean the fireplace and the flue. So ya, its lazy alright!

 

[BrotherBart]

Worst chimney fire I ever saw was at a co-workers house when the sweep hadn't been cleaning out the smoke shelf. The stuff lit off in that slammer install and all hell broke loose. With my slammer I scooped a LOT of the stuff out of the smoke shelf after every season. Most of them have a space behind the top bricks in the firebox where people don't realize that it collects. By the gallon when you sweep the chimney.