Thinking of taking the plunge...

[BrowningBAR]

... and buying new! (Gasp!)

With my ongoing struggles with the Intrepid I am putting serious thought into cutting the crap and buying a new stove and putting it into the Living Room (floor plan is attached).

Here is my list of stoves I am looking at:
Hearthstone Heritage
Father in-law owns one and I like how well it works.

Hearthstone Phoenix
I like the idea of the mix of cast iron and soapstone. Puts out more heat than the Heritage. I am hesitant because I have no experience with one and I believe only one person on this forum owns one.

Hearthstone Mansfield
Concerned about size. Too big?

Woodstock Fireview
The Intrepid has given me concern about my ability to work a Cat stove. Is it the stove? Is it my wood? Is it the Cat? I don't know, but I am not far from not caring. I will continue to try to increase the performance. Either way, the Vigilant is burning the same wood, and I can get that stove into overburn territory easily. And if you saw my previous thread I have tried store bought kiln dried wood with only a bit more success.

Quadra-Fire Isle Royale
I will be seeing one on Saturday. Over-size is a concern, but I love a good size firebox.

The Hearthstones and Quadra-Fire are located at the same dealer, which I have gotten good vibes from so far. They don't seem like a bunch of d-bags which is common around here. The Woodstock would need to be delivered or a spring car trip is in order.

I am also open to any suggestions from you fine, fine wood burning individuals.

 

[Fsappo]

What scale is that drawing? Is the house open to the "spring room"? I have sold the Heritage and the Pheonix over the years. Folks like em both. Always happy. The Heritage has the side loading feature which would make it a hands down winner for me. It also "appears" to be the right size for your house.

 

[BrowningBAR]

What scale is that drawing? Is the house open to the "spring room"? I have sold the Heritage and the Pheonix over the years. Folks like em both. Always happy. The Heritage has the side loading feature which would make it a hands down winner for me. It also "appears" to be the right size for your house.

House is about 2150 square feet farmhouse built in 1741. Kitchen, dining room, bedroom 1, and bedroom 2 have stone walls. Drafty, but slowly getting it under control. Spring room is not open to the house, door is kept close. It contains the furnace, washer, dryer, well pump tank, water tank.

 

[Todd]

That's a tough layout for wood stove heating, I can see why you need 3 stoves. Maybe a wood furnace would be better?

 

[Fsappo]

Your the guy with 2 stoves right. I remember now. I would say you would be THRILLED with the Heritage. Do it within the next couple of weeks. Hearthstone is having a 10% off sale. In fact, go buy it today so you can claim the rebate on your 2010 taxes and get your cheese back faster. Go go go hurry!

 

[BrowningBAR]

Your the guy with 2 stoves right. I remember now. I would say you would be THRILLED with the Heritage. Do it within the next couple of weeks. Hearthstone is having a 10% off sale. In fact, go buy it today so you can claim the rebate on your 2010 taxes and get your cheese back faster. Go go go hurry!

Well, it's more like 1.5 stoves with the way the Intrepid is performing.

What about the Phoenix and the Mansfield? Specifically the Phoenix. It is a bit bigger. What type of difference will I see/feel?

 

[BrowningBAR]

That's a tough layout for wood stove heating, I can see why you need 3 stoves. Maybe a wood furnace would be better?

I thought about the Englander add-on furnace, but I have base board heating and no duct work.

 

[Fsappo]

From my experience, you would need lab equipment to notice a difference between a Pheonix and Heritage. On paper the Phoenix heats a little more, but I cant tell during real life use. Now the Mansfield is a different story. That stove doesnt have the side door, but I can dump a pickup truck full of wood in the front door, north to south. Have you talked to your local Hearthstone dealer? I know most of the guys in PA, I may be able to give you some insight.

