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VC Defiant Encore model 2190 Long thread! Pics Dutchwest re-install!

Post in 'The Hearth Room - Wood Stoves and Fireplaces' started by VCBurner, Jan 20, 2011.

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  1. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    Yeah, the DW is a beast! It heats like one too! All cast iron and the refractory sits on top of the fire so nothing can touch it. I don't know how they got the Encore to heat that much with such little weight compared to most mid sized cast iron stoves. I also don't understand how they gained that much weight with the new Encores in the same body?

    Looks like I won't have time today to install the Encore, but I'll get to it sometime this week, hopefully tomorrow. But who knows, after a long weekend and a Monday at work, building an addition to an elementary school. I may not have enough energy to get that thing in the house. Plus, we are supposed to get some more snow, so I'm sure to have some snow removal to do around here. But I can't wait to fire it up!

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  2. BrowningBAR

    BrowningBAR Minister of Fire

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    Yes, the new Encore ways over 121lbs more than the old Encore. The new Defiant weighs in at 518lbs, 38 lbs more than the old Defiant.
  3. greenbrierwv

    greenbrierwv Member

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    i have an older 2190. it is a very good stove and burns forever with a load of good oak. one key thing to do with this stove that i have learned is CLEAN YOUR CAT. This is probably the most important thing you can do. after cleaning it runs like a champ and it always amazes me. by the way, this stove is not hard to run at all, not sure where that is coming from. if you have dry wood you will have this thing pegged within a couple of weeks. one thing with this stove it likes to produce heat and lots of it. i have a 2500sqft house and during these warmer (50day/30night) it will heat the whole house day and night, of course i also have a couple solar heaters supplementing. but a great stove all around and you will like it. mine is actually due a rebuild after this burning season so we shall see how that goes.
  4. raybonz

    raybonz Minister of Fire

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    Hey Chris congrats on your new stove! Look forward to the pics and your experiences with it.. As for the lighter weight I think it will be lighter as it is not a convection stove.. Convection stoves as you know are a cast iron box in a box so lots more cast iron.. So you end up with an extra inner top, inner bottom and inner back...

    Ray
  5. certified106

    certified106 Minister of Fire

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    Congrats on the stove can't wait to see the pictures when it is in it's new home! Also looking forward to reading about your experiences, likes, and dislikes. We are also looking for a new stove before next year and I'm curious to see if you miss the convection of the Dutchwest as I can't imagine a stove without convection.
  6. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    Thanks gbwv,

    I'll add your comments to the plus column of the Encore's +/- tally. I must have a death wish, operating the DW and the Encore in the same house! :vampire: Two of the most notorious stoves around here. People seem to have a love/hate relationship with them and VC in general. I couldn't be happier with my stove situation. The Encore has yet to be tested here, but I have an inkling it will do just fine. I will make sure to keep it clean, as I feel this is the biggest culprit in ruinning the inside of these Encores (researching these has lead me to this conclusion.) By the time we are done with all the remodeling we'll have about 2000 sq ft to heat.
  7. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    Thanks Ray,
    You're totally right about the extra weight on the DW's wth all those double walls. Man, are they heavy! I'll make sure to post pics as soon as it makes its way into the house. A side by side shot of the Dw and Encore will surely be posted. Maybe the legs will come alive and walk themselves right into the house from the garage. Wouldn't that be nice! :p
  8. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    Thanks certified,

    I can't wait to run this thing. I will make sure to post as much as possible about the Encore. Now that I'm back to work full time it'll be a little less than I would like. I will not take the Dw completely out of the equation, though. However, for the rest of the season, the Encore will be in the living room, as this will be the easiest way to learn how to operate it. This means that the DW will be in the basement, and will warm up the room while I do the remodeling project. Next heating season will depend on how the Encore performs. My goal would be to have the stronger of the two downstairs and have it do most of the heating from down there. The Encore should be the stronger of the two according to the numbers. The shoulder season, I will certainly be able to heat the whole 2000 sq ft with the Encore or with the Dw for that matter. During the really cold winter, the Dw will most likely be adding to the mix from the living room I'd immagine. My goal for the coldest days is to have the heat from the living room stove heat the kitchen, dining room and one bedroom as well. The basement stove, I hope will heat the two bedrooms on that side of the house as well as the 750 sq ft finished part of the basement.
  9. raybonz

    raybonz Minister of Fire

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    I hear ya on the weight thing man they should have put wheels on these stoves lol.. I dreaded moving the stove to take the stove pipe off! I now have a slip pipe so it can be taken off without moving the stove.. Yay! Guess it's time for you to start a new diary thread for your new stove eh? You have one advantage and that is you have info from others experiences with that stove so you know what works and what doesn't..

