Timberline Sharpener - Technique Help Please

[jwoair23]

Hi All,

So I am trying to get the hang of the timberline sharpener that was gifted to me by a member of this forum (see other thread), and I am having a bit of trouble!

If you could look at the picture below, you will probably see what I am talking about. Notice how one tooth has a longer hook than the other? That tooth with the longer hook is also about 1.5 cm longer.

Why is this happening? I slowly went down on both sides, the ironic part is the side with the longer hook was the side that took me a couple passes before I could get both sides to sharpen at the same time at the same length.

Do you think the picture looks normal, or do I need to do something different?

 

[DexterDay]

How bad were the chains before sharpening? If done with a Grinder? It may take a bit.. Cutting more off the side that needs it 1st.. Then do the whole chain.

Also make sure to tighten both clamps with pliers. And also make sure the carbide is coming into full contact with the cutter. If you try amd take to much at once, it will nove the base and mess up the whole operation.

It takes some time to learn. Others will be along with tips

 

[jwoair23]

I was taking it to a Stihl dealer before who uses a grinder, no clue on their skill level unfortunately. The side with the longer hook took me about 2-3 passes before I could start cutting on both sides, now I am at the point where I set it, and can sharpen both sides without adjusting the stop.

I tightened the clamps with pliers, I am doing my best to make sure it is seated in the cutter right, I think it is?

I didnt get a chance to cut wood with it today, I am going to tomorrow, maybe it will be awesome as is? I don't know if the slight difference will be enough to matter, or if this is normal? It just seems like it naturally puts a longer hook on one side than the other for some reason?

 

[Nixon]

I was taking it to a Stihl dealer before who uses a grinder, no clue on their skill level unfortunately. The side with the longer hook took me about 2-3 passes before I could start cutting on both sides, now I am at the point where I set it, and can sharpen both sides without adjusting the stop.

I tightened the clamps with pliers, I am doing my best to make sure it is seated in the cutter right, I think it is?

I didnt get a chance to cut wood with it today, I am going to tomorrow, maybe it will be awesome as is? I don't know if the slight difference will be enough to matter, or if this is normal? It just seems like it naturally puts a longer hook on one side than the other for some reason?

Just an opinion here , so take it for face value . Get a new chain and learn to use your Timberline from there. It's a great tool but won't do miracles . The chain you pictured looks like it was butchered before it met the Timberline .

 

[jwoair23]

Nixon, and believe me you won't offend me because I didnt sharpen it ever before this, what about the chain makes it look like it was butchered? I would honestly like to know, I am trying to learn about sharpening and am very much a beginner.

 

[ScotO]

Like Dexter said, it's gonna need more taken off of the one side than it is the other. But, that being said, that chain will still cut wood, probably fairly well, too. Just not as good as it should, because half of the cutters are shorter than the others. And as Dexter said, you have had that chain sharpened before with a grinder, so it's gonna take a couple of passes to get the carbide bit of the Timberline to seat into the cutter on the chain. Use a drop of machine oil on the cutting end of the carbide, sporadically on every other cutter or so. That will do two things......it will help the carbide cut a little faster, and it will help the carbide last a lot longer.

 

[Nixon]

Nixon, and believe me you won't offend me because I didnt sharpen it ever before this, what about the chain makes it look like it was butchered? I would honestly like to know, I am trying to learn about sharpening and am very much a beginner.

To my old and tired eyes the rakers seem all wrong , and the angle of the teeth seems different as well . Like I said ,old eyes , could be wrong . Get a new chain ,learn to set up the sharpener on it , the go back and sort out the old chain . While your at it, buy a guage and file to set your rakers .

 

[ScotO]

To my old and tired eyes the rakers seem all wrong , and the angle of the teeth seems different as well . Like I said ,old eyes , could be wrong . Get a new chain ,learn to set up the sharpener on it , the go back and sort out the old chain . While your at it, buy a guage and file to set your rakers .

I agree about the rakers, they are sloped in the wrong direction, and I looked at them again, they are really low in relation to the chisel. You only want your raker slightly lower than the chisel, it looks as though the rakers are really low. Leave them be, but continue working on the chisel cutters. That chain has some life left in it, but it's gonna need some work.

 

[DexterDay]

That chain could be salvaged. Absolutely. But. As Nixon said, it may be best to start with a new chain. That way the carbide fits like a glove. You should be able to see the carbide, rest along the entire interior cutting surface, from top to bottom..... It should be touching around the "Moon Face" (what I call it).

Also, its important to watch the video that Scotty posted in the other thread (about set-up). It shows how to properly set up both cutters.

It takes a little time and practice. Its gonna be worth your while to be patient. Thats an extremely good tool to have. In the right hands, it can make a factory edge, Cry .

 

[thewoodlands]

Nixon, and believe me you won't offend me because I didnt sharpen it ever before this, what about the chain makes it look like it was butchered? I would honestly like to know, I am trying to learn about sharpening and am very much a beginner.

Get some calipers so you can get those cutters the same length.
http://www.amazon.com/Inch-Digital-..._2?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1343351704&sr=1-2
zap

 

[jwoair23]

OK guys, since my last post I have been working on the chain some more. I just ignored the one side that was shorter, and worked on the longer side. I have them both down to 5 cm now. (Zap those caliper would make measuring much easier, I'll get some).

I can't do much about the rakers since they are too low (thanks Stihl dealer!) but I think I have the lengths and angle better now. I think the first picture had a longer hook on one side just because it was longer.

