1. Welcome Hearth.com Guests and Visitors - Please enjoy our forums!
    Hearth.com GOLD Sponsors who help bring the site content to you:
    Hearthstone Soapstone and Cast-Iron stoves( Wood, Gas or Pellet Stoves and Inserts)

RIFENG MANIFOLD

Post in 'The Boiler Room - Wood Boilers and Furnaces' started by 91LMS, Dec 7, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    has anyone used a rifeng manifold with their radiant heat? i bought a 6 port manifold and seems that i overlooked that they say it only works with pex-al-pex. this could be a problem where i have already pulled in just o2 barrier pex in my floor. i dont know the differance between the two and if there would be a connection issue. i have seen that the pex-al-pex will not work with sharkbite fittings where pex will.

    Helpful Sponsor Ads!





  2. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    no one has had an issue or experience in the differance between standard o2 pex and pex-al-pex???
  3. stee6043

    stee6043 Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2008
    Messages:
    2,384
    Loc:
    West Michigan
    I've never heard of the manifold you mention above. I do, however, have experience with Pex-AL-Pex. I can assure you that it is not compatible with standard pex fittings including sharkbites. This type of pex has a layer of aluminum sheeting inside the tubing. Hence the "-AL-".

    You could always convert from the -AL to standard pex (or copper, or black pipe) with a variety of fittings but I personally would not want to gum up my own system with such a conversion. Can you return your manifold?
  4. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    when ordering the manifold the connection fitting part numbers are selected depending on the type tubing that is used. they are compatible with either types of tubing.
  5. HeatFarmer

    HeatFarmer Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2011
    Messages:
    144
    Loc:
    Montville, Maine
    I have 2 of these manifolds. They install very easy. You simply select a different connection to the manifold. I bought 1/2" pex fittings which fit the manifold on Ebay for 1/2 the price of anywhere else. Now if only they came with better instructions for balancing & purging.....
  6. afblue

    afblue Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2009
    Messages:
    278
    Loc:
    Buffalo, NY
    They make both Pex and Pex AL Pex compression fittings for them. I have a 10 Port Riefing manifold with 5 Pex-Al-Pex, 3 barrier pex, and 2 more to be used as Barrier. I had to buy a set of Pex AL Pex compression fittings for mine. The difference is the center "nipple" of the compression setup on Pex AL Pex has rubber O rings. barrier Pex is just metal ribs. The Pex AL Pex needs the rubber O rings because the compression collars cannot compress the Aluminum layer to seal reliably.

    http://www.pexsupply.com/Rifeng-MA-50PAP-1-2-PEX-AL-PEX-to-EK20-Loop-Fitting-Assembly

    http://www.pexsupply.com/Rifeng-MA-50P-1-2-PEX-to-EK20-Loop-Fitting-Assembly
  7. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    do you guys use the actuators for your zones or circ pumps?
  8. afblue

    afblue Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2009
    Messages:
    278
    Loc:
    Buffalo, NY
    I used 2 wire actuators from Blue ridge company because I am using the manifold for multi zone applications. Are you using all the 6 ports together for one radiant system, or for individual zones that you want to control separate?
  9. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    3 zones off my 6 port manifold. i am thinking the only way to do this is to use the actuators. just didnt want to get locked into something that i had to mail order if i had one go bad. maybe a spare on hand will be a good idea.
  10. afblue

    afblue Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2009
    Messages:
    278
    Loc:
    Buffalo, NY
    I ended up finding out that a single Grundfos Alpha to circulate all the water in you zone loops, the actuators to control each pair of ports for the zones, and a Taco Zone Relay control is the optimal setup of components and controlability.
  11. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    thanks afblue, that was precisely my game plan for my radiant plumbing. was going to turn towards a grunfoss variably circ to move the water from my wood boiler to my fossil boiler.
  12. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    finally got the manifold and pex all piped in. plans to cut into the fossil boiler this week and make provisions for the wood boiler while i am drained down. the instructions for the manifold are like brail but after second guessing myself for a couple days, it appears i have my supply and returns hooked up backwards. my thoughts were that the flow gauges would be on the return side but i am mistaken????? easy fix though, i think i can swap the manifold tubes top to bottom and all should be good.....

