Temporary Solution?

[twistyhair]

Hi -
I have a gently used Appalachian 52 fireplace insert that I would like to install but funds are tight right now. There is an existing 10" insulated steel liner in the masonry chimney. I know that I ultimately need an 8" liner but would like to know if I could use the insert with the existing liner for the rest of this winter. The chimney requires about 30' of liner and is in the center of the house. The chimney was professionally swept at the beginning of November and the fireplace has not been used since then.

What are the risks of using this insert with the existing liner? Thanks so much for your input.

 

[Lumber-Jack]

Providing the liner is in good working order, the only risk might be poor draft, but considering it's an insulated liner, 30 ft tall, and inside the house I would think you might be just fine.

BTW Let us know how it works. Frankly if it works OK for you I would just continue using the 10" liner. I used an exterior, 10" masonry flue on an old wood stove for years with no problems.

 

[BrotherBart]

Is this a chimney liner or is it a pre-fab fireplace chimney?

 

[twistyhair]

Is this a chimney liner or is it a pre-fab fireplace chimney?

It's a chimney liner - not pre-fab.

 

[BrotherBart]

Stove should do fine with that liner. If it is clean and you have good dry wood.

 

[twistyhair]

Stove should do fine with that liner. If it is clean and you have good dry wood.

Would I need to attach something (like an adapter) to the opening of the stove, or just position it in the fireplace opening?

 

[BrotherBart]

That liner has to be securely installed in the flue collar of that stove with a proper stainless steel adapter.

You are starting to scare me here.

 

[twistyhair]

Sorry, I'm scaring myself too
Is this what I need?

http://www.rockfordchimneysupply.com/rockford.php?item=ReducerIncreaserFreeFlow

 

[twistyhair]

Just got off the phone with Rockford. They said that piece wouldn't work in this case. I'm really stuck on how to use the existing 10" liner.

 

[Dustin]

Do you have any pictures of this?

This is really sounding like a pre-fab fireplace (metal box) with a metal chimney...

 

[twistyhair]

Okey dokey - I did my best to show pictures of what I see inside the opening. The flue is not straight up and down. It slants off to the right of the fireplace (as you are facing it).

 

[twistyhair]

My apologies for the big photos ... and for being so ignorant.

 

[Lumber-Jack]

It's really hard to see what we are looking at. Do you have a flash on that camera? The flue looks oval?

 

[bholler]

yeah flue looks oval for sure if I is good luck getting an adapter to fit and you need a good solid airtight connection between the insert and that liner. I am sure it can be done but it wont be easy

 

[Lumber-Jack]

It looks like you are complicated by the fact that the liner is oval, and does not hang down to reach the stove the way liners are suppose to.
What you want to see is something like this.

 

[bholler]

yeah that liner was installed for the fire place not for an insert so it will be had to adapt

 

[twistyhair]

Thanks so much for your help Hearth.com friends. At least now I know to go ahead and get professionals in for this job. I'll update you after I get this girl installed.

 

[rwhite]

Just for my knowledge and future reference I have a question for the more informed... Could you use a 4-5' piece of 8" liner and vent it into the 10" and do something similar to a direct connect installation (assuming an 8" would slide into the 10" and you had a way to seal it)?

 

[bholler]

you could do that yes but I don't see how that is in any way like a direct vent installation. and sealing it is the problem for sure

 

[Lumber-Jack]

What might work would be to get a short piece of 10' liner and bend one end of it oval shaped and screw i,t from the inside, to the oval liner in your chimney so you get a air tight seal, and the other side of the 10" liner you leave round and fasten to a 10"- 8" adapter where the 8" end would connect directly to the stove.
If you hire someone to do it for you I imagine that would be how they would do it.

 

[rwhite]

you could do that yes but I don't see how that is in any way like a direct vent installation. and sealing it is the problem for sure

You are correct. I meant direct vent.

 

[bholler]

no you cant direct vent a wood appliance. I think you would need to get a 10" coupler ovalize it o match your liner slide it in screw or rivet it fast from inside then add a short piece of 10" to get back to round then adapt to 8"

 

[UMainah]

Okey dokey - I did my best to show pictures of what I see inside the opening. The flue is not straight up and down. It slants off to the right of the fireplace (as you are facing it).

View attachment 125983
View attachment 125984

To me these "ovals" look like the light pattern from the beam of a flashlight.
I can't see much of anything, let alone a liner, in these photos.

 

[rwhite]

Just for my knowledge and future reference I have a question for the more informed... Could you use a 4-5' piece of 8" liner and vent it into the 10" and do something similar to a direct connect installation (assuming an 8" would slide into the 10" and you had a way to seal it)?

The middle picture above is what I was refering to. I suppose I did mean similar to a direct connect. Rather than vent an 8" liner into the flue with a block off plate could you vent the liner into a 10" liner? I know it;s not the best method but most manuals do list a direct connection as an option.

 

[bholler]

yes it would work and if you could seal it correctly it would not work that badly but the problem we have been discussing is how to seal it. the direct connect diagram you showed although it is still listed as an acceptable installation method it is not a very good one. that method pretty much just dumps the exhaust gasses into the smoke chamber where it cools quickly has little lift and condenses creating creosote. it that stub can be connected directly to the flue it would be much better not perfect because the flue is still oversized but atleast t would be a sealed system.