So two questions:

Besides the rakers, does this look better?
How much life is left in this chain at this point? lol, I feel like I took half of it off

 

[amateur cutter]

That's better, next sharpening you might set the carbide just a touch lower to get a little more hook. By the looks of the rakers that's gonna be a grabby rough chain to use, but it should cut all right. As far as chain life, you can sharpen all the way back to the laser etched marks on the cutters. I usually run mine till they start losing teeth, the cut faster once those cutters get shorter. A C

 

[jwoair23]

Wow amateur cutter, yet another thing I learned today, I had no idea those marks were there! That makes me feel a lot better, I've got a good bit left than to that mark.

How do you lower the carbide to make more of a hook? It seems as though it can only sit in there one way, is there a way to keep it lower?

Also, exactly how should the rakers look? From what I understand reading the replies, they should be higher and sloped the opposite way than they are, is that correct?


Thanks so much for all the advice guys, I'm learning quite a bit here.

 

[DexterDay]

Try and round the rakers out. Dont take anymore off the top, but round the leading edge...

That chain is gonna "grab" like a Mother with rakers like that. (Some dealers just dont know/ or they pay a teenager $9 an hr to sharpen chains).

Some chains even come with a "end mark" on the raker / end of life. Just like the guide angles on the cutters... Some chains dont do have them, but Stihls do.

I would look into getting that saw set-up w/ 3/8" chain and a 16" bar. The Muffler mod and a light tune, will open that 290 up a bit. A .325 chain does get the job done, but a 3/8" w/ 16" will cut faster and have fewer cutters to sharpen..

Again, just my 2 pennies. But I have a problem with buying saws, so dont listen to what I say

 

[Nixon]

Jw, take a look at this site ..... Www.madsens1.com takes a bit of searching ,but there's tons of good info there.

 

[jwoair23]

Nixon, thanks a million! I was searching on google for something like that which explains things in detail like that. The site looks like a gold mine of information, I appreciate it.

 

[amateur cutter]

JW, not sure how to lower the carbide having never used that sharpener. If it's like others I've seen, you lower the whole body of the sharpener down on the bar. Also, Dexter is right on with the 16"X3/8 chain set up & muffler mod. You'll think you moved up a saw size doing that. As for the rakers, take a look @ a new Stihl RSC chain, & try to mimic the raker profile. As for height, I use a straight edge, & feeler gauges to set raker height. I like a faster cutting chain, so I go a little lower than specs, but a little goes a long way with the rakers. A C

Edit: Dexter really does have a problem buying saws, mainly that he's gettin some good deals that I'm missing out on up here, & he's afraid of getting them dirty.

 

[DexterDay]

JW, not sure how to lower the carbide having never used that sharpener. If it's like others I've seen, you lower the whole body of the sharpener down on the bar. Also, Dexter is right on with the 16"X3/8 chain set up & muffler mod. You'll think you moved up a saw size doing that. As for the rakers, take a look @ a new Stihl RSC chain, & try to mimic the raker profile. As for height, I use a straight edge, & feeler gauges to set raker height. I like a faster cutting chain, so I go a little lower than specs, but a little goes a long way with the rakers. A C

Edit: Dexter really does have a problem buying saws, mainly that he's gettin some good deals that I'm missing out on up here, & he's afraid of getting them dirty.

Yep..... On everything.

Here is my most recent thread on another Pro Saw. Click link - Makita 6401 Used Price?

 

[smokinj]

Hope this explains it. Your chain flat rakers and the part of the cutter that cuts is not touch.
(Your chain the longer the bar the rougher its going to ride)

 

[jwoair23]

Hey guys, so I got a chance to try out the saw for the first time since sharpening. I went ahead and sharpened my other chain as well, the one that had been hit by a nail, and did some cutting with that chain. I figured that would be the acid test, if it can repair/resharpen a chain that hit a nail, I would be thrilled!

HOLY MOLY. I have never had a chain cut like it did today. I tried both bucking and noodling, and it was just ridiculously sharp. The bucking was throwing out huge square chips with no dust, and the noodling was pulling perfect long noodles out.

Needless to say, I am really happy. I know I have some work to do in order to get my chains to the level you guys sharpen them too, but its incredibly how well it cut today, it was just pulling right through the wood. It shows me what a crappy job my dealer was doing sharpening them.

Also, I discovered what my problem is as far as the two sides not sharpening to the same length. My pawl has been bored through somehow by the carbide, which makes one side not be pushed up as far as the other when the tooth of the chain hits it. I am going to contact Timberline and see if I can get a new one, I had read a post over on arborist site where someone replaced it.

All in all, I am getting happier with it the more I use it and get used to it, and it is sure is cutting terrific!

 

[jwoair23]

Update: Wow what incredible customer service, Phil is sending me out a new pawl on Monday. He responded minutes after I sent that, on a Saturday!

 

[DexterDay]

Update: Wow what incredible customer service, Phil is sending me out a new pawl on Monday. He responded minutes after I sent that, on a Saturday!

Nice......

 

[amateur cutter]

Nice job on being patient & diligent, that's the best way to learn. Now you know what a sharp chain is like, you'll recognize a dull or poorly sharpened one right away & be able to fix it.
Sounds like the customer service @ Timberline is top notch as well. May have to look into one of those little gizmos. A C

 

[Realstone]

All in all, I am getting happier with it the more I use it and get used to it, and it is sure is cutting terrific!

Wait til a few more uses/sharpenings when the bit & tooth have gotten to know each other more intimately and are well mated.

BTW, did you notice that some teeth sharpen more/less than others? I'm still on that curve.

 

[jwoair23]

The only thing I noticed different between some teeth was that some still had a small section not gleaming, but I think those were teeth that got the most damaged on the nail. I could've taken them all down more to get rid of it but I was satisfied at that point, and I would've had to take a lot more off.

What were you seeing different between certain teeth?