Strong smoke smell filling the room - bad install?

Post in 'The Pellet Mill - Pellet and Multifuel Stoves' started by IowaMaineiac, Nov 6, 2012.

  1. IowaMaineiac

    IowaMaineiac
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2012
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Loc:
    Des Moines, IA
    I have a St. Croix Afton Bay stove installed in my walk out basement. The installers vented it direct to the outside and just capped it off with no rise.

    When we use the stove we sometimes get a strong smoke smell (but no visible smoke) in the room. I'm wondering if the install could be affecting this? I'm considering modifying the exhaust so it has a vertical rise on the outside before it is capped off. I've included a couple pictures so you guys can see what I'm talking about.
     

    Attached Files:

    Collapse Signature Expand Signature

    Helpful Sponsor Ads!





  2. Chain

    Chain
    Expand Collapse
    Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2009
    Messages:
    285
    Likes Received:
    25
    Loc:
    Lewis County, New York (upstate)
    I'd check the nipple on the back and make sure it's a tight fit into your venting first. Secondly do the smoke test by turning off your lights and shine a flashlight back there. If you see smoke around the nipple, I'd put some exhaust calk around the nipple and then cover with some high heat foil. If it continues, I'd go with your idea of putting a rise where the vent comes out of your wall. Looking at the photo, it would appear that you could easily get a back draft given it's so low to the ground and depending upon what direction the air outside swirls around in that spot, the smoke simply may not be able to rise up and away from your house and only has one way to go, back into your house. Does the stove burn fairly efficiently? Lazy flame?
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  3. Chain

    Chain
    Expand Collapse
    Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2009
    Messages:
    285
    Likes Received:
    25
    Loc:
    Lewis County, New York (upstate)
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  4. Bioburner

    Bioburner
    Expand Collapse
    Moderator
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2012
    Messages:
    6,678
    Likes Received:
    1,344
    Loc:
    West central Mn
    I would suspect some exaust getting back through your thimble because of the termination being so close, wind direction can enhance the problem.IMO
    Good luck
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  5. TheMightyMoe

    TheMightyMoe
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    596
    Likes Received:
    138
    Loc:
    Fairbanks, Alaska.
    For starters, you need to put it another foot away from the wall, dig a hole where it is ejecting to be one foot away from ground, pull up all the vegetation, and then salt the earth to make sure the combustibles don't come back.

    Per manual.

    But seriously, I would add a foot then put your cap on. Your install appears wrong per the install manual off their website.

    Use high temperature RTV caulk OR foil tape on all your pipe venting connections. To ensure nothing is leaking out your pipe.

    Silicone all around the pipe going through the thimble.

    Make sure your stove adapter is caulked as well.

    Depending on where that exhausts, I would try a cap that vents horizontally, right now it is hitting the ground and being pushed in all directions.

    One way to find out if smoke is leaking into house, turn it on get a small fire going, unplug the unit, it will then smoke up inside the unit, once you have a bit of smoke, turn off the lights, use a flash light, plug the unit, and keep an eye on your pipe exiting the home. The smoke if it is leaking, will leak out there.

    Good luck!




    afton bay install.JPG
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    P38X2 and smoke show like this.
  6. smoke show

    smoke show
    Expand Collapse
    Guest

    Looks like trouble to me.
     
  7. SmokeyTheBear

    SmokeyTheBear
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    13,363
    Likes Received:
    1,662
    Loc:
    Standish, ME
    Can you snap a few more pictures like one of the entire wall the stove vents through on the outside and a close up of the vent thimble on the outside.

    The thimble needs to have silicone sealant around the vent where it exits the thimble and around the outside square plate of the thimble.

    The first picture is to see how close any windows or doors might be. While the requirements are one set of numbers it is possible that normal air infiltration around windows and such can result in the smell coming into the room.

    The likely spot in your vent system for smoke leakage would be at the stove adapter.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    jlupi likes this.
  8. kinsmanstoves

    kinsmanstoves
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2007
    Messages:
    3,466
    Likes Received:
    495
    Loc:
    Ravenna, Ohio 44266
    WTF is that? A cap right to the back of the stove. PLEASE do not run it.

    Eric
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  9. bbfarm

    bbfarm
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2012
    Messages:
    708
    Likes Received:
    91
    Loc:
    wisconsin
    I agree, much to close to the ground and foundation of your house and not far enough out.

    I see you do not have an OAK hooked up to your stove either.

    Why is the ground so black under your exhaust pipe?

    I can take a photo of ours and post tonight when I get home if it will help, but the diagram Moe posted it spot on!
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  10. bbfarm

    bbfarm
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2012
    Messages:
    708
    Likes Received:
    91
    Loc:
    wisconsin
    your stove looks so close to the wall also, every time you need to get in the back for routine maint. you will have to disconnect your exhaust. they didn't leave you much room.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  11. IowaMaineiac

    IowaMaineiac
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2012
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Loc:
    Des Moines, IA
    Thanks for all the comments and advice.

    This is my first stove ever so I didn't think to question the installers from the dealer when they put it in.

    I do have it on a surge protector at least :).

    I know there is silicone around the thimble because I watched them do that part. I can snap some more pictures when I get home if its not too dark yet. There are no windows close to the exhaust but there is a sliding glass door 3 feet west of it. The ground is black from the stove exhaust. Should there not be that much ash coming out?