 

[BrowningBAR]

From my experience, you would need lab equipment to notice a difference between a Pheonix and Heritage. On paper the Phoenix heats a little more, but I cant tell during real life use. Now the Mansfield is a different story. That stove doesnt have the side door, but I can dump a pickup truck full of wood in the front door, north to south. Have you talked to your local Hearthstone dealer? I know most of the guys in PA, I may be able to give you some insight.

I'd really appreciate any insight you can offer.

I spoke with this dealer:
http://www.hearthstonefireplacepa.com/products.html

They seemed friendly and had, what appeared to be, a good understanding of their product. I haven't been there, but they supposedly have a decent amount of models on the showroom floor.

That location is an hour north of me (which is fine), I haven't found any other dealers near me in the Bucks Count PA area.

 

[Fsappo]

Never heard of those guys. You close to Hatfield? If you are, try these guys

http://www.thewoodburners.com/

May be a little closer for you. Then you have 2 shops to compare prices with

 

[BrowningBAR]

Never heard of those guys. You close to Hatfield? If you are, try these guys

http://www.thewoodburners.com/

May be a little closer for you. Then you have 2 shops to compare prices with

Thanks. They are about half the distance to me as the other place (20-30 minutes vs. 50-ish minutes). Is there anything I should be aware of in terms of price? Is the dealer stuck with a certain price range they can play with?

 

[Fsappo]

The Heritage in Flat Black retails for $2829, the Mansfield $3149 add a few hundred for the enamel. 10% off sale from Hearthstone till mid Jan I think. Some dealers may add shipping if they need to order a stove in (about 75-100 bucks) or some may be willing to take a little extra off if they are overstocked on a particular item. For example, we have 6 Clydesdales in stock, the older style, we're doing 20% off of those instead of 10%, because of our inventory.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Thinking about just moving up to a Mansfield. Found a place within driving distance that is selling a Mansfield for $1500. It is going against my idea of buying new, but I am thinking I can't pass this up.

 

[Fsappo]

New Mansfield is $2800 or so with the 10% off sale. Then you get the tax credit which brings it down to $1983. Brand new stove with a new warranty, if you can lay out the money and wait a year or so for the rebate

 

[SolarAndWood]

The Intrepid has given me concern about my ability to work a Cat stove. Is it the stove? Is it my wood? Is it the Cat? I don't know, but I am not far from not caring.

I was in the same position with my VC. I am happy that I stuck with cat technology. Incidentally, it wasn't the wood.

 

[cycloxer]

Of that list my vote is for the Quadra-Fire Isle Royale. It is the biggest, best-burning, easiest stove to operate. Quadra-Fire also makes a very high quality stove.

 

[BrowningBAR]

The Intrepid has given me concern about my ability to work a Cat stove. Is it the stove? Is it my wood? Is it the Cat? I don't know, but I am not far from not caring.

I was in the same position with my VC. I am happy that I stuck with cat technology. Incidentally, it wasn't the wood.

I wish I could say that was good to hear...

 

[larryhollenb]

Just some experienced findings here. I joined the craze for updated EPA stoves filled with glowing reports of how clean they were and well designed. Well as someone who could still recall the days of pre EPA stoves I found that after purchasing two very expensive stoves, one a Jotul and one a Morso, neither slackers in the ratings scale, that I kept thinking how much heat I could recall my older stoves producing. People kept trying to convince me that I just didn't know how to run the stoves or had the wrong wood, ect. Baloney. After a few months with one of those and the rest of a winter with the other I sold them both. Over 4,000 down the drain for the most part. I was lucky to recoup a third of what I paid. Now I have a Oakland Circulator from most likely the early 50's, a manual operation stove. it does a wonderful job, cleanest stove pipe I have ever had after a full season of heating, and always fast heat and reliable burn. Were having zero weather here in the midwest and my small home is 20 degrees warmer than with the others.
I realize that not everyone is going to find a really fine old stove. This one looks like it came out of the factory yesterday. The owners evidently purchased it and never used it more than a season getting perhaps gas heat? At any rate its the happiest I have been with a stove and not something I had to constantly baby like the new ones. If you think about it, any stove that says you can put it a few inches from the wall has to be wasting a lot of potential heating surface. The Oakland will sit 15 inches from the side wall, but due to the wide inner air space between the jacket and the firebox, the wall remains barely warm with the hottest of fires. I would think long an hard about buying a new stove, most of the hype is very over rated.