    Good Luck!
    Ray
  10. raybonz

    raybonz Minister of Fire

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    Chris I would be sure to keep a heavy pot of water on top the DW if you're running with the boys downstairs.. Man those cooktops get insanely hot as you know! Mine reads around 800+ degrees surface temp with the IR gun! My concern would be something being thrown onto the stove or placed etc.. When I used to smoke in the house I would light my cigarette off the cooktop or the window glass lol.. The cooktops on these stoves are great for adding moisture to your home with those intense temps..

    Ray
  11. certified106

    certified106 Minister of Fire

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    Soooo did you get the stove in yet? :)
  12. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    Nope! I'm in here reading other people's posts instead! :lol:
    But another important factor is the really small pile of wood that is not cut or split outside. There are a few huge knotty logs out there that are cut but not split. I was not ready with mt wood supply this year and am paying for it now! The furnace is now heating the house and has been since last saturday! I'm thinking of buying some bio bricks to last the remaider of the heating season. If they are as good as they are supposed to be a ton should suffice. We got another 100 gallons of oil last week, for $3.30/gal. This was three months too early, as compared to last year. I had 5.5 cords ready last year. This year not even 3. But I will get the stove in here this weekend.

    I also just got back on the job and it has been tough! Yesterday was really cold, lows in the single digits and with a lake wind sweeping through the job, I thought I was going to freeze while on a boom lift in the AM. So I went out after work and got two brand new pairs of boots (one winter and one summer) and more Merino whool socks! Boots are expensive! $135 for the cold ones and $100 for the warm season boots. :sick:
    I have to bring my son to soccer at 11 am so maybe a little stove install before then! It'll be my only free time this weekend, as I am blue boarding and plastering a Kitchen ceiling and hallway Sat. eve. and sunday! When it rains it pours! But money talks I guess. I'll use some of this $ to buy some bio bricks to burn in my new stove!

    Thanks for the question!

    Chris
  13. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    OK, here I am again, playing around on Hearth.com. The encore sat all day in the garage again. I really had no time this morning, as we had to leave at 10 to get to soccer on time and getting the boys ready was my main concern in the AM. Later this afternoon, the wife and I put a new crib together for our little boy who's due in May! The side job got cancelled because the guy's furnace quit on him, so now he has to pay to get it fixed so the job will be delayed. This means that I will have time to set the stove up after all. Tomorrow's the day, I'll be taking lots of pics and can't wait to fire the thing up. I can't stand the cold in here. The heat is set on 68 and it feels like a refrigerator. If the stove was going it would be at least in the mid 70's. It will be again tomorrow.

    I'm sorry to post again with no news of the stove, I just wanted to share my angst
  14. Wyld Bill

    Wyld Bill New Member

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    THis is funny to me. I used to belong to a VERY active on-line off road 4x4 forum. When I say "active" I mean,...on-line discussions were very active. I'd say about 3/4 of the people on there just spent years, thousands of hours, "talking" about what they were going to build or "talking" about actually going wheeling. Pretty funny.
    There comes a time to stop researching, stop talking about it, stop taking pictures to post on-line, & just GO DO IT!!!
  15. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    :lol: I'm with you Bill! Going right now, after a couple hours of surfing the web on hearth-related stuff! :red:
  16. raybonz

    raybonz Minister of Fire

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    Haven't seen a pic so it's all heresay and conjecture at this point.. :) Still waiting for Chris to prove he really did buy that new blue enamel stove so until this happens I'd say Chris and Mars have not bought a stove..

    Ray
  17. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    :lol: Here it is! All the parts are still off of it and I just moved it from the garage into the house. The griddle, fireback, flue collar, ash pan, grate, refractory hood and handles are still off! I was able to move it into the house by myself strapped to the handtruck. Used some planks to get it up the two steps into the breezeway then a piece of plywood to get it up the step into the kitchen! Now I have to clean it and wipe off any moisture that is on it from being transferred from a cold garage into the house.

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  18. Diabel

    Diabel Minister of Fire

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    Nice! Is this where the encore is going?
  19. raybonz

    raybonz Minister of Fire

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    OK OK you're off the hook for now Chris! :cheese:

    Frankly I like the Dutchwest better and I feel it'll throw the heat better.. But hey that's just my opinion.. I worked 6.5 hrs. today and haven't been on much.. You're more educated now so you'll better know how to avoid some of the pitfalls of the new VC.. Hope it all works out for you my friend!

    Ray

    P.S. Thanx for the pic! :)
  20. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    Yes it is, for now! I don't know where its permanent home will be. I had envisioned putting it in the basement once it is finished. But I guess I'll play it by year. Once it is in the livingroom I may not want it to go away. Then again it all depends on how it performs. The good thing about having it downstairs is that it would probably be able to heat the entire house better than the DW. If the numbers are correct! Then I can save the DW for whenever I want to be warmer in the livingroom, like the daytime, when the boys will be at school and nobody is in the basement! Another benefit of having it upstairs for now is i don't have to keep going downstairs to learn how to operate it. I want to know all the ins and outs before it goes down there. Thanks you again for the great moving tips! It helped a ton!
  21. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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  22. Diabel

    Diabel Minister of Fire

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    Are you extending the hearth at all? As for tips....we should all thank this place!!
  23. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    I hear you there! There is a black slate extention in the works. I have the slate already, just have to cut it, cut out the wood floor and replace it with 1/2" cemment board and the black slate!