    Attached Files:

  13. DaBackBurner

    DaBackBurner Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2010
    Messages:
    84
    Loc:
    UP Michigan
    Are you 'pushing' into the mixing valve? I believe you should be 'pulling' through the mixing valve to get proper mixing. Maybe I'm viewing this incorrectly and need another cup of coffee.
  14. DaBackBurner

    DaBackBurner Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2010
    Messages:
    84
    Loc:
    UP Michigan
    Ok half a cup down and either I'm missing something or you should move your pump to the right side of the mixing valve between it and the manifold, to pull through the mixing valve. Otherwise improper, possibly no mixing, or improper flow through your loops will occur. Maybe it's just one of those days and I need to take a break from the computer and go split some wood though.
  15. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    you are making the correct observation i am in fact pushing through the mixing valve. wouldnt it work either way though with return water having flow back out of the manifold?
  16. DaBackBurner

    DaBackBurner Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2010
    Messages:
    84
    Loc:
    UP Michigan
    If you are pushing into a mixing valve you would need another pump to pull on the other side. Water will take the least resistive path...if your mixing valve is open all the way say, most of the water will want to bypass the manifold hence lower flow into your loops if it is closed most of the water will want to flow through the manifold and return without mixing. Your mixing valve will act more like a diverting valve the way you presently have it rather than a mixing valve thus creating varying flows into your loops rather than a mixing valve where flows in your loops will be fixed with varying temps. Hope that helps explain it.
  17. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    after thinking about it, i can see where i have gone wrong.... now to take half a days work, chuck it out the window and figure how to make it work.... if i put the pump, pushing towards the manifold, and find a place to put my mixing valve(basically where the pump is now), that should be the correct way? its not the tubing i am worried about but the damn fittings might as well be made of gold!
  18. DaBackBurner

    DaBackBurner Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2010
    Messages:
    84
    Loc:
    UP Michigan
    Yeah I know it is a PITA but you will be happier when it works correctly. I don't know for sure but it looks as though you have room to the right of your mixing valve to put your pump with flow into the manifold, I wouldn't change your pex lines around unless it would inhibit your design parameters of where the hottest water needed to go first...yes it will be horizontal but there are many pumps installed this way with no ill effects. Either put the pump on the supply side like that or put it between the 'T' and the manifold pumping away from the manifold (the return side) and your pump will experience lower water temps which is always a good thing too. Sorry to ruin your day, just would hate for you to have a system not work like you thought.
  19. DaBackBurner

    DaBackBurner Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2010
    Messages:
    84
    Loc:
    UP Michigan
    I took a peek at the pixture again...you don't have the 'depth' between the copper and the pex to install the pump do you?
  20. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    the copper is actually about 4 inches off the wall. so my plan is to put the pump where the tekmar valve is. put a ball valve where i cut the top pump flang pipe off, extend that pipe to the tekmar valve further down where there is more room for the valve before the 90 behind where the pump will be relocated and the put a 90 on the pipe i have t'd off the return side of the manifold for my mix side of the valve. wont look as odd but it will all fit and like you said will actually work correctly. this will be the least intrusive labor and cost wise, wish i was smarter from the get go. i really appreciate the heads up and help.
  21. SmokeEater

    SmokeEater Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2011
    Messages:
    331
    Loc:
    Northeastern NY
    In physics a push or a pull is a force. I'd say it doesn't usually matter where the pump is in the circuit. Looking at your mixing and manifold board what I would do is to put a spring check valve in your plumbing. If the pump is on the hot side and pushing toward the supply manifold, then a check valve should be placed so that it checks the possible reverse flow through the cold input to the Tekmar. Put a second check valve(swing check) in the horizontal line between the supply manifold and the input T from the Tekmar. Maybe it's too late at night and I can't understand the plumbing but that would be an easy fix.
  22. RobC

    RobC Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2009
    Messages:
    531
    Loc:
    Foxboro MA
    Re: Position of pump. It's the position of the motor that is important. You want it on it's side just the way you have it now, regardless of whole units orientation. The motor shaft has to sit on the bearings so motor has to be parallel to floor.
    If you can put it on the return side all the better too. If you do that you may need a check valve on the supply side.
  23. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    grunfoss says it doesnt matter which way the pump is installed. i have taco pumps that have been mounted vertically for 20+ years with no failures in my baseboard system. i does make sense to me now that if my pump were to be after the tekmar mixing valve that it could pull both hot input and the mix leg through the valve at the same time as opposed to my pump pushing hot supply water through the valve that would want to bypass the radiant loops and just return to the boiler via the cold port in the valve. i plan to fix this tonight so i want to make sure its correct.
  24. huffdawg

    huffdawg Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2009
    Messages:
    1,081
    Loc:
    British Columbia Canada
    it does matter which way its installed. the pumps axle should stay horizontal. The grundfoss comes with a piece of paper denoting pump orientation . there are three sketches of which way it can be orientated 2 with check marks and 1 with an X. the x has it with the pump shaft vertical
    Go to this link and scroll down to page 22

    http://www.us.grundfos.com/web/download.nsf/Pages/DB9E15987978351F88256C4E006EA652/$File/L-UP-PG-001.pdf
  25. 91LMS

    91LMS Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2011
    Messages:
    217
    Loc:
    MAINE
    ahh, i see what you are saying now. i would have only thought to mount the pump in that fashion anyways. the pump motor will not change and the housing will be now mounted horizontally. just will have to reindex the pump in the house after i get it mounted.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page