 

[cycloxer]

I would think long an hard about buying a new stove, most of the hype is very over rated.

I cry baloney on that one dude. There are like a bazillion burners on here who have used both stoves and I have never heard this one. Anyone who can do math and read a spec sheet understands that the new stoves produce far more Btu's of heat for the quantity of wood burned. There is nothing wrong with the older stoves other than that they are less efficient and not as clean burning as their modern day counterparts. There is simply no comparison.

 

[SolarAndWood]

The Intrepid has given me concern about my ability to work a Cat stove. Is it the stove? Is it my wood? Is it the Cat? I don't know, but I am not far from not caring.

I was in the same position with my VC. I am happy that I stuck with cat technology. Incidentally, it wasn't the wood.

I wish I could say that was good to hear...

My apologies. Do you have enough room in the spring room for a wood boiler? That would probably get you to one fire and even heat through the house using your existing baseboards. Maybe even get dhw out of the deal.

 

[larryhollenb]

I would think long an hard about buying a new stove, most of the hype is very over rated.

I cry baloney on that one dude. There are like a bazillion burners on here who have used both stoves and I have never heard this one. Anyone who can do math and read a spec sheet understands that the new stoves produce far more Btu's of heat for the quantity of wood burned. There is nothing wrong with the older stoves other than that they are less efficient and not as clean burning as their modern day counterparts. There is simply no comparison.

Everyone has an opinion that is just fine. I just have my life experience and there are many flaws in the new stove design. For one thing when it comes to heat, I was burning up nearly the same amount of wood, but the house was not warm. Why would I be saving if what I am burning is not heating my house? I see constant reports from people on these types of sites about how disappointed there stove is when it comes to heating. I am not alone. And if you read my report on the 118 it had three times more creosote left in my stove pipe after three months than my old one had after the whole season, in fact nearly none. So both those points are wishful thinking in my book. My stove may be old, it may be outdated, but it does heat well, it does not smoke other than on firing up when all stoves smoke, the proof was in the chimney in my book. (I think I just made a comparison).

 

[BrowningBAR]

The Intrepid has given me concern about my ability to work a Cat stove. Is it the stove? Is it my wood? Is it the Cat? I don't know, but I am not far from not caring.

I was in the same position with my VC. I am happy that I stuck with cat technology. Incidentally, it wasn't the wood.

I wish I could say that was good to hear...

My apologies. Do you have enough room in the spring room for a wood boiler? That would probably get you to one fire and even heat through the house using your existing baseboards. Maybe even get dhw out of the deal.

Oh no, nothing to apologize about. I am just disappointed in the Intrepid. Very disappointed.

I've thought about wood boilers, but two things I've noticed:

1. My base board heating never seems to warm up the place like a wood stove does. I could run my base boards for days and I would never be able to get a room it as warm as I could with a stove.
2. A wood boiler just doesn't have the same appeal to me, which may sound dumb. I enjoy the look of a nice wood stove. I enjoy fiddling with them (to a certain degree). I like the concept of wood stove more than a boiler. This may change over time as I get older.