    Sorry I didn't respond earlier, but I had a lot of work to do with the stove. I took the insides all appart and cleaned the whole thing, checking the refractory box and cat as well as other parts for any cracks or warpage. I'm pleased to say that the interior of the stove is impecable. The previous owner said he had replaced the refractory assembly once. I was sort of disappointed to see that the cat was cracked and warped, but I knew I may have to be replaced after I bought the stove. According to the previous owner it was 6 years old. But it looked really beat up for it to be that age. Everything was pretty simple to take appart. The thing that was by far the hardest, was taking the damper assembly off and putting it back in. Next time I'll make a jig to support the weight of the damper assembly while I take off and later re attach the bolts that go through the back of the strove and hold the heavy cast iron assembly. All the little nooks were vaccumed out and the cat was cleaned as best as could be. The stove is 90% clean and looks really great! I just have to dust off the little details that gather dust and are tough to clean on the exterior. There are only a few minor cracks on the enamel, nothing that can't be touched up with some paint from VC. This is a beautiful looking stove and I am happy to finally have it in the house. It'll have a chance to get acclamated with the indoor temps for the night and get rid of any moisture it may have acquired in the garage. I will fire it up this week with some break-in fires to reheat and take moisture out of the seams before a real fire is started.

    Here are some more pics:
    1. My little guy Max was hard at work wiping the dust off the stove!
    2.The stove with all the parts that were taken out during the travel, this also represents the closest to the real color of the stove. It looks more Navy than the brighter blue the flash makes it appear!
    3.Inside without the insides!
    4.The cat is pretty banged up! Time to start looking around for one at a good price, I guess!
    5.Inside the firebox with all the parts back in it. This picture makes all the dust on it really stick out. It had some ash all over it from having taken out all of the insides. Dusty and messy situation. All that stuff that looks like rust in the nooks and cranies is just dust. I already dusted off a lot of it, but it's hard to get at those inside corners. Again, the flash makes the dust really stick out like a sore thumb!
    6.Here's where it'll spend the night untill I hook it to the chimney in place of the DW.

    It was really tough to take that damper assembly off without something to support it while you try to unscrew from the outside. Even tougher to put it back in. Next time I'll have a little box built up to sit perfectly under it and put it at the right height without having to hold it by hand and try to line up the bolts from the outside.

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  24. raybonz

    raybonz Minister of Fire

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    Chris your stove looks like it is in good shape! Too bad about the cat that thing is toast! Unfortunately that's a 200 dollar item.. Ouch! I will consider cat cost a factor in my stove buying decision for sure as that cat cost double what my cat costs.. A major factor in my mind.. If you think about it stove costs aren't all that bad compared to what we spend for the wood that we burn.. I will end up buying 3 cords and just talked to my wood guy and he will hold the price of $185.00 per cord (a good deal in this area).. He told me the fuel costs were killing him and I believe that and he has gone up to $225.00 a cord but kept my price at $185.00! I think that many like me have to buy wood and I feel it is worth the money to buy it c/s/d.... Thanx for the great pics!

    Ray
  25. VCBurner

    VCBurner Minister of Fire

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    Yeah, I'm bummed about the cat myself. I was thinking of putting the stove in today and as I removed the DW from the fireplace and looked up the flue I saw more creosote build up than I'm comfortable having. So, I'd say it's a good time to clean up the chimney tomorrow. While the stove is out, I'll be able to get at the smoke chamber and get all the build up out of there. I also realized that the whole in the block off plate is too far forward. It should be back about four more inches. These are all things I've come to realize as a result of moving the stove out today. I must say I'm really surprised at how much creosote deposit is in the chimney compared to when I installed the DW. There was way more build up from November 30th to March 7th this year with the DW than the last two years combined with the box stove in the same location. I guess this is probably due to the cooler flue temperatures the DW gives off with the cat engaged. The old cast iron box didn't even have any baffles or dampers. A lot of the heat went up the flue. This probably allowed it to condensate less in the flue. But you can't compare the heat I got from the DW to the old box. It's like night and day. The DW heated the entire house all winter by itself, even with below zero temps outside.

    Now that I think about it, the best thing to do would be to put off installation of the Encore. I have a brand new cat in the DW. It just doesn't make sense to put the Encore in with that old broken up cat. As curious as I am to burn the thing, it just doesn't make sense.

    So for now, this will be my last post on the Encore, at least until I get a cat for it. This may only come in the fall or late summer.

    I will go back to heating with my DW and its brand new cat, after cleaning the chimney and adjusting the block off plate.
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