Tech Issue with BOSCA Soul 500 insert - need help/opinion

[RiddleMasterMorgon]

For the more technically versed - I need some help, would appreciate response/opinion:

Yesterday during filling the hopper with new pellets my stove made a load klack/bang noise and went entirely silent (I was not there, but so my wife says). WHen I tried to restart, nothing happened, no on light at all - so I figured either a thermodisk snapped (although weird) or a fuse had blown or my fuse in the basement tripped. Sure enough, after some looking around where actually the stupid electronic panel is in this thing I found a blown 5A/125 V fuse right on the e board.

So, got to town today, got a new fuse, replaced and fired up the stove again - what a relief, system seemed to work again.

However, now I have no control over the auger anymore and it is apparently delivering on max speed (or the equivalent of the max feeding rate). Unfortunatly, it does so at medium fan speed (so the usual coupling of auger speed/feed rate with fan speed seems to be broken as well) and the stove gets superhot in no time. Art first I was joking and liked the new heat output at 1/5 setting, but then the surface of the stove got so hot that actually water would start boiling off the top surface (puzzling enough though, no thermodisk is tripping so far or if so, it has no effect anymore).

Is it safe to assume that my electronics board is fried ? What would cause a 5 A (thats a lot of juice !) fuse to blow on an electronic board in the first place ? During my inspection I found no excessive dust on the motors or inside the stove at all - so I dont think any motor had to work harder than usual and would draw so much amps...can a power surge do this ?

I am a bit puzzled what happened and why. I called the dealer since the BOSCA has some great warranty that should cover all this nonesense, but now they tell me I have to pay for the labor and BOSCA only pays for parts (although Warranty clearly states BOSCA is paying for labor and parts for 2-7 years, parts dependant).

Any input would be much appreciated !

 

[jtakeman]

Do you have it on a surge supressor?

Yes, A power surge can do that. But before the fuse blew it toasted something. Most likely the triac that controls the auger. The fuse isn't designed to protect from surges, Just internal shorts and even then it could let things get cooked before it blows.

Does the auger cycle on off or just stay full tilt on run. No stops in between?

I would think it will get hot enough to trip the high limit. But it could be hours before it happens. Doesn't sound very safe to keep running it though. Best to get it fixed. I'd order a new board and then try to fix the old one as a spare. Triac's are cheap. Not to hard to solder them on either. I help you through it if you need some help. You can get the triac's at Digikey, Mousler or Newark. Bet they only cost $2 to $3 bucks a piece.

 

[RiddleMasterMorgon]

Thanks J,

according to the light on the board the auger is still cycling on and off, just in its highest setting equivalent - but of course if the board is fried the light might be suspicious as well. The pellets fall down the chute in chunks, but again that might just be the auger turning and one package sliding over the top at a time - so hard to say.

I have no surge supressor - not to my knowledge anyway. The insert connects to a normal power outlet and that outlet goes into my breaker panel and is alone on one of the breakers. Is the surge supressor the same than one uses for TVs and Computer equipment ?

Very glad to hear such an electronic piece would be cheap to fix - I am tempted to call off the dealer and fix on my own, but then again why do I have this super duper warranty if they weasel themselfs out of it like this....that makes me angry. If I get over my 'what happened to customer service' I will take the board out and make a picture.

 

[jtakeman]

You need to physically look and see if the auger motor is starting and stopping. I would trust the light. Its on the primary side of the circuit and will go on and off. Whats messed up is the secondary side. Betting your control board still goes thru the heat ranges too. But you lost all control of the auger motor. Again not safe to continue running the unit IMHO.

Shut it down, run the back up heat until you get a new board. I'd also recommend a good surge suppressor while you at it. It gives you some insurance and good have saved this board and you a few bucks!

 

[RiddleMasterMorgon]

Here are two pictures of the electric board, the fuse that blew up is in the lower left corner - close to the square transformer brick. Second picture shows the transformer brick from the side. Underneath the transformer is the switch for the feed setting - so I guess this is the suspected faulty part ?

Any help very welcome.

Moving the insert forward I can not visually see if the auger moves or not - I guess I would have to empty the pellets out and cheat the hopper switch to see if the auger moves from the inside - but I somehow think it is turning on and off all the time - just the delay time in doing so is not right - meaning it ignores the feed rate I tell the transformer block. Not sure if that makes sense.

Thanks !

 

[RiddleMasterMorgon]

Hi J,

I tried locating the Triac, but I guess I am not savvy enough for that. I can see the transformer and on the side it has a Relay (from Omron). Stupid question: Does a transformer in combination with a relay do the same than a Triac (you see how bad it is with my electric knowledge) ?

Any idea ?

Thx

 

[jtakeman]

There is a thread on the breckwell board here. It has the same circuitry as your board. See pict for triac location circled in yellow. The bottom left in picture is the auger triac. You might see some scorching or black marks on yours.

 

[stoveguy13]

i have had a few boscas over feed and it was an air supply issue not a control board issue what fixed them was the door gasket may be worth trying

 

[RiddleMasterMorgon]

The door gasket - you mean the seal of the door ? Why would that cause on overfeed of the stove ? Puzzled. What did you do to make it work, I am ready to try about anything since my dealer can only drop by on Wednesday and its the coldest nights since a long time....