 

[BrowningBAR]

Just some experienced findings here. I joined the craze for updated EPA stoves filled with glowing reports of how clean they were and well designed. Well as someone who could still recall the days of pre EPA stoves I found that after purchasing two very expensive stoves, one a Jotul and one a Morso, neither slackers in the ratings scale, that I kept thinking how much heat I could recall my older stoves producing. People kept trying to convince me that I just didn't know how to run the stoves or had the wrong wood, ect. Baloney. After a few months with one of those and the rest of a winter with the other I sold them both. Over 4,000 down the drain for the most part. I was lucky to recoup a third of what I paid. Now I have a Oakland Circulator from most likely the early 50's, a manual operation stove. it does a wonderful job, cleanest stove pipe I have ever had after a full season of heating, and always fast heat and reliable burn. Were having zero weather here in the midwest and my small home is 20 degrees warmer than with the others.
I realize that not everyone is going to find a really fine old stove. This one looks like it came out of the factory yesterday. The owners evidently purchased it and never used it more than a season getting perhaps gas heat? At any rate its the happiest I have been with a stove and not something I had to constantly baby like the new ones. If you think about it, any stove that says you can put it a few inches from the wall has to be wasting a lot of potential heating surface. The Oakland will sit 15 inches from the side wall, but due to the wide inner air space between the jacket and the firebox, the wall remains barely warm with the hottest of fires. I would think long an hard about buying a new stove, most of the hype is very over rated.

I understand your line of thinking, but I will disagree. I have an old pre-EPA Vigilant that is a fantastic source of heat, but, it burns through a lot more wood than a Heathstone Heritage (equal BTU rating) that I have used and I also have to pay far more attention to the stove when running it as the temps swing quite a bit. My neighbor's Fireview and my father in-law's Hearthstone Heritage (both of which I have used quite a lot) can hold consistent temps for long periods of time without nearly as much attention. Both, my neighbor and my father in-law, live in homes that are roughly the same age as mine (1740s) and made of the same materials (field stone) and both of those stoves throw equal, if not more, heat than the Vigilant.

I have also used an Intrepid Cat model previously that was far better at throwing heat than the one I own.

The Mansfield will heat a lot more area than the Vigilant, will use less wood, and I won't have to monitor it as much as the Vigilant (which I will still be using at the other end of the house.

 

[SolarAndWood]

The Intrepid has given me concern about my ability to work a Cat stove. Is it the stove? Is it my wood? Is it the Cat? I don't know, but I am not far from not caring.

I was in the same position with my VC. I am happy that I stuck with cat technology. Incidentally, it wasn't the wood.

I wish I could say that was good to hear...

My apologies. Do you have enough room in the spring room for a wood boiler? That would probably get you to one fire and even heat through the house using your existing baseboards. Maybe even get dhw out of the deal.

Oh no, nothing to apologize about. I am just disappointed in the Intrepid. Very disappointed.

I've thought about wood boilers, but two things I've noticed:

1. My base board heating never seems to warm up the place like a wood stove does. I could run my base boards for days and I would never be able to get a room it as warm as I could with a stove.
2. A wood boiler just doesn't have the same appeal to me, which may sound dumb. I enjoy the look of a nice wood stove. I enjoy fiddling with them (to a certain degree). I like the concept of wood stove more than a boiler. This may change over time as I get older.

Sounds like the baseboards are undersized? Maybe a couple strategically cast iron radiators would help? BTW, doesn't sound dumb at all. When we are up at camp, I can't imagine using a boiler over the stove.

 

[begreen]

Your the guy with 2 stoves right. I remember now. I would say you would be THRILLED with the Heritage. Do it within the next couple of weeks. Hearthstone is having a 10% off sale. In fact, go buy it today so you can claim the rebate on your 2010 taxes and get your cheese back faster. Go go go hurry!

Well, it's more like 1.5 stoves with the way the Intrepid is performing.

What about the Phoenix and the Mansfield? Specifically the Phoenix. It is a bit bigger. What type of difference will I see/feel?

I'd get the Mansfield. It should cover the area well enough to remove the Intrepid and forget about it or put in a cooktop stove like the little Napoleon.

Not on the list, though I can also recommend it, is the big PE Alderlea T6. It won't drive you out of the room unless you let it. This is a very flexible. simple and easy to run stove.