    I wouldn't classify the flame as lazy. It burns steady with no visible smoke on the flame tips. I do get black on the brick and some in the corner of the glass but I assumed that was normal.

    I will check that nipple with a flashlight the next time I light it.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  12. kinsmanstoves

    kinsmanstoves
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2007
    Messages:
    3,466
    Likes Received:
    495
    Loc:
    Ravenna, Ohio 44266
    Do not light that stove.

    Eric
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  13. briansol

    briansol
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,913
    Likes Received:
    293
    Loc:
    central ct
    Call the dealer and complain about that install immediately. They should remedy that asap and fire/repreimand those who did that shoddy install. Did you not get a building permit and have it inspected? The town would easily reject that here.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  14. WoodPorn

    WoodPorn
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,501
    Likes Received:
    219
    Loc:
    South of the beloved Patriots
    That is going to cause a fire outside.

    Like Kinsmanstoves said "do not light that stove"
    Edit: They did not even clean up the brick under the thimble
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  15. Don2222

    Don2222
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2010
    Messages:
    7,718
    Likes Received:
    446
    Loc:
    Salem NH
    Hello

    Put in the recommended 3' vertical rise inside the house and you will not have that problem!
    Vertical rise on the outside of the house is still better but it will soot up faster than inside of the house.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  16. kinsmanstoves

    kinsmanstoves
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2007
    Messages:
    3,466
    Likes Received:
    495
    Loc:
    Ravenna, Ohio 44266
    Hello, Where is your adapter, 3"x12", tee, 3"x36", and 90? I see the cap and it is directly connected to the stove.
    DO NOT LIGHT THAT STOVE!

    You will die!!!!!!
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  17. IowaMaineiac

    IowaMaineiac
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2012
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Loc:
    Des Moines, IA
    I live in the country outside the city limits so a permit/inspection isn't required for this type of thing.

    The wall is poured concrete approx 8" thick so there is a short piece of pipe connecting the stove to the cap but it does appear the connection between pipe and cap is inside the thimble.

    The concrete is already tore up so I'm going to have to put the tee and vertical rise outside.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  18. kinsmanstoves

    kinsmanstoves
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2007
    Messages:
    3,466
    Likes Received:
    495
    Loc:
    Ravenna, Ohio 44266

    That is a Dura Vent 3PVP-HRC cap. The back of the stove has to have a 3pvp-ad (adapter) and then a pipe going through the wall. The cap has to be 12"-18" past the wall and has to be 18"+ above grade. A vertical rise is an option. That stove is not burning correctly with that amount of black ash. I would have that dealer out there asap. Do not run that stove until your venting issue is corrected.

    Eric
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    SmokeyTheBear likes this.
  19. SmokeyTheBear

    SmokeyTheBear
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2008
    Messages:
    13,363
    Likes Received:
    1,662
    Loc:
    Standish, ME
    Now, now, Eric that stove was installed by a professional (stove shop hired guy) it must be just fine (bear waits for the skillet upside the head) as we know they never make mistakes.

    Don't forget that 3' away sliding glass door, it is too close if that distance is to the part that moves.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
    kinsmanstoves likes this.
  20. fedtime

    fedtime
    Expand Collapse
    Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2009
    Messages:
    170
    Likes Received:
    8
    Loc:
    Down East Canada
    Here in Nova Scotia Canada, a 5' vertical rise is required due to concerns about draft and smoke, particularly in the event of a power outage. I installed a stove myself and had it certified by both a WETT inspector and the local building inspector - 2' of rise inside the house, 3' on the outside.
     
  21. P38X2

    P38X2
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2012
    Messages:
    1,670
    Likes Received:
    402
    Loc:
    Jaffrey, NH
    Not to be disrespectful but, HELLOOOOOO!!!!????? I understand this is your first pellet stove but you gotta be able to see a red flag like that when you see it.

    That is such blatant installer incompetence!

    As others said, DON'T LIGHT THAT STOVE til you fix it.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  22. P38X2

    P38X2
    Expand Collapse
    Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2012
    Messages:
    1,670
    Likes Received:
    402
    Loc:
    Jaffrey, NH
    You gotta get rid of those shrubberies too, if that's what those are. Perhaps that's what Joe Hack was trying to preserve with that silly termination.
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  23. thedak

    thedak
    Expand Collapse
    Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2011
    Messages:
    119
    Likes Received:
    10
    Loc:
    Smoke em if u got em'
    Nice.......
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  24. IowaMaineiac

    IowaMaineiac
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2012
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Loc:
    Des Moines, IA
    It is on the stationary side of the door so that part is ok.

    I'm sorry, I figured that there would be ash or soot coming from a stove exhaust so I didn't think the black stuff was a huge deal. I didn't like the fact that it was staining the ground but I figured that was more an issue of distance from the ground rather than an issue with the stove...
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature
  25. IowaMaineiac

    IowaMaineiac
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 5, 2012
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    Loc:
    Des Moines, IA
    Oh, and its a raspberry bush you're seeing in the picture.

    And yes I saw the quote warning me to NOT LIGHT IT OR I WILL DIE!!!!!!

    I suppose its a good thing I'm not dead after running it for the past 2 weeks, eh?
     
    Collapse Signature Expand Signature

Share This Page

Entire Site copyright © 1995-2016 - email to webinfo@hearth.com
Hearth.com and HearthNet are property and trademarks of Hearth.com LLC Advertising Information