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

stoveguy13 is saying the stove isn't overfeeding, it isn't getting the air it needs to burn fast enough.

Test your door gasket and any ash pan gasket while you are at it.

 

[imacman]

.....I have no surge supressor - not to my knowledge anyway.

No offense to the OP, but after being on this forum for over a year, how is it possible you didn't have one on your expensive stove.......and you don't even know if you DO have one????? We stress this with everyone that gets a stove.

Not saying that a surge is what caused the issue w/ your stove, but a blown fuse is a fairly good indicator.

Get a surge protector on the unit, regardless.

 

[RiddleMasterMorgon]

Imacman: Simple, I was not there when they originally installed the thing and never had to remove the insert from the fireplace, which I did just recently. The thing is freaking heavy, but it was worth it since I also found out that they actually did NOT installed an AOK, but charged me one on my initial install bill...well thats another story for later. My dealer certainly never mentioned it would be good to have one. Aside from that, I am afraid I never came across postings with suggestions of surge protectors or if so, I ignored them - 'knowing' that my power supply is very stable. Laugh about my ignorance - I have to live with that since a long time and got used to it

stoveguy13 and smokeythebear: Its not the air supply, of that I am 100 % sure, the pellets are just falling out of the auger at a speed never seen before - so I am very sure something else is wrong with the auger/fan control.

J-takeman: Lots of thanks again, I just gave the board to a friend of mine how knows electronic and asked him to check it out and with little knowledge he pointed out the exact some location on the borad as being suspicious because that exact triac does not measure out as the other four. So, I ordered a bunch of them for end of the week and will have them replaced just in case.

My dealer will drop by on Wednesday, so will see what he suggests to do. My expectation is that they will order a new board to replace the broken one on warranty - but we will see. Will keep you posted.

Thanks all for the input, very helpful and really appreciated !

(and yes, I will have a surge protector soon, every mistake only once)

 

[jtakeman]

Your welcome, Just paying it forward! ;-)

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Riddle Master Morgon, I was just telling you what stoveguy13 was thinking.

We will see if it is the triac and if that is the only thing involved.

Something triggered it and that could be frayed insulation that shorted out because of jostling the stove during fueling. Or hopper switch failure if there is one causing a short. As well as a power surge.

While waiting for the board to come back, I'd spend some time looking over the wiring and connections inside the stove.

 

[RiddleMasterMorgon]

Since this thread is stored and for future reference if anyone hits the same/similar issue again, here is the conclusion of the story:

Dealer came out and checked out the stove, found a cable being routed wrong in the stove (according to him it must have come that way from factory). This cable showed brittle outside and likely caused the short/blown fuse in the first place - insulated the cable and re-routed to avoid that location (somewhere close to moving parts apparently).

Then however admitted that stove still not fixed and board likely fried as well. They wanted to order a new one and warned me that the delivery could take 10-14 days depending. That was a bit much for me, and by the next day my Triac came in, so I replaced the triac J pointed out, et voila the stove works again...

Now comes the irony, the same day the delaer called and the board was already in house. They will come out next Tuesday and swap the boards (I tried to convince them that I can do that and would be fine to save them a trip, but no - Bosca wants to have the old part send back in to investigate and they have to swap it). I told them I fixed the board, which earned some laughter and they are OK with that since they saw the board before - no issue there (they mentioned they never fixed a single component on a board before - weird given how simple this was).

So the end of story:

I do not pay anything for this, between dealer and BOSCA 2 year warranty all is covered (great!).

The whole thing would have taken about 2 weeks total (so-so).

J was dead on with the triac and smokey had it right with the cable causing the whole thing (I think this forum is awesome !) - reducing my downtime to one week (much better).

I found out they never installed the AOK they charged me for (and apparently cant install it, so I will actually get a 75 USD refund out of all of this (not bad)


Overall, I was happy with the dealer performance - although it needed some constant nagging amd waving the warranty around. I am happy with the BOSCA/dealer response, although I was upset that it failed to begin with and I am just happy/lucky I know this forum.

J/smokey - let me know where the six pack goes to

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Glad you are back running no need to attempt a brew delivery.

I'm always leery of triacs going poof and that being the only thing that is bad. Also a lot of board/triac damage is caused by failing blower motors and shorts in wiring from what I've been reading. I goes somewhat like, oh my convection blower stopped, high temp shutdown, reset that funny resettable snap disc, turn the stove back on, repeat several times before you realize the blower is failing and the real cause of the over temp, do this often enough and it may fry the triac that controls it. Same for the combustion blower, the auger, and the igniter. It all depends on the failure mode of the devices connected to the triac. Since the wiring is always in play and the conditions of some it is exposed to and how they seem to run it in the worst possible manner, well you know what I'm yacking about.

I suspect that most board failures are ruined opto-isolaters and triacs, the occasional capacitor, and fuses. Fuses everyone looks for but the devices with the magic blue smoke in them rarely get spotted.